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Eva (bigswede2002)
2-Debutant
Username: bigswede2002

Post Number: 11
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 130.237.171.253
Posted on Wednesday, April 21, 2004 - 4:38 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi again,

I'm starting a new thread since we've by now crossed over to another subject!

Rodmann wrote:

>I don't really care for anything on Malaco. >Everything I've ever heard on that label seems >to sound the same! Every song by any artist >sounds exactly the same! If you've heard one >thing on Malaco you've heard it all! Someone >please correct me if I'm wrong.

Rodmann, I'm by no means the Malaco expert here-Malaco has had a substantial output of singles, albums and CDs over the past thirty years, and I haven't heard it all by far. However, I've really enjoyed the Malaco albums/CDs I have, by such artists as Dorothy Moore, Shirley Brown, Z.Z. Hill, Johnnie Taylor, Latimore, McKinley Jackson,....

It seems to me that Malaco did get into a kind of rut in the eighties/nineties, when their typical downhome SS sound became a bit clichéed (sp?). Some people would also say that the backing is a tad too slick compared to the classic sounds of Stax/FAME etc. However, I do think that they're still head and shoulders above most of the contemporary "indie" southern soul companies when it comes to production values...I sometimes listen to the contemporary indie releases at a record shop that imports them, and most of them sound soo tinny with their poor computerized backing tracks, even though the singing may be good. Also, Malaco has song writers like George Jackson, who write intelligent/meaningful songs that will appeal to its core audience...I'm thinking of songs like "Struggling Lady" or "Downhome Blues", just to name a few.

Here are a few Malaco releases that I would definitively recommend:

"The Last Soul Company"-this is a box that chronicles Malaco from the very beginning up to the nineties, with great liner notes by Rob Bowman. This is something I listen to regularly.

http://www.trageser.com/archiv e/music/album-malaco.html

There is also a Japanese album, "Malaco Best Collection" that has some great unknown Malaco tracks by people like C.P. Love and Jimmy Dobbins.

Lately, Grapevine has been digging into the Malaco vaults and come up with some real winners. Have a look at:

http://www.grapevine-soul.com/ new_page_1.htm

http://www.grapevine-soul.com/ comingsoon.htm

In short, for those who like southern soul, and good "old school" singing, there are IMHO quite a few gems to be found in the Malaco catalogue...

Take care, Eva
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Soul-Brother (soulbrother)
3-Pundit
Username: soulbrother

Post Number: 38
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 217.234.188.82
Posted on Wednesday, April 21, 2004 - 5:23 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi Eva,
I agree with all you wrote.. and would we have gotten any Bobby Bland or Little Milton albums if Malaco had not been around...some hidden gems on their albums.
I hear what Rodman is saying..but around the time.. we were so thankful to have something with all the watered down dross of the 80's.
I also think Johnnie Taylor found a 'home' at Malaco and certainly left us with some wonderful stuff. If anyone wants.. I will make a list of 'gems' to look out for on any of the artists Eva mentioned.
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Eva (bigswede2002)
2-Debutant
Username: bigswede2002

Post Number: 12
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 130.237.171.253
Posted on Wednesday, April 21, 2004 - 5:42 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi Soul Bro',

I'd love a list of gems, so I'll know that to buy next. I'm sure I'll like anything you recommend, seeing that we have the same taste in music!

Eva
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roger (roger)
2-Debutant
Username: roger

Post Number: 20
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 217.35.87.17
Posted on Wednesday, April 21, 2004 - 6:37 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hello Everyone.

You might like to try the two "Southern Soul Cellar" CDs as an introduction to Malaco ..

Heres a review from R&B Music primer ..

http://www.rhythmandtheblues.o rg.uk/reviews/soulcellar.shtml

Roger
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Rodmann (rodmann)
3-Pundit
Username: rodmann

Post Number: 59
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 12.221.46.129
Posted on Wednesday, April 21, 2004 - 7:36 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Gee Eva, I didn't think that my comment about Malaco would offend you so much that you would start a whole topic about it! :-)

I guess my skepticism of Malaco Records stems from the fact that prior to their stint with Malaco, artists like Latimore, Z.Z. Hill, Denise LaSalle, Johnny Taylor, Shirley Brown, etc had been making excellent commercial Soul-Blues-Funk recordings on major labels with tight bands and elaborate string and horn charts. Once they hit Malaco their records was a bit of a letdown. The elaborate arrangements were replaced by what seems to be a cheap bar band. I think that Malaco also hurt the careers of their artists as far as the mainstream R&B crowd was concerned. The Malaco recordings were un-commercial Southern Bar Blues. That's a shame because with the right producers Johnnie Taylor, Latimore, Denise LaSalle, etc could've still been having hits on the R&B charts in the early 80's.

I'm no expert on the Malaco label and I can only go by the handful of songs that I've heard over the years. Barry & Eva, I'm open minded and I'd be willing to give any recordings that you recommend a chance if I can find them. You're so right about most R&B becoming watered down in the 80's Barry. I guess it was a considered a treat back then just to have anything new released on artists like Latimore!
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Eva (bigswede2002)
2-Debutant
Username: bigswede2002

Post Number: 13
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 130.237.171.253
Posted on Wednesday, April 21, 2004 - 8:57 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi Rodmann,

I'm at work right now, so I'll just have to throw in a few comments, and come back later...

I think the major problem for all of the artists you mentioned was that they simply *couldn't get* a contract with a major label at the time you're talking about. Even artists like Johnnie Taylor or Bobby Bland, with million sellers to their credit and a loyal following, were out in the cold. According to Rob Bowman's liner notes to the Malaco box set, most of them were able to continue their career in R&B in the 80's *thanks* to Malaco. Things had changed and their brand of soul-blues-funk was simply not commercially attractive to the majors any longer. Regardless of the quality of the output, I also think that Malaco suffers from lack of promotion from the 'urban' radio stations-their style is simply considered "old folks blues", and therefore hardly gets any air play.

Having said this, I have to say that I would also put most of these artists' 60's and 70's output a notch higher in my book. For example, I'd rather listen to Shirley Brown on Stax or Arista than Shirley Brown on Malaco. But you know, I'd rather listen to Aretha on Atlantic than latter day Aretha as well!;-)

Thanks for listening! I'm sure that there are others who'd want to pitch in with further comments.

Eva

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Soul-Brother (soulbrother)
3-Pundit
Username: soulbrother

Post Number: 39
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 217.234.188.82
Posted on Wednesday, April 21, 2004 - 9:55 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hey.. you two...don't apologise for your comments...it's all about opinions..Some rate Otis Redding as No 1.. I have 20 others I rate above him.. each to his own..it is a good thread about Malaco...

Barry
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Soul-Brother (soulbrother)
3-Pundit
Username: soulbrother

Post Number: 40
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 217.234.188.82
Posted on Wednesday, April 21, 2004 - 11:44 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

OK...went through a large bunch of Malaco albums of JT, BB, & Little M
Picked out some favourites..
Most albums from Milton are 50% blues so you take the good and the not so good(IMO) but I'm not a blues lover(in Europe we define the difference. Blues is Muddy Waters etc...)
Bobby B to a lesser extent..
JT...can do no wrong.. even the bad times are good.

Of course.. what y'all need is someone with all the albums to make up a best of....
failing that...then I have recommended the essential purchases

JOHNNIE TAYLOR

THIS IS YOUR NIGHT 1984
This Is Your Night
L.O.V.E - get any old legs a moving.. this one
A Love To Call Mine - great
Lady, My Whole World Is You - another dreamy ballad

WALL TO WALL 1986
Nearly all the album...this is essential

IN CONTROL 1988
It Don't Hurt Me Like It Used To
I Found A Love
Everything's Out In The Open

CRAZY 'BOUT YOU 1989 - worth the purchase for the 3 tracks below
Still Crazy - Oh Man.. what a track.. a weepie
Without You - a perfect marriage with Malaco here
I Was Looking For Somebody

JUST CAN'T DO RIGHT 1991
Crazy Over You
I Want Your Love
That's Just A Woman's Way


BOBBY BLAND

AFTER ALL 1986
After All
Angel
Second Hand Heart - all 3 are just wonderful

MEMBERY ONLY 1985
Mambers Only - classic! Just so good
Heart Open Up Again - oh yeh...
Sweet Woman's Love


MIDNIGHT RUN 1989
You've Got To Hurt Before You Heal - awesome.. I'll say it again.. awesome
Starting All Over Again - Phillip Mitchell's most recorded track

PORTRAIT OF THE BLUES 1991
Hurtin' Love - with the classic line 'If it hurts..drop it!'
I Can Take You To Heaven Tonight - Bland and a perfect ballad..
When Hearts's Grow Cold - another beauty


YEARS OF TEARS 1993
Hurtin' Time Again - upbeat ballad
I Just Tripped On A Piece Of Your Broken Heart - what a title...what a track
Somewhere Between Right & Wrong - a nother crushing ballad- with super horns

SAD STREET 1995
My Hearts's Been Broken Again - super

MEMPHIS MONDAY MORNING 1998
I Hate Missing You


LITTLE MILTON

ANNIE MAE'S CAFE 1987
I'm At The End Of My Rainbow - classic Bluessoul
A Real Good Woman - fine ballad.. great horns

BACK TO BACK 1988 - worth getting
I Was Trying Not To Break Down - superb slowie
Caught In The Act - a fair version of the Facts Of Life track
I Had) Too Much Heaven Last Night - a mid tempo groover
Fast Young Lady - funky sound
Wind Beneath My Wings - never heard a bad version.. and Mr. Campbell does a fine version

TOO MUCH PAIN 1990
Nothing I could recommend here.. cos it is very Bluesy!

STRUGGLIN' LADY 1992 - Milton back on form here-essential
Strugglin' Lady - a classic George Jackson track
Cafe Woman - another from George..horn driven track
Always On my Mind - Love the song.. and the production here..dare ya not to love this
A Nickel And A Nail - great version
I Keep Falling For You

CHEATIN'' HABIT 1996
What Do You Do When You Love Somebody - sway to this one..
This Time They Told The Truth - Z.Z. Hill's classic track

REALITY 1999
That's The Way I Feel About You - Womack song
I've Got To Remember - superb ballad..a highlight
I Want My Baby Back

Check out the webpage for album covers.. and full track listings
All of the three guys are under 'Great Voices'

www.soulcellar.co.uk

Regards

Barry

PS.. when I get time.. I may do the ladies...
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Heikki (heikki)
2-Debutant
Username: heikki

Post Number: 15
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 81.17.199.27
Posted on Wednesday, April 21, 2004 - 1:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi Barry!

Good suggestions. May I add a couple of more recent ones from the artists above:

Bobby Bland: Blues At Midnight (Malaco 7512; 2003)- some great soul tracks, and mostly with real instruments backing (on my list at # 10 of all the cd's released last year).

Johnnie Taylor: There's No Good In Goodbye (Malaco 7515; 2003) - sixteen tracks from the 80s and 90s that were not included on his albums at the time but many of which are even better than those included (my # 3 last year).

I see your further recommendations, and - if you may - perhaps make my additions.

Also, as Eva already mentioned, there are some excellent Malaco recorded compilations that have come out recently. Absolutely the tops is Troubled Waters/Deep Soul From The Deep South on Grapevine (GVCD 3010). Twenty-three tracks, this is one of the best - if not THE best - deep soul compilations ever.

Best regards
Heikki
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mel(andthensome) (mel)
3-Pundit
Username: mel

Post Number: 55
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 81.154.133.54
Posted on Wednesday, April 21, 2004 - 1:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I think theres some great Malaco soul 45's
have got quite a few to post but will have to leave to later.
regards
malaco-mel
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Soul-Brother (soulbrother)
3-Pundit
Username: soulbrother

Post Number: 43
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 217.234.188.82
Posted on Wednesday, April 21, 2004 - 2:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Heikki,
After ploughing through 20 Albums from the 80's & 90's for my selections..I took a break..thus missing the two albums you suggested. The JT 'There's No Good In My Goodbye' contains a track that maybe isn't 100% SOUL but should have made Number 1 in the States if Malaco had gotten behind it..'Take Me To The Mardi Gras'.. a duet with Floyd Taylor..
which leads us nicely to another album I can recommend... Floyd's 'Legacy' from 2002.. very good indeeed and very erie...son Floyd so like Pops!
As to the 'Troubled Waters' CD.. if I had had put that forward as a pro-argument for Malaco..there would have been no case to answer your honour!!
Rod..your round of drinks I think...

(Message edited by Soul-Brother on April 21, 2004)
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Rodmann (rodmann)
3-Pundit
Username: rodmann

Post Number: 65
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 12.221.46.129
Posted on Thursday, April 22, 2004 - 2:15 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

LMAO! OK, OK Barry, drinks are on me! LOL. I'm glad that you started this topic Eva. I guess I haven't been treating Malaco with the respect that they deserve. I see the point you guys are making. Anything new by Shirley Brown, Little Milton, Johnny Taylor, Latimore, Z.Z. Hill, Bobby "Blue" Bland, Denise LaSalle, etc is better than none at all! And I totally agree that 80's R&B as a whole was ridiculously watered down. Props to Malaco for sticking to their guns, signing such a stellar lineup of artists and releasing records with Soul! I can't wait to hear the tracks that have been suggested. I'll be listening with an open mind and I'll let you guys know how I like them. :-)
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Eva (bigswede2002)
2-Debutant
Username: bigswede2002

Post Number: 16
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 81.226.54.68
Posted on Thursday, April 22, 2004 - 4:23 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi peeps,

Guess I just can't let go of this thread!;-). Right now I'm listening to Dorothy Moore's "More Moore" album from 1997, and I'm again stunned by how good it is. She sounds even better in 1997 than she did in 1976. The songs are all heartfelt country flavoured ballads, and the backing is very sympathetic (no cheap bar room band, no sir!)

Had this been released in the 70's, I'm sure that "Knee Deep In A River" or "It Ain't Over Until Your Heart Says Goodbye" would have been on the national charts.

Eva
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Rodmann (rodmann)
4-Laureate
Username: rodmann

Post Number: 72
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 12.221.46.129
Posted on Thursday, April 22, 2004 - 7:45 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Eva! I'm sorry. Must I pay for my negative comments about Malaco records for the rest of my life! LOL. :-)

I've only heard 'Misty Blue' by Dorothy Moore and I must tell you that I've never cared for that song at all. Dorothy's vocal performance wasn't the problem but I just don't care for the song. Southern Soul at it's most boring IMO. I'd still be willing to give the CD that you speak of a listen though.

Now Eva, you do have to admit that songs like 'The Blues Are All Right', 'My Tu Tu', 'Down Home Blues', etc were a bit old fashioned and strictly for Blues fans. These songs are considered classics in today's Blues circles but Latimore, Little Milton & Johnnie Taylor material on Malaco is not the same as Latimore, Little Milton & Johnnie Taylor material on Glades, Chess and Stax. There's just something missing production wise that I can't put my finger on. 60's and 70's Blues on Chess, Duke and Stax was still Blues but it was a sort of Soul-Blues that could appeal to the R&B crowd. Maloco's recordings seem to be strictly for Blues fans. I'm no Malaco Records expert but this seems to be the case with everything that I've heard on that label.

I'm still willing to give Malaco Records another chance though because like you guys have pointed out any Latimore, Little Milton, Johnnie Taylor, etc material on Malaco is better than none at all! Can't wait to hear all of the tunes you guys have suggested. :-)
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Heikki (heikki)
2-Debutant
Username: heikki

Post Number: 22
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 62.248.149.27
Posted on Friday, April 23, 2004 - 12:36 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi Rodmann!

If you have a chance to purchase Johnnie Taylor's Wall To Wall album, which Barry recommends above, please don't hesitate. For me it's about as good as anything he did for Stax.

Best regards
Heikki
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Eva (bigswede2002)
2-Debutant
Username: bigswede2002

Post Number: 17
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 81.226.54.68
Posted on Friday, April 23, 2004 - 3:56 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hiya,

Rodmann, I'm not trying to prod you into buying the entire Malaco catalogue!;-) Honestly! I just took the opportunity to point out another good Malaco album, especially since none of the female artists had been treated on this thread.

In the end, I guess it's really a matter of taste, and I fully respect your opinions. I have a soft spot for "soulified" country songs and "Misty Blue" is one of my desert island tunes.

And, as I said, I do see your points. Malaco is basically trying to preserve a sound that had its heyday in the sixties and seventies-and their product is bound to sound derivative or outdated sometimes. Rather than comparing Malaco with the classic southern soul companies, I think we have to compare their product to what is else is being released in the same genre-and there I think that Malaco wins hands down, quality-wise. For example the "More Moore" album has Jimmy Johnson on guitar, David Hood on bass, Roger Hawkins on drums, a full horn section, strings, Rhodes/Chalmers/Rhodes of Hi fame doing backing vocals... the works. That's pretty impressive compared to most indie releases!

Also, don't forget that Stax was part of the soul mainstream in the sixties and seventies, and that many Stax artists even crossed over to the "white" market. From what I've understood Malaco is operating on a totally different scale; their core audiences are mainly middle-aged southern blacks, who probably like a little blues mixed into the bag. Putting a few blues or bluessoul songs on each album is a good marketing strategy. On the other hand, it seems that anything that isn't "urban" or "r&b" or hip hop gets the "blues" tag these days-stuff that we'd call "soul" in the good ole days!

Finally, I'm listening to Johnnie Taylor's "Raw Blues" right now...and you know what, it sounds pretty bluesy to me!;-) When it comes to southern soul at least, I feel that there has always been a pretty thin line between blues and soul-where would you put Bobby Bland, for example?

Thanks for your input, and again, everyone is entitled to his/her opinion. Without differing opinions, there wouldn't be any interesting threads like this one!

Eva
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Eva (bigswede2002)
2-Debutant
Username: bigswede2002

Post Number: 18
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 81.226.54.68
Posted on Friday, April 23, 2004 - 4:04 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi again,

I re-read your post, and I realized that we're both agreeing that blues has always been an ingredient in a lot of Stax/Chess etc. soul. So my argument concerning Johnnie Taylor's Stax output wasn't really a counter-argument, but a confirmation of your views!

Eva
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Soul-Brother (soulbrother)
3-Pundit
Username: soulbrother

Post Number: 50
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 217.234.156.171
Posted on Friday, April 23, 2004 - 8:34 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I told you two earlier..lol...anyway.. Eva.. we had already a submission from Rod.. but you being a lady.. you came back with a 'last word' lol.. and Rod decided all was not lost!
Seriously tho.. both arguments are excellent.. I'm just glad we are not discussing politics here on SoulfulDetroit!

Barry

PS
'Knee Deep In A River'.. is an awesome Ballad..Dot made some great Malaco stuff..oops.. sorry Rod.. there I go again...
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Jimmy Mack (luke)
3-Pundit
Username: luke

Post Number: 64
Registered: 4-2004
Posted From: 68.198.48.201
Posted on Friday, April 23, 2004 - 6:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ive never been able to have my local vg record store find stuff by Malaco-their distribution has been very poor-they put out a vg sounding PL and Bluebelles anthology Ive wanted.

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