By Clint (141.213.164.58 - 141.213.164.58) on Wednesday, October 17, 2001 - 05:28 am:

After noticing the decay of the buildings that once were Motown....now appear lifeless and an era of Detroit that can not be relived. Born and living in Detroit now as a teenager, I can't help thinking how things were before the riots.

It's curious to think how Detroit would have been changed if the Recording Industry remained in Detroit. Would we still have the "Flee To The Suburbs" reaction after the riots? Would it be easier to improve the city with more businesses in the city? The city would probably have gotten more recognition than Las Vegas, Los Angeles, or New York whenever it came to the city hub of the music industry!!!

Presently, the city appears to be in urban decay and despair that has a glimmer of hope through the new casinos, new building construction in the former Hudson's building, the Compuware headquarters, and the two new stadiums in downtown. Hopefully, Detroit soon (in my lifetime) could rival the vitality and population of the major cities like Chicago, LA, NYC, and DC like it did before the 60s riots.

Please tell me what YOU think about this! How would Detroit have changed if the recording business stayed in Detroit and now does Detroit have a chance to revitalize itself despite suburb flee, poor schools, and its infamous "Highest City Crime in The U.S." stereotype?

By david, glasgow, scotland (62.252.128.4 - 62.252.128.4) on Wednesday, October 17, 2001 - 09:27 pm:

detroit was already proclaimed one of the great recording centres by the time berry gordy left for los angeles in the early seventies.

to be brutally honest, the city for many years had two festering sores, - rampant racial discrimination and a heavy reliance on one manufacturing industry.

i believe that those are the factors which brought down the music industry in the city.

as the city gradually recovers, creates new jobs and strives for equal rights, disposable income will emerge once again and so will the music industry.

many of those who were involved in those heady days are still within the city limits. no doubt their grandchildren are there too.

when the opportunies re-emerge, those youngsters and their kids have got one hell of an act to follow.

By Lowell (66.32.112.44 - 66.32.112.44) on Saturday, October 20, 2001 - 06:03 am:

I know that you are talking about the Motown era recording industry and Motown in particular, because "records" are still flowing from Detroit most significantly in recent times with the Techno era.

To explain the complex soul of Detroit is almost impossible. One almost needs to see, feel and touch it from the inside. Much of its artistic energy grows from the dynamics of its problems, its visual decay and even its despised reputation.

There is also a bit of an inferiority complex in Detroit, a feeling that to make it big, one has to leave Detroit -- as if to conquer Detroit is nice, but New York, LA, London...

I think Barry Gordy might have wanted that, never realizing that he already had it and had it because of the energy of Detroit. He made a business decision and left memories and ruins in his wake.

By acooolcat (211.72.121.66 - 211.72.121.66) on Sunday, October 21, 2001 - 02:08 am:

The music & recording business has totally changed from the 1960s; people no longer hang-out on street corners harmonising - they stay in their bedrooms playing on a computorised keyboard or sample and mix. From Detroit to Berlin.
Lacking the synergy of a studio band, the camaradarie of a vibrant night club scene or local mom & pop record companies, compounded by the hoplessness of getting your music promoted, it's inevitable that the local recording business lacks impetous.

By Clay McMurray (64.108.57.30 - 64.108.57.30) on Monday, October 22, 2001 - 09:58 am:

Although Hip Hop and Rap seem to rule the charts and the air waves today, there are still a few
studio owners and real record producers here in Detroit. I for one, along with Mike Grace(former Motown Alumni)Bob Dennis(former Motown Alumni) Ed
Wolfrom(former Motown Alumni) are still hear and operating studio facilities. Despite the many changes that the city and the industry have gone through,we are collectively the some of the most
knowledgable,active studio professionals on this side of the map. If you're really into cutting music that lives forever check out one of us and then let me know if I'm wrong. I personally got started at Tera Shirma Studio's in the 60's and I'll always look back.

By John Lester (213.1.132.111 - 213.1.132.111) on Monday, October 22, 2001 - 07:07 pm:

Hi Clay

You don't get away with not mentioning their check letters as well (ha ha). Mike Grace is a new name on me...

How you getting on with new product....I was hoping for a follow up from Pree AND a nice tune on dear Cal Street would be a bonus!

Sincerely, as always

By Ralph Terrana (209.240.222.130 - 209.240.222.130) on Monday, October 22, 2001 - 10:06 pm:

Clay,
You were producing REAL music in those days.Stuff that stood the test of time.
Not a lot of this new generation of "producers " that will ever do that pal.
Keep up the good work I know you're doing.
Say hello to Mike and Ed for me when you see them.
Ralph

By cl (207.75.183.53 - 207.75.183.53) on Tuesday, October 23, 2001 - 02:11 am:

Hey Mr. Terrana don't forget my questions!!! Of course any other record producers, engineers and studio folks who care to respond would be most grateful.You guys were part of a fast diminishing breed.With the coldness and flatness of digital tell us how you recorded analog .

By acooolcat (211.72.121.66 - 211.72.121.66) on Tuesday, October 23, 2001 - 09:51 am:

I think Mike Grace's studio (The Sound Suite) has recently closed. Yet another one bites the dust.
Graham

By Clay (64.108.63.173 - 64.108.63.173) on Friday, November 30, 2001 - 05:37 am:

Hello John Lester,
I should have known you would be close to this site and making contact with everyone. As for the new Pree CD it's in the works and Cal will be recording sometime in early 2002. I've been busy handling my Management company and trying to keep my artist working. I recently spoke with Ivy Hunter and he and I discussed having him cut a few songs on the Velvelettes and Pree. There's quite a bit on the drawing board for 2002 including my new website which will cover a broader reflection of the music being developed in the Detroit indie artist area. With all due respect to the current trend of music I must admit that I will only record what I believe in and let the internet public decide what they want to buy. I'm not concerned with the Majors and this digital mania,I love 24trk 2 inch tape, the smell of it, the sound of it,the saturation and mix from it. I will record my product in this mode as long as I can purchase the materials needed. I hope to have something for your ears soon. You can give me a shout at: {ilovemusic2047@netscape.net)

Cheers,

By acooolcat (211.72.121.66 - 211.72.121.66) on Wednesday, December 05, 2001 - 04:05 am:

Clay, In this world of synthesized, digital, miniaturized MOR muzac, meeting your old friend Don Mancha brought a broad smile to my face. He was on his way to record a session, and under his arm was one of those old glass washboards! Fortunatley somethings (and people) don't change.
Best wishes, Graham

By david, glasgow, scotland (62.252.128.4 - 62.252.128.4) on Wednesday, December 05, 2001 - 08:31 pm:

graham
please give us an overview of don mancha's career.

By acooolcat (211.72.121.66 - 211.72.121.66) on Thursday, December 06, 2001 - 04:27 am:

Without listening to the interview recording, here's what I remember - Don told me he was at Motown for a while, but left after a clash with Barrett Strong about songwriting credits. This was after "Money" was released.
He worked at Correctone's studio around 1962, when they were still on 12th Street and was the first person to record Rose Batistte (at the Continental studio) - but the song was never released. That session was for Sam Motley.
Basically Don was freelancing around Detroit; he had a spell at Thelma records for a while and penned "I'm A Peace Loving Man" - the flip to Clay's "Sweet Lies" - making this a wonderful double sider. Another song he wrote, which I like, is Johnnie Mae Matthews' "My Destination" (Northern label) which features a novice McKinley Jackson on trombone.
He (and Don Davis) gave Clyde Wilson the stage name of Steve Mancha. He also named Marvin Jones - Jack Montgomery, and was involved in his tremendous recordings, such as "Dearly Beloved" and "Don't Turn Your Back On Me"
Graham

By david, glasgow, scotland (62.7.97.165 - 62.7.97.165) on Thursday, December 06, 2001 - 08:31 am:

great stuff graham. thanks

By acooolcat (211.72.121.66 - 211.72.121.66) on Friday, December 07, 2001 - 11:15 am:

I listened to the recording today and Don Mancha said he started with Robert West (Lupine etc) and was meant to replace Eddie Floyd, but Wilson became the new Falcon. He talked about recording a song called "Hong Kong" - but I don't think it was released. Has anyone ever heard of it?
Graham

By Marilyn (4.4.42.2 - 4.4.42.2) on Friday, January 11, 2002 - 05:24 pm:

Believe me,the recording industry is very alive & well in Detroit. I still put out records (mostly CDs though) all the time. I have several "oldies" artists,plus new ones. There are two studios I usually use,& they are both pretty constantly booked,so I'm not alone. Of course,they have two of the best engineers in the city. Actally,one of my artists came out with a CD,an album,plus a 45 on Norton not that long ago. Namely Gino Washington.For "oldies" artists,I also have Teddy Randazzo,Jamie Coe,Pharoahs/4 Imperials,Royal Jokers,Latin Counts,Ronnie Barron(for the real blues fans),& many more.Mickey Denton's son & I are working on some new artist projects also,so we keep pretty busy.

By Ralph Terrana (209.240.222.130 - 209.240.222.130) on Friday, January 11, 2002 - 06:14 pm:

Marilyn,
you have a pretty impressive stable of artists. All pros without a doubt. Say hello to Jamie for me. We go back a ways.
Ralph

By ErikT.O. (64.228.108.133 - 64.228.108.133) on Saturday, January 12, 2002 - 06:59 am:

I love this board... anyhow, for the guy (cl?) asking earlier on about analogue recording, there are two neat things I recommend reading offhand... one is Bob Dylan- The Recording Sessions (or similer title) by Clinton Heylin who describes each round of sessions including what I think is one of the best and cheapest recorded major label rock albums ever, The Basement Tapes (mono recorder with a mixer and 3-5 mics I think?)- sure Robbie Robertson cheated and tossed in a couple of Band 'Big Pink' outtakes but what the heck... also, if you dig reggae, there's an excellent cd on the Heartbeat label in which the book describes legendary reggae producer Jack Ruby's budget layout, it's called Jack Ruby Presents One Black Foundation.... as for current Detroit musical goings on I saw Enemy Squad here in Toronto & they rocked... led by drummer Gabe Gonzalez (sp?) they play funk with rapping and I thought they were better than Roots (whom I've seen 3x) who seem to be getting more recognition for the live band/ hip hop kinda tip...

By John Lester (213.1.167.81 - 213.1.167.81) on Saturday, January 12, 2002 - 11:16 am:

Erik

This Board is what you make it...... we all need to acknowledge the efforts of those responsible for setting it up in the first place...

and I think its never out of place to remind ourselves that those people are continuing to put in a lot of hard work to keep the site going.....

So a personal thank you from me too...especially to the backroom boys who are clearly computer wizards.......(BTW that explanantion to Ralph about cache made me laugh cos I thought cache was the american way of writing "cash"!! silly me)

By Ralph Terrana (209.240.222.130 - 209.240.222.130) on Saturday, January 12, 2002 - 03:04 pm:

John...I still spell cash..C..A...S...H

By John Lester (213.1.130.227 - 213.1.130.227) on Saturday, January 12, 2002 - 03:17 pm:

Ralph......

you know that old adage

IT TAKES ALL, ALL KINDS OF PEOPLE

;-)

By Ralph Terrana (209.240.222.130 - 209.240.222.130) on Saturday, January 12, 2002 - 03:28 pm:

John,
that has a familiar ring to it. In fact I seem to remember getting CASH for it. However when I go to my CACHE it appears empty. Maybe it was all an illusion.

By woof woof (213.1.128.51 - 213.1.128.51) on Saturday, January 12, 2002 - 05:21 pm:

Ok....you beat me down with that one!

Now get to that message about Rustix...I am on to you, like a dog with a bone and I won't let go till you answer.......HAHAHHAHA

woof woof!

By Ralph Terrana (209.240.222.130 - 209.240.222.130) on Saturday, January 12, 2002 - 07:30 pm:

See my reply regarding The Rustix. I just called Mike Valvano but he wasn't in. His wife took a message for me so I'm sure we will speak soon. OK...you can let go now.

By The Scary One (213.1.132.206 - 213.1.132.206) on Saturday, January 12, 2002 - 08:13 pm:

phew...I was worrying of gettign lock jaw..

You're a star Ralph.

I shall back off now and play the rest of your Stoney and Meatloaf album...but tell me this...why did you leave off The Way You Do The Things You Do....and was it intentional that you did it in a style which was similar to "Everyday People"..as you will recall, it was the flip side to my little classic "It Takes All Kinds Of People" and I have to say that that 45 mix is more to my taste and hits the right spot...

By Ralph Terrana (209.240.222.130 - 209.240.222.130) on Saturday, January 12, 2002 - 08:39 pm:

Scarey one,
I had no control over that album. I didn't even produce The Way You Do The Things You Do.Such is the business at times.

By Ralph Trrana (209.240.222.130 - 209.240.222.130) on Saturday, January 12, 2002 - 08:42 pm:

Scarey,
Also, check out the new Mike Valvano category.i reached him. I think I posted it twice. I see Mike's name twice. I better check this out.

By John Lester (213.1.132.206 - 213.1.132.206) on Saturday, January 12, 2002 - 08:53 pm:

Ralph

You have credit for production on the Way You do The things you Do....

It says Russ then you and then Mike...

On It Takes all Kinds Of People....its you then Russ then Mike....this side had arrangers Tom (Pete Rivera's fave man) Baird and David Vandepitte.....was David Canadian?

Will check out Mike Valvano now...

By Ralph Terrana (209.240.222.130 - 209.240.222.130) on Saturday, January 12, 2002 - 11:53 pm:

John,
No, Dave was American. Tom Baird was Canadian. He was originally from British Vancouver. He loved it there and would tell me all about it urging me to someday move there.

By John Lester (213.122.200.205 - 213.122.200.205) on Sunday, January 13, 2002 - 09:46 am:

British Vancouver..in Canada???????????

Ralph...you're confusing this brain of mine

Vancouver is in Canada right....or is it like Boston is in Lincolnshire (Rixy's hone town) and also Massachusetts.

By the way, congratulations to Rixy on him being voted top northern DJ ......I only found out yesterday...he's surely one of life's bestest people

By Ralph Terrana (209.240.222.130 - 209.240.222.130) on Sunday, January 13, 2002 - 02:41 pm:

Yes john..Canada..Just above Washington state on Canada's West Coast.

By Marilyn (4.4.42.25 - 4.4.42.25) on Monday, January 14, 2002 - 05:02 pm:

Ralph-
I'll be glad to say hello to Jamie for you. I cut his first record in 1959,in Bristol Bryant's basement studio,& sold him to my good friend,Bobby Darin. In all the years since then,nobody ever made an album on him,so I got everything together & put out a CD for him.

By Ralph Terrana (209.240.222.130 - 209.240.222.130) on Monday, January 14, 2002 - 07:06 pm:

That's great Marilyn. I wish you well with the CD. I remember Jamie's days with Bobby Darin. Did Jamie do How High Is High with you? I always liked that record. We did it in The Sunliners at the clubs.

By Marilyn (4.4.41.213 - 4.4.41.213) on Tuesday, January 15, 2002 - 05:18 pm:

Ralph-
No,he did that with Bobby. Put your mailing address on my e-mail. mb4music@yahoo.com. I'll send you a copy of the CD.