| Author | Message | ||
  johneflat (johneflat) 2-Debutant Username: johneflat Post Number: 24 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 64.12.116.138 |
Can somene break down for me the differendes between re-mixing and re-mastering, it seems like to do one, you'd have to do the other......... | ||
johneflat (johneflat) 2-Debutant Username: johneflat Post Number: 26 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 64.12.116.138 |
whoops....I mean differences! | ||
Eli (phillysoulman) 5-Doyen Username: phillysoulman Post Number: 178 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 68.236.48.154 |
Remixing is where one(usually a dj type) takes a multi track recording and puts a different spin on it, sometimes not for the better. Re mastering is taking the a finished recording(usually one from the vaults) and bringing the tonal characteristics and all over sound quality up to todays standards insofar as the aural perspective is concerned. | ||
johneflat (johneflat) 3-Pundit Username: johneflat Post Number: 33 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 152.163.252.166 |
Thanx Mr Eli, the reason I ask is that in playing my Funk Bros cd for the first time, the horns were so loud and harsh that they cut through my head like a laser,(i was wearing head phones) and i wondered if that was a mixing problem or a result of re-mastering, i had to turn my high end EQ way down to soften them. | ||
Eli (phillysoulman) 5-Doyen Username: phillysoulman Post Number: 181 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 68.236.31.246 |
Sounds like there was quite a boose at around 3-4 k and around 7-8 k which would acccentuate the frequencies associated with the brightness of the horns. | ||
dvdmike (dvdmike) 3-Pundit Username: dvdmike Post Number: 47 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 65.208.234.61 |
Yeah Bobby and also... THE RAIN IN SPAIN FALLS MAINLY ON THE PLAIN (By Jove, I think I've got it!) And in the immortal words of Fred Flintstone... THE ROTZKIN SPOTZKIN IS MOTZKIN ON THE PLOTZKIN Words to live by | ||
Uptight (uptight) 3-Pundit Username: uptight Post Number: 44 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 24.55.0.68 |
Good answer, E. Many people are often confused about (re)mastering & (re)mixing. Also, people are confused by the terms "new mix," "alternate mix," and "dance re-mix." Here's my take on it (FWIW): - The recent instrumentals mixed exclusively for the SITSOM soundtrack and the Motown Singing Machine Karaoke CDs are new mixes made from the original multi-track session tapes. Getting the right balance of all the elements takes time and talent. - Alternate mixes are usually mixes made around the time of the released mix. It makes sense to make a few slightly different mixes to choose one later as your master. The other versions would be shelved, erased or discarded. For some newer CDs, when the surviving alternate mixes are used it gives us a fresh perspective on an old hit. Stating on the package that a tune is an alt. mix can be a good selling point because it gives us a glimpse into the mind of the producer before he settled on the finished product. - Dance re-mixes are often made by famous DJs, using snippets of the released record. (Sorry I can't recall some of these popular DJs). A priviledged few DJs are given access to multi-track tapes for this purpose. I imagine the latter method is way more costly than using a copy of the master tape or even a vinyl record. Though I work in film and television post-production, my interest in audio production came first. I love reading Russ and Ralph's technical stories about records they worked on. I would like them to add their comments here. | ||
Eli (phillysoulman) 5-Doyen Username: phillysoulman Post Number: 192 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 68.236.13.207 |
That word should have been "boost". My bad typo! Hey Mike....whats the gezaktehagen of the jimmy jam of the wang dang doodle,divided by the un square root of da funk / ya dig?? | ||
Uptight (uptight) 3-Pundit Username: uptight Post Number: 46 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 24.55.0.68 |
E... Boose? (LMAO). Was that a Freudian slip? Just kidding. Remember, we can edit our own posts now. | ||
johneflat (johneflat) 3-Pundit Username: johneflat Post Number: 38 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 152.163.252.200 |
Yeah, where are Russ and Ralph? I need some "behind the board" tips and tricks! | ||
Eli (phillysoulman) 5-Doyen Username: phillysoulman Post Number: 223 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 68.236.62.124 |
Johneflat, What would you like to know. I too am an enginneer, of sorts! | ||
bigdaddyg2k4 (bigdaddyg2k4) 2-Debutant Username: bigdaddyg2k4 Post Number: 23 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 206.157.26.221 |
After a week and a 1/2 absence, the BigDaddy is back in it and goin' nowhere! I too, is a aspiring engineer and I do know the difference between a remixed and a remastered recording. They are important tools that the engineer can use to update the sonic integrity of the recording and give it a fresh new perspective by cleaning up the tape hiss as much as possible and hearing things in the recording that you never noticed before-the subtle nuances and hidden surprises that await the listener. I'm a fan of remixed/remastered recordings. The problem with that is, labels like Motown are reissuing too many versions of the same songs on different complilations, as we did discuss this on a previous thread. Other than that, I like the concept. | ||
johneflat (johneflat) 3-Pundit Username: johneflat Post Number: 39 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 152.163.252.200 |
wow....It's funny that BD ahould mention tape hiss....that's part of my curremt heartaches, im new at transferring music from analog tape to digital formats. From a 4-track cassete to computer hard drive, to be exact, what's a good way of getting this done with quality results? | ||
Eli (phillysoulman) 5-Doyen Username: phillysoulman Post Number: 235 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 68.236.62.124 |
There are NO quality results going from 4 track cassette. Sound Forge has a decent noise reduction section. The best out there to my knowledge is the CEDAR system. Though pricey, it does a pretty decent job, although it will not fix badly recorded music or low level ultra hissy stuff. | ||
johneflat (johneflat) 3-Pundit Username: johneflat Post Number: 44 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 205.188.116.138 |
I was afraid that might be the case, but all the re-issues started out on tape, so it must be possible on SOME level, shoot, Motown started out with THREE tracks, but are you saying i should give up analog recording? And don't hold back, i need to know......... | ||
johneflat (johneflat) 3-Pundit Username: johneflat Post Number: 45 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 205.188.116.138 |
BTW, THANKS to everybody for your input here. | ||
Eli (phillysoulman) 5-Doyen Username: phillysoulman Post Number: 238 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 68.163.30.61 |
Analog multi track recording done on professional equipment such as Scully, Ampex,Studer, MCI,and comparable brands should pose no problems when transferred to digital media. The cassette format will always be hissy and devoid of any dynamics. | ||
johneflat (johneflat) 3-Pundit Username: johneflat Post Number: 47 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 205.188.116.138 |
OOOOOhhhhhh..........I get ya, thanks!I thought it was something I wasn't doing right, this is good to know. I have heard transfers and the hiss was still there.........hmmmm.......some type of filter maybe? | ||
Eli (phillysoulman) 5-Doyen Username: phillysoulman Post Number: 240 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 68.163.30.61 |
tapes encoded with Dolby or DBX noise reduction masks some of it, but remember that cassettes orer recorded on 1/8th inch tape versus multi track 2 inch tape so therefore you are cramming al of that info on a very narrow medium devoid of any dynamics and heightening the hiss at the same time. Any analog tape running over tape heads will have a degree of hiss and when transfered to digital format, its also transferring the hiss too! As I said before there are devices such as CEDAR which does a decent job, but there still will be some and it cant be avoided. | ||
johneflat (johneflat) 3-Pundit Username: johneflat Post Number: 50 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 152.163.252.200 |
Thanks for the info, sir you are a gentleman and a scholar. While i have your ear, 1 more question I'LL BE AROUND is one of my all-time favorite cuts, did you work on that session? Also any memories of the session? (ok, 2 questions) | ||
Eli (phillysoulman) 5-Doyen Username: phillysoulman Post Number: 242 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 68.236.52.183 |
Johneflat, I most certainly did play on I'll be around. I thought that the five songs which were recorded during those two fateful days in 1972 were gonna catapult the Spinners to the heights where they deserved to be. Those classic Thom Bell intros alone just couldnt miss. Norman's octave guitar coupled with Thom and myself on the chord accents were just pure magic and when Larry came in with his signature "gallop" with Earl's tom and snare double whammy, well that was it for me. On those two days we recorded, I'll be around, Could it be Im falling in love, How could I let you get away, You and me baby, and a fifth song whose title escapes me now(ginko please) I was honroed to witness some of the vocal sessions later that week, and I could not believe what I was hearing coming out of the mouth of the great Phillipe Wynne, let along Bobbie Smith!! Pure magical soul of the highest order!! | ||
Dayo (dayo) 2-Debutant Username: dayo Post Number: 26 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 81.134.189.245 |
Darn - I thought that octave guitar was you Bobby! Have you played a lot of octave licks? | ||
Eli (phillysoulman) 5-Doyen Username: phillysoulman Post Number: 247 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 68.236.52.183 |
The octave and mellow stuff was usually Norman and I was the guy who played everything else, such as the sitar, wah wah, backbeats, effects, leads (as in the Love I lost). On Hope that we can get together soon, I played both the octave and the wah wah-echoplex parts. | ||
johneflat (johneflat) 3-Pundit Username: johneflat Post Number: 51 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 64.12.116.138 |
Man, I'm tellin'ya, you guys made magic! I was singing with a group arriving at our gig in the afternoon to set up, right? When we heard I'LL BE AROUND on the jukebox, we went NUTS!!! We ran to the bar, bought a bunch of quarters, played it till we knew it, and turned out the joint with it that night! We kept that song, never tired of it and neither did our crowds!!! A little LOVE DON'T LOVE...followed by I'LL BE AROUND and I was sure to get lucky that night! ( if you catch my drift...) so THANKS to you guys on MANY levels! | ||
Uptight (uptight) 3-Pundit Username: uptight Post Number: 48 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 24.55.0.68 |
Eli, with every description you give us, I can hear those licks without even playing the CDs, but I end up wanting to pull out each of the recordings to enjoy them again and again. I love it! You are a real gem at SD. I'm sure people must have suggested you write a book. | ||
Eli (phillysoulman) 5-Doyen Username: phillysoulman Post Number: 254 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 68.236.52.183 |
Thanks guys!! It was a REAL pleasure being involved in all of that great music and it is even a greater pleasure sharing the experience with my SD brothers and sisters. You guys are THE true gems! Book to folow...God willing. | ||
motownboy (motownboy) 1-Arriviste Username: motownboy Post Number: 3 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 64.170.49.14 |
Bobby Eli - Do you remember a girl named Dianne Steinberg who recorded and album at Sigma for Atlantic in 1974? I recently found the LP used and liked several of the songs, namely "One More Time" & "Sunny One." I found out that she was in the group Stargard and also in the movie version of "Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band." Any recollections on her? Were there any artists that you remember working with that back then that stand out in your memory in either a positive or not-so-positive way? | ||
Eli (phillysoulman) 5-Doyen Username: phillysoulman Post Number: 280 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 68.236.38.208 |
MB, Diane is the daughter of Martha Jean"The Queen" Steinberg, the famous Detroit radio personality. WSM in the UK have put One More Time on the Creme de la creme cd. Diane is a great person and in fact, I heard from her not very long ago! All of my memories and recollections of my 70's experience are good ones, as I consider myself blessed to have been a part of it. | ||
Jester (jester) 1-Arriviste Username: jester Post Number: 7 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 62.255.64.7 |
Thanks for the info on Dianne Steinberg. I too have the LP and was wondering if she did anything else? Creme De La Creme is a fine copilation CD Bobby; many underplayed gems on there. As for One More Time it is also on a comp from a couple of years ago called Soul Togetherness pres. 'The Spirit Of Philadelphia' here in the UK (Expansion Records). Here's the tracklisting: 01. The Joneses - Who Loves You 02. Gloria Gaynor - This Love Affair 03. The Futures - Stay With Me 04. The Modulations - Your Love Had Locked Me Up 05. Revelation - We've Got To Survive 06. The Invitations - Look On The Good Side 07. Barbara Mason & The Futures - Make It Last 08. Jermaine Jackson - Good For The Gander 09. Little Dooley - (It's Got To Be) Now Or Never 10. Dianne Steinberg - One More Time 11. Touch Of Class - I Love You Pretty Baby 12. The Philly Devotions - Hurt So Bad 13. The Invitations - They Say The Girl's Crazy 14. Revelation - Where It's Warm 15. Touch Of Class - I Just Can't Say Goodbye 16. Charen Cotten - A Little Bit Of Love 17. New York City - Happiness Is 18. The Whispers - Will You Be Mine Pure class, I think you'd agree? The 7" of 'One More Time' apparently fetches upwards of �800 these days???? I'm listening to MFSB's Love Has No Time Or Place right now & I'm in a bit of a Philly Heaven;o))) I too have been mesmorised by your anicdotes of days gone by Bobby..Thank You! Jester. | ||
Eli (phillysoulman) 5-Doyen Username: phillysoulman Post Number: 290 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 68.163.62.168 |
Big thanx, Jester! | ||
Eli (phillysoulman) 5-Doyen Username: phillysoulman Post Number: 291 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 68.163.62.168 |
FYI, a True fact. The word "mesmerized". was actualy named after Claude Mesmer, a Frenchman who was a pioner in modern day hypnosis! | ||
Juicefree20 (juicefree20) 6-Zenith Username: juicefree20 Post Number: 631 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 24.46.184.162 |
Far as I'm concerned, I would have heard more from The Philly Devotions. Just Can't Say Goodbye was great! Bobby E: What's Happening with the Janice McClain project?? How are things progressing? I'm looking for everything to be, please forgive the pun: Smack Dab In The Middle!!!! | ||
Eli (phillysoulman) 5-Doyen Username: phillysoulman Post Number: 293 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 68.236.50.81 |
Hi Juice, The Philly devotions were a good group, and their lead singer, Matt Covington is a great tenor in the Russell mode. Unfortunately, their carrer was shortlived for some unknown reason. The Janice project is coming along o.k. too, time permitting. She is a monster!! | ||
Juicefree20 (juicefree20) 6-Zenith Username: juicefree20 Post Number: 830 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 24.46.184.162 |
What's up Bobby bo! Glad to hear that project with Janice is coming along. As she's fuly mature now, she must sound great. Just tell me that she only sounds as good as she did back in the day. If she sounds better than that, we're in trouble! | ||
Eli (phillysoulman) 5-Doyen Username: phillysoulman Post Number: 351 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 68.236.59.202 |
Hey Juice, Believe it or not , she sounds better and looks great to boot!! | ||
Wonder B (wonder_b) 5-Doyen Username: wonder_b Post Number: 231 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 81.251.128.19 |
Bobby I have one (or perhaps a couple) of 12" singles by Matt Covington and I have always wondered where he came from and where he had gone... I don't want to say something stupid but from the top of my head it seems that the 12" I remember was on Apryl or Cheryl Records... damn, I see that orange colored label but can't focus on the exact name... As you grow old never trust your memory! LOL Wonder B | ||
Juicefree20 (juicefree20) 6-Zenith Username: juicefree20 Post Number: 849 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 24.46.184.162 |
Hey Bobby E!!! Man, I ASKED YOU NOT TO TELL ME THAT  Seriously, I'm glad to hear that & I can't wait to hear the results!!! Hey Bobby, where's KevGo??? Haven't seen him in these parts lately. | ||
Eli (phillysoulman) 5-Doyen Username: phillysoulman Post Number: 370 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 68.163.30.177 |
Hey Juice, Kev will be back in a minute. Had some details of importance to take care of. Wonder B, Matt recorded for April records which was his own label. he also has some ice cream parlour type of places here in Philly. dang, I could use one of those ice creams right about now!(smile) | ||
Wonder B (wonder_b) 5-Doyen Username: wonder_b Post Number: 248 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 81.51.205.159 |
Hey Bobby, I really need to hop over to Philly... first for some ice cream (LOL) and then to meet you and all those musicians that seem to be a dime a dozen over there... this must be so much fun... Wonder B If you mess with the 'fro, you gotta go! | ||
Eli (phillysoulman) 5-Doyen Username: phillysoulman Post Number: 374 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 68.163.30.134 |
WB, Are you still in NYC?? If so, let me know your m.o. You can e mail me at phillysoulman@msn.com | ||
Juicefree20 (juicefree20) 6-Zenith Username: juicefree20 Post Number: 875 Registered: 4-2004 Posted From: 24.46.184.162 |
Hey Bobby! Tell him I'm still waiting to see The Sport & as for you, I'm definitely waiting to hear the lovely Ms McClain sing again! Hey Diddle Diddle!!! |
