By STUBASS (64.12.97.7) on Thursday, July 03, 2003 - 04:15 pm:

OK KEV!!!...NOW THAT I'VE GOT YOUR ATTENTION!!!...I TOOK YOUR ADVICE WHEN I JOURNEYED TO THE RECORD STORE TO AQUIRE A COMPILATION OF THE "GREATEST HITS" OF THE "GREATEST SOUL SINGER" OF ALL TIME...OTIS REDDING!!!...GIVEN THE CHOICE OF TWO COMP C.D'S....I SELECTED "THE ULTIMATE OTIS REDDING"...A DIGITALLY REMASTERED SELECTION PRODUCED BY NO LESS THEN *WARNER BROTHERS*!!!...GOTTA TELL YOU...DESPITE ENJOYING EVERY BAR OF EVERY SONG (THAT I WAS ABLE TO DECIPHER) ON THE CD...SOME OF THE MIXING WAS DOWNRIGHT TERRIBLE!!!...ON "TRAMP" FOR EXAMPLE...YOU CAN HEAR CARLA...BUT OTIS IS MIXED DOWN SO LOW...YOU CAN HARDLY UNDERSTAND A WORD HE IS SAYING UNTIL HE GETS TO THE PART NEAR THE END WHERE HE IS TALKING BAOUT "SIX CADILLACS...FOUR FORDS...THREE MERCURY'S...TWO T-BIRDS...AND A MUSTANG"!!!...MANY OF THE OTHER TRACKS ARE JUST AS HORRIBLE!!!...COULDN'T STAND IT...SO I JOURNEYED BACK TO BORDERS TODAY...AND PURCHASED "THE VERY BEST OF OTIS REDDING"...COMPILED FROM THE *ORIGINAL* SINGLE MASTERS!!!...THIS CD IS A PLEASURE...STRONG...MIXED THE WAY IS SHOULD BE...NOTHING FANCY...JUST CLEAR...GREAT SEPERATION...AND OTIS COMES THROUGH LIKE A BELL!!!...JUST THOUGHT I'D LET YOU KNOW THAT SOMETIMES...THERE'S NOTHING LIKE THE ORIGINAL...NO MATTER HOW FAR TECHNOLOGY HAS SUPPOSEDLY ADVANCED!!!...STU(GROOVIN ON HIGH NOW)BASS

By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Thursday, July 03, 2003 - 04:42 pm:

Stu:
The CDs I recommended were Rhino-related CDs and the original single masters were used. The CDs were "The Very Best Of Otis Redding" (burgundy border with a closeup of Otis in a powder-blue suit) and "The Essential Otis Redding" (black & white cover). The remastering on both (as well as the Otis boxed set) is excellent.

"The Ultimate Otis Redding" - issued by Warner Special Products is a poorly-transferred collection of Otis' work. The CD contains stereo mixes of his hits, some of which do not resemble the performances mixed to mono (check out "Respect" on both discs & you'll hear what I mean). This is the CD I used to play during my radio shifts and the sound made me cringe. I do not recommend this particular Otis Redding CD.

Kevin Goins - KevGo

By STUBASS (205.188.209.109) on Thursday, July 03, 2003 - 05:04 pm:

THANKS KEVGO!!!...*NOW* YOU TELL ME (JUST JIVIN)!!!...AS FOR "RESPECT"...YES AND NO!!!...ON THE RHINO DISC...IT IS A BETTER OVERALL SOUND QUALITY...HOWEVER...I MUST ADMIT...THAT ON THE WARNER VERSION...THE BASS LINE IS PUSHED MUCH FURTHER TO THE FOREFRONT...AND SOUNDS A LOT CLEANER...AND TO A BASS PLAYER..."THE DUCK" RULES!!!...THANKS AGAIN!!!...STUBASS

By STUBASS (205.188.209.109) on Thursday, July 03, 2003 - 05:11 pm:

PS TO KEV!!!...AFTER LISTENING TO PART OF THE NEW CUT...THE CD IN MY CAR STARTED REJECTING THE CD...AND ALL OTHERS AS I TRIED TO SEE WHAT THE PROBLEM WAS!!!...DAMN CAR AIN'T THREE MONTHS OLD YET...SO I CALLED MY SERVICE DIRECTOR AND TOLD HIM TO ORDER ME ANOTHER AUDIO UNIT...BUT SINCE I'M OFF TODAY...AND WITH A HOLIDAY WEEKEND COMING...IT COULD BE A WEEK OR SO UNTIL I GET A WORKING CD PLAYER!!!...DO YOU SUPPOSE THAT MY SYSTEM WAS JUST NO MATCH FOR OTIS'S SOUL...AND HE JUST BLEW THE ENTIRE UNIT UP???...NOW THATS WHAT I CALL "THE BADDEST SOUL SINGER" IN HISTORY" IF HE CAN DO ALL THAT!!!...STUBASS

By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Thursday, July 03, 2003 - 05:14 pm:

So the question on the floor is.....
....why remix an original in the first place? I'm not talking about the gazillion versions of "Help Me Ronda", but why take the "original" and allegedly "improve" it? I've purchased CDs looking for one version of a song, and end up with something completely different. Not necessarily remixed, per se, but maybe "enhanced". Is this part of the transfer process to CD?

By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Thursday, July 03, 2003 - 06:38 pm:

Doug:
When Stax/Volt went multi-track in late 1965, Atlantic Records sent Tom Dowd to Memphis to install the then-new Ampex machines.

After that was done, the first thing they did was cut tracks for what became the OTIS BLUE album. This album was earmarked for stereo release so Otis recut "Respect" and recorded a few other tunes for album that were cut originally on the studio's Ampex full-track machine.

Stax/Volt wanted to cash in on the stereo-phile marketplace that was growing at the time and the OTIS BLUE album was to lead the way.

I hope this answers your question.

Kevin Goins - KevGo

By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Thursday, July 03, 2003 - 06:45 pm:

Sorta, but I probably didn't explain myself well. I get the impression that some CDs I buy are either re-mixed or electronically "enhanced" for the CD market, and the "sound" has been altered from their original recording, changing the "feel" of the music. My question is, then, why do the original analog recordings on vinal sound "better" then their allegedly superior CD remasters?
Kev (Eli, Mike and all the wizards).....
.....I appreciate very much your sharing of your technical knoledge, and taking the time to answer these questions.
Thanks

doug

By Eli (152.163.252.68) on Thursday, July 03, 2003 - 09:20 pm:

What happens sometimes is that a "simulated" stereo version is made by delaying on side ever so slightly, maybe about 25- 30 ms and then changing the eq on one side.
Doing this can definitely alter the character and charm of the original mono master.
Also, "stereo" in those days was more or less bi naural mixing and it was where you had two discrete mono signals panned full right and full left and that took the balls out of the mix.
There were no devices available to give "width" to mixes as are commonly used today such as digital delays etc.

By STUABSS (152.163.252.68) on Friday, July 04, 2003 - 12:12 am:

WELL NOW THAT I (WITH MY TECHNOLOGICALLY CHALLENGED BRAIN) AM ALL CONFUSED...I CAN ONLY SAY THAT THE VERSION OF "RESPECT" ON THE WARNER CD..THE DIGITAL ONE...IS A KICKIN TRACK...AND THE BASS LINE IS DIFFERENT THAN ON THE RHINO TRACK!!!...I'LL TAKE THAT CUT ANY DAY!!!...AS FOR THE REST OF THE TUNES...THE WARNER COPY SUCKS NEXT TO THE RHINO ONE!!!...I AM AMAZED THAT SOME OF THE WARNER TRACKS WERE EVEN RELEASED IN THAT TYPE OF CONDITION!!!...STUBASS

By Eli (64.12.97.7) on Friday, July 04, 2003 - 02:41 pm:

There is a version of Band of Gold out there with a slightly different sitar part and an added bridge section and some of the vocal sounds like a different performance!!

By M.McLeanTech (66.218.41.193) on Sunday, July 20, 2003 - 09:13 pm:

Eli,

All this stuff that seems like nothing to me is fine, but I want you to know that I am very sure that Annie and I are going to get married.

By dvdmike (68.72.87.87) on Sunday, July 20, 2003 - 09:16 pm:

Hey Kev, when's that Jackie Wilson compilation coming out?

By STUBASS (205.188.209.109) on Sunday, July 20, 2003 - 11:46 pm:

NOW I'M TOTALLY CONFUSED!!!...WHAT IS THE LINK BETWEEN AN "UP YOU" THREAD AND AN IMPENDING WEDDING???...MUST BE SOMETHING THERE ( AND IT MAY HAVE BEEN APPROPRIATE REGARDING MY FIRST MARRAGE)...BUT LET ME BE AMONG THE FIRST TO WISH THE HAPPY COUPLE...MIKE AND ANNIE...BEST WISHES FOR A MOST HAPPY LIFE TOGETHER!!!...ALSO...STILL WAITING FOR MY LUNCH!!!...STU

By melandthensome (217.14.178.109) on Monday, July 21, 2003 - 05:06 am:

Kev
have you seen/heard the CD of
the Brunswick(northern Soul)stuff that has been released?
mel.

By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Monday, July 21, 2003 - 11:35 am:

dvdmike:
Right now Brunswick is focusing on a 2CD collection of R&B hits from the 1950s throught the 1980s. As for the Jackie Wilson project of unreleased masters, I submitted the track listing to the company. The next step is transferring the 4-track-tapes. I'll let you know how that is progressing.

Mel:
I'm aware of a two-cd compilation that Union Square Music put together - I saw a copy at my local Tower Records store. Are you referring to that collection? (It's in a cinnamon-red package with the faces of the Brunswick acts on the cover).

Kevin Goins - KevGo

By MEL&THEN SOME (217.14.178.41) on Monday, July 21, 2003 - 02:38 pm:

Yeah Kev
thats the one.
mel.

By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Friday, July 25, 2003 - 08:18 am:

Kevin......
....i have a radio/computer question I can't find a good simple answer for out here. Would you be willing to tackle it for me? DMS4@charter.net is my e-mail if you're willing to give it a go.

Doug Shirk
Wenatchee, WA

By Steve Litos (209.100.86.4) on Friday, July 25, 2003 - 11:24 am:

Doug - Yesterday, I heard a good example of the CD/Record differences. It was Frank Sinatra's version of "You Brought A New Kind Of Love To Me". It was recorded in the 1950's and on the Vinyl version, Frank's voice is plastered in a very thick haze of reverb. It's almost an instrument onto itself. Yesterday, I played it the CD version and the reverb was gone. To me it was an improvement.

By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Friday, July 25, 2003 - 11:31 am:

But that's the kind of stuff that bothers me sometimes. If you were looking for the vinal version, the CD would have been a dissapointment. Some kind of "remix" notice should be placed on "altered" CD versions.

By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Friday, July 25, 2003 - 11:39 am:

Steve:
Was the vinyl version of the Sinatra tune in mono or "duophonic" - the latter used reverb and boy did it sound horrible on many Capitol recordings!
Kevin Goins - KevGo

By Steve Litos (209.100.86.4) on Friday, July 25, 2003 - 03:12 pm:

Kevin - I'm not sure what the album was. The guitarist/singer in my former band has it. I looked at the Frank Sinatra sessionography and found out he did two versions on 1/9/56 & 2/21/63 both with Nelson Riddle! I bet it was the 1963 version in Duophonic to give his voice that out of phase sound. The CD version was on a jukebox, so I'd have to go back to the bar!
-Steve