| Author | Message | ||
  Stonewall (stonewall) 1-Arriviste Username: stonewall Post Number: 7 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 68.237.26.43 |
Thanx David & Lowell & Andrew & Staff for a new homepage headline story and an interesting story at that, like the predecessor story, Darrell Banks. Look forward to reading it real soon. | ||
Robb_K (robb_k) 4-Laureate Username: robb_k Post Number: 130 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 66.81.201.192 |
The first installment looks and reads great. I can't wait for the rest. One question, however: The comment on "Just For Your Love" and the re-recorded "This Heart of Mine" by the Falcons seems to imply that West had it picked up by Chess before Anna. The way I understood the process (and it makes much more sense, logically) is that West made a deal with Anna first, and it came out on Anna. Chess later picked it up for national distribution under their distribution deal with Anna. If one examines All the Anna Records, it is clear that the label design and master number series change with which label distributed them nationally. The first (black) Anna records and the associated Vega record have similar, simple label designs of solid colour with only parallel lines. That reflects the similar design of George Goldner's End/Gone Records, which were distributing Anna at that time (note also Gordy's End deal for his Miracles (and Five Stars on Goldner's Mark-X). The new golden Anna label with artwork and numbers reflecting Chess master numbers reflect Anna's change in distribution to Chess. Not surprisingly, the Miracles moved to Chess, and Ron and Bill, to Argo. It is a minor point, but I thought worth mentioning. | ||
Randy Russi (randy_russi) 3-Pundit Username: randy_russi Post Number: 39 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 169.139.180.100 |
How did the association with Mary Wells come about? What about the incident where Robert West was shot? | ||
SisDetroit (sis) 3-Pundit Username: sis Post Number: 68 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 68.42.211.240 |
How does the song by Carrol Carter sound? Is Carter a male or female? I could ask around to find out if anyone knows Carter. "You're So Fine" still tugs at my heart. I love that recording. It is outstanding. (Message edited by sis on May 03, 2004) | ||
Ron Murphy (ron_murphy) 2-Debutant Username: ron_murphy Post Number: 28 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 68.42.90.140 |
Robb: to answer your question about the Falcon's....this record was transfered from Chess to Anna to help build up the Detroit label that Chess had recently made a pressing and distribution deal with., as you know most of the Anna recordings were done in Chicago with Chess paying the bills and most of the masters remain within the Chess catalog at Universal along with Check-Mate masters, all of which still remain in the vaults without being reissued. | ||
Robb_K (robb_k) 4-Laureate Username: robb_k Post Number: 131 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 204.108.65.10 |
Thanks for that bit of information, Ron. That was quite an unusual situation, with a local production being picked up by a major, and then placed with a local independent (non subsidiary-only pressing and distribution label in the production's city of origin!!! I had thought that I saw the Chess version first in Chicago because the Anna only started arriving from Detroit as second hand records. I never dreamed that the Chess release came first. | ||
Ron Murphy (ron_murphy) 2-Debutant Username: ron_murphy Post Number: 29 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 68.42.90.140 |
Robb; if you check both pressings you will notice that the only thing different is the labels as both are using the same metal stamper from the master cut at Sheldon for both pressings...which has a Chess matrix number in the wax...if the Anna press had been first you would have had 1110-A&B instead of a Chess number | ||
Robb_K (robb_k) 4-Laureate Username: robb_k Post Number: 132 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 66.81.30.176 |
Yes, I see that is true. Of course, I didn't need any proof, as I believed what you told me in your post, and should have known that the SD people who put The Robert West Story together would have all their statements backed by good research. I guess that situation was a little bit similar to VJ starting "For Your Prescious Love" out on their flagship label (VJ), and later putting it out on their fledgling subsidiary, Falcon. I'm not sure what their reasoning was, but it was basically keeping a Chicago record within the VJ family (so, no problem there). The difference with The Falcons' record was that West was essentially a local competitor of The Gordys' Anna Records, and West got his best groups' record picked up by an R&B major to distribute it nationally, and then, ironically, the Major places it back on a competing small Detroit label (albeit still keeping Chess' national distribution). I assume West was still friendly with The Gordys, and had no objection to the move. I assume Chess ran it by him first (right?). Still, it must have been a very unique situation. I don't know if it means anything, but when the record was out, and throughout the succeeding years i've seen a lot more copies of the Chess pressing than the Anna. But, perhaps that's due to the fact that I was in Chicago till 1966. In subsequent years, The Anna copy probably became more desireable to collectors as a small Detroit label with affiliations with Motown, and so was held much more in collections than The Chess (so it became rarer). | ||
acooolcat (acooolcat) 3-Pundit Username: acooolcat Post Number: 62 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 203.69.208.7 |
Great stuff David! A well-deserved pat on the back to everyone involved. | ||
David Meikle (david_meikle) 4-Laureate Username: david_meikle Post Number: 93 Registered: 3-2004 Posted From: 80.58.38.235 |
Thanks to everyone. It is important that we try to get things right on SoulfulDetroit, so input/corrections are more than welcome. | ||
Eli (phillysoulman) 5-Doyen Username: phillysoulman Post Number: 222 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 68.236.62.124 |
Simply brilliant guys. I always wanted to know of the history of the Robert west empire. | ||
ralph (ralph) Moderator Username: ralph Post Number: 143 Registered: 3-2004 Posted From: 209.240.205.61 |
Finally got a free minute to look at the new webisode. Thanks David and Lowell for an extremely interesting view of the early recording scene in Detroit. I'm looking forward to the next episode. Great work as always guys. | ||
Soul Sister (soul_sister) 6-Zenith Username: soul_sister Post Number: 416 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 65.43.147.99 |
Fasinating look into Detroit Music History and loved the historical photos!! Good job thanks David, Lowell, keep it up.  S.S. | ||
Ron Murphy (ron_murphy) 2-Debutant Username: ron_murphy Post Number: 30 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 68.42.90.140 |
great writing on the story David and Lowell's graphic work is again outstanding..I'm looking forward to the 2nd half of the story. | ||
David Meikle (david_meikle) 4-Laureate Username: david_meikle Post Number: 96 Registered: 3-2004 Posted From: 80.58.38.235 |
Thanks again folks. I left Lowell in the lurch reference the pic at the top left of your screen and also the intro. I will edit both next week to the Falcons etc. I also gave Lowell some dreadful images to work with. His artistic touch is outstanding and unquestionably the highlight of the website. We all owe him for making the site unique. | ||
Vonnie (vonnie) 4-Laureate Username: vonnie Post Number: 85 Registered: 3-2004 Posted From: 64.12.116.138 |
David and Lowell, My hat is off to both of you, what an excellent story and the pictures are fantastic. I was thrilled to see the old telephone numbers that used letters as a prefix. Seeing fo6-8060 made me think of be4-5789, those were the days. | ||
Don (don) 4-Laureate Username: don Post Number: 97 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 68.75.179.210 |
I seen a Robert West show at The Cubby Bear back in 94 or 95. It did an excellent show. Him and his band played more traditional blues/rhythm & blues numbers, Mr. West also included not some but a few Falcons and Ohio Untouchables songs. The music writers and deejay's we're buzzing about it for several months. | ||
David (dac) 1-Arriviste Username: dac Post Number: 1 Registered: 5-2004 Posted From: 67.104.175.114 |
Truly amazing to see that my father's group, the Vo-cals, recorded for the same label as did the Falcons! The Vo-cals were a white harmony trio who sounded a bit like the Ames Brothers. They also played their own instruments - bass, accordian , and my dad on guitar. Liz Palmer was their featured "girl singer." The Vo-cals had two singles on Silouhette around 1955-56: 1. "Wild Honey" b/w "Santa Claus Serenade." 2. "You Are My Love," b/w "Baby, You're Not the Only One." "Wild Honey" which was a ballad - not a rocker - gained some regional popularity, especially in Cleveland. That was about it. The Vo-cals performed nightly at "Menjos," at the time one of the most popular nightclubs in Detroit. They also could be seen on "Harness Racing From Hazel Park" on WWJ-TV, ch 4. In between races the announcer would say, "Now let's go to the club house for a song from that popular Detroit trio, the Vo-cals!" They mainly did standards such as "Sentimental Journey," "South of the Border," etc. We all know that the musical landscape was changing around that time. The group faded out around 1959. My dad continued to do "jobing dates" (gigs) until he retired in the '80s. I have no idea how they connected with Robert West and sadly, my dad passed on a few years ago. Now, I've got to find those singles which I put in a safe place - somewhere! Hope you found this small piece of Detroit history of interest. DavidC. | ||
David Meikle (david_meikle) Moderator Username: david_meikle Post Number: 110 Registered: 3-2004 Posted From: 82.1.161.44 |
Don I assume you mean Robert Ward. You were privileged. Robert West passed in 1983. (Message edited by david meikle on May 11, 2004) | ||
David Meikle (david_meikle) Moderator Username: david_meikle Post Number: 111 Registered: 3-2004 Posted From: 82.1.161.44 |
David First of all welcome to the forum. It's great to hear your Dad was part of this history. I only wish he were still alive to share some of my newly found questions. Is anyone else from the group still around? | ||
David Meikle (david_meikle) Moderator Username: david_meikle Post Number: 112 Registered: 3-2004 Posted From: 82.1.161.44 |
David I will add your detail to the Silhouette page this week if you don't mind. I'd also love to see those labels if you have them and can upload them. To all those interested in the story, some other items of interest have emerged on the first instalment and I will also add those this week. | ||
Don (don) 4-Laureate Username: don Post Number: 112 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 68.75.175.119 |
Oops, sorry David, I get Ward and West mixed up, sorry man. My older aunts, cousins and grandparents had West and Wards records, and a next door neighbor that ran a slew of records on the westside of Chi. So what room Pip didn't have he'd give us all records for nothin'. I'm aware of West and Ward's records. My apologies again, OK. | ||
acooolcat (acooolcat) 3-Pundit Username: acooolcat Post Number: 69 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 210.200.105.225 |
David C Please dig out those 45s by your father's group - I would really like to see label scans, or have the label numbers. | ||
David (dac) 1-Arriviste Username: dac Post Number: 2 Registered: 5-2004 Posted From: 67.104.175.114 |
If I can locate those two discs I will be sure and upload scans. It's one of those situations where you think you know just where something is - then you find out it's not there! DavidC | ||
Keith Rylatt (keith_rylatt) 1-Arriviste Username: keith_rylatt Post Number: 1 Registered: 5-2004 Posted From: 207.218.152.146 |
David & Lowell The Robet West story is excellent. Well done. Keith |
