By Ritchie Hardin (62.254.0.6 - 62.254.0.6) on Thursday, February 14, 2002 - 10:11 pm:

Anybody feel like helping solve a mystery..? For over a year I've had a 3 CD collection of reportedly rare and/or unissued tracks. Unfortunately, the original source (not my source)would not or could not supply the artist names, so there are gaps. I wonder if anybody has any clues as to the missing names. Here's the listing, with some names filled in but others blank, apart from the "clues" he supplied.

RARE SOUL FROM THE VAULTS Vol.1

1. LONELY PEOPLE CAN'T AFFORD TO CRY - Clyde McPhatter / NY
2. GIRLS ARE OUT TO GET YOU - Fascinations rhythm track / Chicago
3. CRAZY BABY - F grp / Chicago
4. FASCINATING GIRL - George Lemmons rhythm track / Detroit
5. COME AND GRIT - M grp / Philadelphia
6. TELL ME WHERE I STAND - M solo / Chicago
7. THE RIGHT TRACK - Jerry Butler / Chicago
8. YOU'LL ALWAYS BE IN STYLE - Patti Austin (?) / NY
9. BE MY LADY AND DANCE - The Mad Lads / Memphis
10. TELL ME YOU'RE MINE - Lorraine Chandler Rhythm track / Detroit
11. WE'LL MAKE IT BABY - M solo / Philadelphia
12. LOVE LETTERS - F solo / Chicago
13. LOVE ON A LEASE PLAN - Johnnie Taylor / Detroit
14. TEACH ME TONIGHT - Stevie Wonder & the Four Tops / Detroit
15. LET LOVE LIVE - The Velvelettes / Detroit
16. MAKE A CHANGE - Johnny Rogers rhythm track / Detroit
17. I WANT YOU - F solo / NY
18. GOTTA FIND A NEW LOVE - M grp / Philadelphia
19. PROVE IT - Barbara Lewis? / Detroit
20. ANYTHING YOU WANT - Jackie Lee / LA
21. PLAY IT COOL (STAY IN SCHOOL) - Brenda Holloway / LA
22. DO I LOVE YOU (INDEED I DO) - Chris Clark / LA
23. I BEAR WITNESS - Vince Apollo rhythm track / Philadelphia
24. DON'T LEAVE ME - Temptations / Detroit
25. DO THE WASH - F grp / Philadelphia
26. SEND MY BABY BACK - Fred Hughes / LA
27. YOU NEED LOVE - Irma & the Fascinators / Philadelphia
28. I'M THE ONE WHO LOVES YOU - Darrell Banks rhythm track / Detroit
29. LONELINESS - Carla Thomas / Memphis
30. THINK OF THE TIMES - Velvelettes / Detroit

RARE SOUL FROM THE VAULTS Vol.2

1. MY BUSINESS YOUR PLEASURE - Miracles / Detroit
2. BABY YOU'VE GOT ME - The Sapphires / Philadelphia
3. I GOTTA LET YOU GO - Jimmy Ruffin / Detroit
4. I CAN'T TURN MY BACK ON YOU - Vince Apollo & unknown F / Philadelphia
5. LET ME LOVE YOU - F solo / NY
6. HOLE IN THE WALL - JJ Barnes / Detroit
7. JUST ANOTHER GUY - M solo / Nashville
8. YOU HIT ME (WHERE IT HURT ME) - Kim Weston / Detroit
9. LOVE IS A WONDERFUL THING - F solo / Philadelphia
10. HIT AND RUN - Rhythm track / Detroit
11. HANDS OFF MY BABY - F solo / Chicago
12. SHE'S NOT A MANNEQUIN - Temptations / Detroit
13. YOU WON'T MISS YOUR WATER - Chico & Buddy / Detroit
14. I'M SATISFIED - M solo / Chicago
15. IT'S TOO LATE - Gladys Knight & the Pips / Detroit
16. GETTING A LITTLE TOUGHER - M solo / Philadelphia
17. IT'S GUARANTEED - M grp / Detroit
18. EXCLUSIVELY - Mirwood Strings / LA
19. MR CREATOR - Candy & the Kisses / Philadelphia
20. LET'S DO SOMETHING TOGETHER - William Bell / Memphis
21. THAT'S A FUNNY WAY - The Andantes / Detroit
22. GEE WHIZ - F solo / Philadelphia
23. STRANGE NEIGHBORHOOD - M solo / NY
24. LOVE KEEPS FADING AWAY - Lloyd Williams & the Highlighters / Detroit
25. STOP AND TAKE A LOOK - The Divine Men / NY
26. CAN'T STOP LOVING YOU - Spyder Turner / Detroit
27. HE'S MINE ALL MINE - F grp / Philadelphia
28. I NEED YOU LIKE A BABY - rhythm track / Detroit
29. ROLL WITH THE PUNCHES - F solo / NY

RARE SOUL FROM THE VAULTS Vol.3

1. SUGAR'S NEVER BEEN AS SWEET - Velvelettes / Detroit
2. SOMEBODY SOMEWHERE (NEEDS YOU) - Rhythm Track / Detroit
3. EVERYBODY NEEDS LOVE - F grp / Detroit
4. THAT'S NOT HALF BAD - M solo / Philadelphia
5. IF I DIDN'T KNOW BETTER - M solo / Texas
6. LOVINGLY YOURS - Timothy Wilson? / Detroit
7. SOMEONE - F solo / Philadelphia
8. HERE COMES FAT ALBERT - Shorty Long / Detroit
9. LITTLE BOY - Carla Thomas / Memphis
10. SOUL A-GO-GO - Rhythm Track / Detroit
11. TRULY YOURS - Temptations / Detroit
12. LAZY LOVER - F grp / Philadelphia
13. I'M NOT GONNA CRY - F solo / Philadelphia
14. DON'T HURT ME - F solo / Philadelphia
15. THAT'LL BE THE DAY - Temptations / Detroit
16. KEEP ON LOVING ME - Rhythm Track / Detroit
17. WE GOT A GOOD THING GOING - Joe Matthews / Detroit
18. NEW NEIGHBORHOOD - Tommy Hunt? / New York
19. LOVE WILL COME - F grp / Philadelphia
20. I DIDN'T HAVE TO - Dennis Edwards / Detroit
21. I WAS BORN TO LOVE YOU - M solo / New Orleans
22. DON'T START - Rhythm Track / Chicago
23. HURT - M solo / Philadelphia
24. YOU PULLED A FAST ONE - F grp / Philadelphia
25. SHOP AROUND - Spinners / Detroit
26. MY BABY'S GONE - M solo / Chicago
27. WATCHOUT - Rhythm Track / Detroit
28. SEVEN DAY LOVER - James Fountain Rhythm Track / New York
29. HE'S MY HERO - F grp / Nashville
30. ALL THE TIME - Earl Van Dyke & Soul Brothers / Detroit

By Davie G (213.251.162.249 - 213.251.162.249) on Thursday, February 14, 2002 - 10:49 pm:

Ritchie,

I'll check this out when I get home but
offhand here's a couple

vol.3
SUGAR'S NEVER BEEN AS SWEET - probably the Marvelettes, included on that best of comp.
issued on Spectrum about two years ago

THAT'S NOT HALF BAD - got this last week on
the " Northern Soul of Philadlphia vol.2" CD
on Goldmine - damned if I can remember who did it though !

EVERYBODY NEEDS LOVE - probably the Velvelettes

By recordboyusa (208.61.5.193 - 208.61.5.193) on Thursday, February 14, 2002 - 11:51 pm:

"I Was Born To Love You" would likely be Herbert Hunter/Nashville.

"Strange Neighborhood" was done by the Imaginations from Cincinnati on Fraternity, but Tommy Hunt also cut it in New York as "New Neighborhood" (as you noted on volume 3).

"You Pulled A Fast One" - Honey & The Bees/Philadelphia

Could the male group on "Gotta Find A New Love" be Willie & The Hand Jives on Veep?

Jeff Lemlich
http://www.limestonerecords.com

By Ritchie Hardin (62.254.0.6 - 62.254.0.6) on Friday, February 15, 2002 - 12:10 am:

Hi Davie / Jeff

Thanks both!

Davie - That's Not Half Bad is either Joe Adams or Gene Woodbury according to the Goldmine CD - will check which one. I have to say, I wasn't sure which "-ettes" it was on these (hangs head in shame waiting for lashing from John L!)

Jeff - I'll take your word for the Hunter/Nashville title - I really didn't have much of a clue on this. Strange Neighborhood is pretty dire - sounds to me like a white singer. (Unissued? I wonder why!) The "Tommy Hunt" cut is a far superior vocal. Gotta Find A.. could be "the Inspirations". I'll have to compare with the Goldmine CD - N/S of Philadelhia Vol 1. (I have a feeling that's what it is.)

Anyway - thanks. The CDs originated in the US, and some of the material is probably "rarer" there than it is here.

By John Lester (213.1.132.120 - 213.1.132.120) on Friday, February 15, 2002 - 08:21 am:

I gotta rush but I will come back to you on this..there are some things on this that are Motown unissued titles...

New Neighbourhood could be in The Neighbourhood
by white singer Tommy Good or Jimmy Ruffin......

The Dennis Edwards title is Johnny On The Spot, I suspect..which is not Motown...BTW, Dennis has more than enuff for a solo album pre-Temptations!!!!

The lashing out will come later......how COULD you not distinguish between the VELVELETTES and the Marvelettes. I am hurt...ooooo...... (LOLOLOL!)

By John Lester (213.1.132.120 - 213.1.132.120) on Friday, February 15, 2002 - 08:36 am:

"That's a Funny way" is Cal Street of the VELVELETTES on lead vocals...

Prove it is Mary Wells.....

Hit and Run could be the band track for Baby Hit And Run recorded by at least 3 different lead vocalists........that includes Dennis and Joe Stubbs

Truly Yours could be Ivy Jo Hunter as well as the Temps but the latter is issued

I am gonna be late for work...I will come back on the Motown ones....

By Carl Dixon London (195.153.219.170 - 195.153.219.170) on Friday, February 15, 2002 - 09:11 am:

Gee whiz - could that be 'The Orlons' or 'The Three Degrees' or even Shiela Ferguson?

Somebody somewhere (needs you) - I have a version of this by Ike & Tina Turner on a 'LOMA' comp on a vinyl LP I have. Also, I have the same backing track, but with a different melody by someone else on LOMA LP vinyl - from memory, but I owuld need to check.

By Ritchie Hardin (62.254.0.6 - 62.254.0.6) on Friday, February 15, 2002 - 10:06 am:

Hi Guys

I suspected the Forum Think Tank would have a line on some of these!

OK - John - I have castigated myself over the "-ettes" question, but my only defence is that I don't have your personal in-depth experience. As before, I bow to your superior knowledge.

I'm sure New Neighbourhood isn't a Motown track, so Tommy & Jimmy are out of the frame on this one (thankfully!) I'll have to re-listen to Dennis' track, but "Johnny On the Spot" doesn't ring any bells lyrically.

Prove It - Mary Wells? Amazing! I would have bet money it was Ms Lewis, even down to the Hello Stranger-styled male BVOs. Hit & Run is not a Motown track - it's the McGregor/Black song that everyone at Groovesville seemed to have a shot at. The Truly Yours is the same track that was issued on one of the Connoisseur CDs some time back.

Carl - thaks for your input... the jury's still out on Gee Whiz. Could be any of the Philly femmes you mention. Somebody Somewhere exists in two versions, to my knowledge. The Ike & Tina and Darrell Banks cuts have different rhythm tracks. It's the Turners' rhythm track that was used for a different song by another artist. It's the Darrell Banks rhythm that's included here. (It's actually on a Goldmine CD, but I guess they didn't know that!)

Thanks again, guys - progress at last. Actually, I misled you unintentionally - all these tracks originated on three US cassettes - I put them onto the CDs after I'd cleaned them up.

By Dave Rimmer (213.122.197.90 - 213.122.197.90) on Friday, February 15, 2002 - 12:15 pm:

Hi Richie,

The track you've got down as Patti Austin - 'You'll Always Be In Style', isn't actually Patti Austin. It was an unknown artist that the DJ Shifty called Patti Austin for want of the real name.

'I'm Satisfied' could be Otis Clay on One-Der-Ful.

'It's Guaranteed' is probably an unreleased RCA track by The Cavaliers

'I Need You Like A Baby' is the backing track to Andrea Henry on MGM, or possibly the version by Janice on Roulette. I suspect the AH version though because it's a United Sound recording.

'Roll With The Punches' is probably an unreleased Carol Fran version recorded for, I think, Port.

'That's Not Half Bad' is either the Gene Woodbury version released on Del-Val, or the unreleased version recorded by Joe Adams for the same company.

'If I didn't Know Better' - Bobby Patterson possibly.

'Lazy Lover' - Geraldine Latham on Seven 11, or an unreleased version by Cindy Gibson

'Don't Hurt Me' - Almost certainly unreleased Honey & The Bees.

'New Neighbourhood' is probably an unreleased recording by Billy Byers.

'Love Will Come' - Unreleased Patti & The Emblems.

'You Pulled A Fast One' - pssibly The V.I.P.s on Big Top

'My Baby's Gone' - Gene Chandler, an unreleased Brunswick recording.

I'm surprised you say they originated on US cassettes because most of the tracks I've (hopefully) identified have actually had a UK release via Kent Goldmine or Westside.

Nice CDs though.

Hope this helps

Dave Rimmer

By Ritchie Hardin (62.254.0.6 - 62.254.0.6) on Friday, February 15, 2002 - 02:08 pm:

Dave

Many thanks for your input on this. I may be making some progress now!

I Need You Like a Baby IS the Andrea Henry rhythm. You Pulled a Fast one isn't the Big Top record - it's the same song but a different recording, a 4/4 "clomper" not as smooth as the VIPs.

Actually, I don't think the tapes were "new" when I got hold of my copies in late 2000. I suspect they may have been circulating for some time already, or perhaps were compilations of a bunch of tracks that were known on the scene.

The fact that more than a few titles are/were already available here in the UK possibly helps confirm the US origin. I wouldn't class something that's been out on Goldmine for five years to be an in-demand "rarity". Thanks again.

By Davie G (213.251.162.249 - 213.251.162.249) on Friday, February 15, 2002 - 06:08 pm:

Hi Ritchie,

Another few possibles

HE'S MY HERO - The Avons ( Excello 2296)

HANDS OFF MY BABY - The Lovettes (Checker 1030)

GEE WHIZ - Nella Dodds (Wand)

DO THE WASH - Brenda and the Tabulations (Dionn 500) - real long shot this one - flip of "Dry
Your Eyes" was titled "The Wash"

I WAS BORN TO LOVE YOU - as Jeff said possibly
Herbert Hunter

By John Lester (213.1.129.43 - 213.1.129.43) on Friday, February 15, 2002 - 09:22 pm:

Gotta Find Myself a New Love....hmm.....is it not the vocal version of the Dave Hamilton song on his Volume 1 Kent CD....in whihc case it would be the Clarence Paul produced "I Got To Find Myself A New Love" from Mike Valvano

By Ritchie Hardin (62.254.0.6 - 62.254.0.6) on Friday, February 15, 2002 - 09:41 pm:

Hi John

GOTTA FIND A NEW LOVE is definitely by the Inspirations, but not the same group as the No One Else Can Take Your Place outfit. This track is on Goldmine's N/Soul of Philly vol.1, and it sounds the same to me.

Do The Wash has the throwaway quality of a B-side (sorry, girls!) - so it may well be Brenda & the Tabs. Still, the Fred Hughes track that's next well makes up for it!

Thanks, all - and keep 'em coming!

By recordboyusa (208.61.5.193 - 208.61.5.193) on Saturday, February 16, 2002 - 04:38 am:

If "You Pulled A Fast One" is from Philly, then I'd bet it's Honey & The Bees. I think it's on their Jamie CD. Perhaps Bobby Eli knows? I know Gwen did a lot of sessions in the 70s (pre-Ritchie Family).

Jeff Lemlich
http://www.limestonerecords.com

By phillysoulman (64.12.101.178 - 64.12.101.178) on Saturday, February 16, 2002 - 06:09 am:

YOU PULLED A FAST ONE....HONEY AND THE BEES
THE WASH..........BRENDA AND THE TABULATIONS
EXCLUSIVELY IS..THE BACKING TRACK FOR THE OLYMPICS "MINE EXCLUSIVELY" ON MIRWOOD, A WEST COAST LABEL OF THE 60'S
LONELY PEOPLE.... POSIBLY A TRACK WE DID WITH CLYDE MCPHATTER ON DECCA IN '71
ANYTHING YOU WANT...JACKIE LEE, MIRWOOD RECORDS, 1966

PLAY IT COOL.. A PROMO ITEM THAT BRENDA H. RECORDED IN L.A.

YOU NEED LOVE ..IRMA AND THE FACINATORS, PRODUCED BY WELDON MCDOUGAL,POSSIBLY ON PRIORITY???

BABY YOUVE GOT ME..SAPPHIRES..ALBUM CUT, SWAN??
GEE WHIZ..SHEILA FERGUSON/THREE DEGREES, (EARLY)
HE'S MINE..THE SWANS..ON SWAN..1964

I'LL RETURN WITH MORE SOON

RITCHIE, IF THERE WERE A WAY YOU COULD GET THOSE TO ME, I COULD POSSIBLY IDENTIFY MOST OF THEM!!

By John Lester (213.1.132.52 - 213.1.132.52) on Saturday, February 16, 2002 - 09:12 am:

Bobby. GASP!!!

You seem to be the last word on anything

I take my my hat off to you.

When is YOUR book due!!!

(and Ralph, I aint letting you off the hook on doing a book but at the moment I am giving you breathing space cos you're doing a great job with the TS story!) LOL!

By Ritchie Hardin (62.254.0.6 - 62.254.0.6) on Saturday, February 16, 2002 - 09:29 am:

Once again, the magic of Mr Eli leaves David Copperfield looking like a third-rate conjurer!

Bobby - consider them on their way to you ;o)

By phillysoulman (205.188.198.31 - 205.188.198.31) on Saturday, February 16, 2002 - 02:06 pm:

Hello my dear newfound mates, and brothers of the same lodge!!!

I cannot thank you all for the wonderful accolades which you all have given me.
It means the world to me to share the passion which boils deep within my soul.
At last there is a "soapbox" on which we all can stand to defend and protect the great music and history which we have truly loved and revered throughout the years.
What also amazes me is that I have been blessed to have been chosen to be part of a piece of musical history, having been directly on the set , so to speak in Philly, Detroit, Chicago. Memphis,Los Angeles, San Francisco, and last but surely not least London.
When I search my mind , I find so many wonderful memories and stories hard to believe by some and stranger than fiction. And if it is magic, then let this magic be shared by all of us.
The cast of characters throughout the years,read like a who's who of life itself!!

So therefore , I am more than happy to share my experience within the cocoon which became a beautiful perennial butterfly.

B. Eli

By John Lester (213.122.201.175 - 213.122.201.175) on Saturday, February 16, 2002 - 02:19 pm:

We wanna hear all about it Bobby.......just let it flow....

By Ralph Terrana (209.240.222.130 - 209.240.222.130) on Saturday, February 16, 2002 - 04:06 pm:

Well said Bobby...and may this new found soapbox spread it's influence throughout the world.

By Ralph Terrana (209.240.222.130 - 209.240.222.130) on Saturday, February 16, 2002 - 04:14 pm:

John,
If it is in the cards for me to write a book in the future I will. I would love to do this with my daughter who has always been after me to write a book and has offered her services in putting it together.Alisa holds a masters degree in literature and has always had a way with words. Of course I will have to enlist the services of Bobby Eli to do a fore-word just to get people's attention.