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Ron Murphy (ron_murphy)
2-Debutant
Username: ron_murphy
Post Number: 12
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 68.42.90.140
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 21, 2004 - 10:15 am: �� |     ���  |
I have been working on the HOB Records catalog including the Starmaker,Spartan and Soul labels for Carmen Murphy the original owner of The House Of Beauty, I'm preparing the music for a CD reissue. I have a few questions that maybe someone can help with: first I have what I believe are 2 unissued acetate dubs but I need to be sure that somewhere somehow they were not released ..does anyone have the following?
Herman Griffin & Rayber Voices- "Happy Blue"/"The World Is A Better Place"
Johnny Mack-"Pink Lips"/"Hey Girl"
also does anyone have a copy of Starmaker #1929 which may have been the 2nd Carvelles record because I have seen information about the title of one side on this record,but I would like to know where the information came from- did someone see an actual record or what? any help to clear these questions up would be great! |
acooolcat (acooolcat)
2-Debutant
Username: acooolcat
Post Number: 27
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 210.200.105.226
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 21, 2004 - 10:56 am: �� | ��� |
Ron
I have also only seen Star Maker #1929 listed; I've never met anyone who has seen a copy, and the members of the group that recorded the other Star Maker 45 didn't know about it. It's certainly a mystery.
Is the "Pink Lips" song by Johnny Mack the same as the Caravelles' one on Star Maker 1925? |
Ron Murphy (ron_murphy)
2-Debutant
Username: ron_murphy
Post Number: 13
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 68.42.90.140
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 21, 2004 - 11:58 am: �� | ��� |
Hey old acooolcat: yes "Pink Lips" is the same song as by the Caravelles. I'll be sending everything to Carmen Murphy in the next few days for her to listen to and see what she remembers but I sure hope somebody can clear up that Starmaker 1929, as I believe I have everything else. |
Robb_K (robb_k)
3-Pundit
Username: robb_k
Post Number: 58
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 66.81.31.52
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 21, 2004 - 7:53 pm: �� | ��� |
Ron,- I have never seen that on vinyl, nor heard a tape of it. I don't know anyone that has seen it. I thought I had seen it listed on an auction or set sale list in "Goldmine Magazine" in the early 1970s, but that is too long ago to remember clearly. The fact that I don't remember bidding on it, or inquiring about it bothers me. When I saw it listed there, I put it on my wants list. It's been there ever since. I've also seen it on a lot of other collectors' wants lists. I've also seen it listed on several Starmaker discographies (but, suspiciously, only the A side). It is listed in the Starmaker Discography in "Detroit City Limits", British Soul Fanzine Issue #2, Summer 1988, published by Graham Anthony of Derby, England. It is also listed there with only the A side.
Mike Hanks being gone is a problem here, as Mrs. Murphy wasn't in on the everyday goings on. However, there are other tracks to explore. Does anyone know if Harry Gates is still alive? He was one of the writers on "Angry Angel". Maybe he was a member of The Caravelles? Also, Clyde Johnson was listed as a writer on Pink Lips. Perhaps he was also a member. Has anyone heard of him recently? Gary Randy was listed as the "director" and one of the writers. Maybe he is still with us? Maybe he was their manager, or another group member? One of them might know if a second of their records was released. I find it difficult to believe that a tiny, short-lived label that only spanned 7 catalogue numbers, skipped one of those numbers. I'd be really surprised if 1929 was skipped. If the Caravelles "Devil With An Angel's Smile" was a "guess", concocted by collectors (through rumour), why were The Caravelles chosen, and why THAT particular song title? The only potential reason that makes sense is that some collector came up with a one-sided acetate, and "assigned" it to the missing number. But, if so, I suspect that some other songs were pressed on 1929,-(even if only 25, 50 or 100 DJ copies).
Graham,- Are you saying that the Caravelles' members who recorded "Angry Angel", didn't remember another of their records being released on Starmaker? Who were those members? Did they include Harry Gates, Clyde Johnson and/or Gary Randy? Also, ... do you know if harry and Lee Gates were different people? If so, were they brothers or cousins?
At over 90 years old, having to remember unimportant vents of 40 years ago is tough, even when involved in the day to day operations. But as Mike Hanks was the one deeply involved, and Mrs. Murphy was only interested in the bottom-line and "general" situation (rather than deails), I really doubt that she will remember whether or not 2 or 1 Caravelles records were released on Starmaker, or whether or not a catalogue number was skipped.
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Ron Murphy (ron_murphy)
2-Debutant
Username: ron_murphy
Post Number: 14
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 68.42.90.140
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 21, 2004 - 9:36 pm: �� | ��� |
hi Robb and thanks for your reply and interest,I must say that I agree with your points. I will continue to check about SM1929,I have a few ideas yet to find out something.
to Graham: did any of the Caravelles mention how many tracks (if any) they cut for HOB other than the 2 on SM1925. |
acooolcat (acooolcat)
2-Debutant
Username: acooolcat
Post Number: 29
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 210.200.105.227
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 21, 2004 - 10:18 pm: �� | ��� |
Robb and Ron
I'll really have to listen to my interview recording... but from memory Tommy Martin couldn't recall making another 45 with the Carvelles. Tommy (& his brother Fred) was also in The Paragons that recorded on the Exit label for Mike Hanks. (They were later in The Swingers that recorded for Dave Hamilton too.)
I'm sorry to say Harry Gates is dead, and Fred and Tommy didn't seem to know who Gary Randy was.
The Caravelles were Harry Gates (lead), Norman Hurst, Tommy Martin, and Charles Poole. |
kh (keith_hughes)
1-Arriviste
Username: keith_hughes
Post Number: 1
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 81.79.246.131
| | Posted on Friday, April 23, 2004 - 10:53 am: �� | ��� |
Hi Ron
I saw and taped a copy of the Herman Griffin & the Rayber Voices record a few years ago when I visited the (then) owner's house.
It was a white label acetate, and the only identification was "H-822" on both sides, and the titles and artist names.
I kind of assumed then that the H number might be part of the Motown H series, but I now think that was a mistake. Judging by the other H numbers, 822 would have occurred around mid 1961, by which time the Rayber Voices were history.
I don't know of any commercial release of either of these songs, or who wrote them.
Best
Keith |
Ron Murphy (ron_murphy)
2-Debutant
Username: ron_murphy
Post Number: 18
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 68.42.90.140
| | Posted on Friday, April 23, 2004 - 5:32 pm: �� | ��� |
thanks kh for that information, the H-822 is also on the dub I have, as you know HOB's Soul label was running an 800 series but started at 836 as far as I know. thanks again as any piece of a puzzle can help. |
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