By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Tuesday, July 01, 2003 - 04:00 am:

Look on different Spinners albums and you will see different spellings of this ficticion. When the Spinners came to Los Angeles to promote the first Atlantic release I went to the Total Experience and asked Bobby Smith where the new guy came from and Bobby said "Who Phil Wright". The day before Phil's funeral at the Angeles Funeral Home, next door to Stevie Wonder's KJLH radio station (84), I went to view the remains and say a farewell to the guy that redefined lead singing in a soul group. When I arrived it was 3 in the afternoon and I was alone in a small theatre that could have housed at least 150 people. It was an eerie feeling to think that it was just Phil and me. I stayed all of 15 minutes and left to sign the guestbook. As I did I noticed that there had only been seven (7) other people there before me, all day. According to the Funeral Director all were family and all had the surname of Wright. They had all signed the book as members of the Wright family. Where Walker came from I do not know but I would venture to guess that it was the same place that all of those spellings of his other names came from. Just because you heard it from the horses mouth is no reason to consider it gospel.

By doowopsvoice (198.81.26.170) on Thursday, July 03, 2003 - 12:10 pm:

I was always curious to find out how Phillipe had developed his sound, I say sound because it was a combination of style, timing, and charisma. I had to ask Spider Harrison for his phone # and he was kind enough to give it to me and Phil was not at all upset that he did. Phil and I spoke for about 30 minutes and I found out that he had also been influenced by the person that had had the most on me, Billy Stewart. Generally a recognizable vocal style was developed by one's exposure to at least three other vocalists and he was no exception. He said that his two others were Sam Cooke and Otis Redding (Gotta-Gotta-Gotta. Mine were Billy, Phil, and Neil Sedaka.

By Aba21 (208.191.122.239) on Tuesday, July 08, 2003 - 01:27 pm:

On the Spinners Live lp, he give a pretty good imitation of Sam Cooke, Al Green and Otis Redding, telling you who his infuences were.

By doowopsvoice (198.81.26.170) on Tuesday, July 08, 2003 - 02:06 pm:

Aba21
I am sure that you've heard Billy Stewart, believe it or not he was the greatest influence on Phillippe and myself but the irony is that it is not a sound thing. His influence was on timing. If you listen to Phil and try to sing along more than likely you will get lost because of timing. That is the main reason why noone has been able to duplicate Phil's style. Can you think of anyone that has come close?

By souljones (62.253.64.6) on Tuesday, July 08, 2003 - 05:35 pm:

aah, Billy Stewart. 'Sitting In The Park' is one of the underated classics of sweet soul music. Was it ever quoted that it was a major influence on 'Have You Seen Her' by the Chi-Lites, not just in lyrical content but also in the airy feel of the song. I've never read any book that made the connection. Another great song is 'Do I Love You'.

By Ritchie (62.254.0.9) on Tuesday, July 08, 2003 - 06:05 pm:

Offhand, the only cut I can think of that brought Billy Stewart to mind was Hey Lady, by Entertainment 4. And I do take the point about Phillipé Wynne. I'll bear that in mind next time I'm spinning the Spinners :o)

By doowopsvoice (198.81.26.170) on Thursday, July 10, 2003 - 03:58 pm:

Aba/21***Ritchie***SoulJones
The reason that Billy developed the familiar off timed vocal style was because he had to accompany himself on piano and he could not sing and play at the same time. He would play then sing, play then sing, play then sing some more so his lead vocal almost always came in on 3 not 1 like the normal lead. That was the secret of Phil's vamps and ad libs, he came in on three. That is why most people can't follow him, it is too vocally clumsy. Go to my resume page and listen to what I did with the last fifty seconds of "Payback is a dog", ( soulwalking.co.uk/Lonnie%20Cook.html )it is the timing that gives it the feel. So that kinda feel from Phil and the excellence in production and writing from Thom Bell and crew was what took the Spinners from the bottom of the crop to the #1 spot amongst 70's soul groups. Phil was Mr. Right

By doowopsvoice (198.81.26.170) on Tuesday, July 15, 2003 - 02:43 am:

(..)****(..)****(..)Ritchie,
Have you had a chance to listen yet? I mean you were going to listen to the Spinners (Phil's vamps and ad libs mostly) with a view to Phil's judicious use of timing. He mastered something that Billy Stewart had started in the fifties and noone else in between could. When people listned to him they were caughtup in what he was doing without even being aware of the scope of it. While you are listening notice the similarity in voice quality between Bobby and Phil. It is so close that the genius (Thom Bell) was bold enough to have Bobby sing an entire song and Phil was only in the background. The song was a great hit for them but to this day everyone I have pointed it out to thought that Phil shared the lead. Know the song??????? (..) That's the egghead that I'll consider you if you know this, or figure it out.

By 1Wicked (24.126.64.120) on Tuesday, July 15, 2003 - 03:38 am:

I'll let Ritchie answer the question (Phil sang background & ended it with ad libs though)....but the 1st "shared lead" hit was "One Of A Kind Love Affair", wasn't it ? That seemed to have been the public's first taste of Phil up front....and one of the elements that made the Spinners so big at the time.

By RD (65.150.228.171) on Tuesday, July 15, 2003 - 07:11 am:

The first shared lead was "Could It Be I'm Falling In Love."

For Eli: Lynn Tolliver is the program director of a radio station in Youngstown, Ohio.

By RD (65.150.228.171) on Tuesday, July 15, 2003 - 07:25 am:

Also, Philippe Wynne sang "One of a Kind Love Affair" alone, it was not a shared lead.

By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Tuesday, July 15, 2003 - 02:06 pm:

Hey guys, you are homing in on some of the aspects of the Bell, Wynne, Spinners phenomenon. I made the statement that Bobby and Phil's voices were very, very similar and RD says that Phil sang the lead on "One of a kind" 100%, I say he did not (my ear says he did not). My ear says that 'I never thought about the day would come' is Bobby' then Phil sings the next line, then Bobby sings 'She wrote a line or two upon the wall' and Phil's next note overlaps Bobby's last melismatic word (wall) when he says 'Said i'm leavin' you---'. Listen to it and tell me why they would have Phil overdub Phil at that point. Me thinks Thom Bell fooled you. Ask Bobby Eli.
(..)Back to my original ?, What song did Bobby Smith definitely sing all the way thru (alone) that was a megahit for the Spinners?

By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Tuesday, July 15, 2003 - 02:09 pm:

Wicked,
On the song in ? Phil did not sing any lead, vamp, or ad lib.

By doowopsvoice (198.81.26.170) on Tuesday, July 15, 2003 - 02:41 pm:

Many years ago I was told that there was a duet featuring Phil and a female megastar (not Dionne)
in the can and that it would never be released. True?? Anybody know for sure??

By RD (65.150.229.173) on Tuesday, July 15, 2003 - 02:51 pm:

I've been listening to Bobby Smith sing since the Tri-Phi days, he sounds nothing like Philippe Wynne or vice versa. There is no shared lead on "One of a Kind Love Affair" it's all Philippe Wynne.

By bluedragon3 (64.236.243.31) on Tuesday, July 15, 2003 - 03:23 pm:

Bobby sings the chorus on "One Of A Kind." Lead vocalists are listed for each song in the new Spinners box (which the band co-produced).

By RD (65.150.229.173) on Tuesday, July 15, 2003 - 03:28 pm:

I just listen to the song Blue Dragon and hear what you some are talking about but I dunno. I thought people was talking about some of the lead lines which one might think was him, but the chorus? Aren't they all singing on the chorus? Liner notes can be wrong; I hear they also say the Spinners started as the Dominoes when in fact they began as the Domingoes, so don't put all of your stock in liner notes.

By bluedragon3 (64.236.243.31) on Tuesday, July 15, 2003 - 04:04 pm:

Re "One Of A Kind": Lonnie's note (above) is right on target where Bobby comes in on that song.
And the big hit Bobby sang by himself is "I'll Be Around." A lotta folks think Phillipe was the lead vocalist on all the hits, cause the timber of their voices is similar...and I think that comes back to what doowopsvoice was saying about Thom Bell's genius for blending.

By RD (65.150.229.173) on Tuesday, July 15, 2003 - 05:01 pm:

Comes in and blends but he sings no solo lead lines in that song. And only people who don't know the Spinners thought that Philippe sang lead on "I'll Be Around"; People who have been Spinners' fans since "That's What Girls Are Made For" didn't think so...they knew better. Bobby Smith's voice isn't as as heavy as Wynne and they don't sound anything alike.

By doowopsvoice (198.81.26.170) on Tuesday, July 15, 2003 - 05:53 pm:

bluedragon,
(..)(..)(..)You are the resident egghead. The song was "I'll Be Around", Bobby sang all of the lead. Everyone else try to listen to "One of a kind" and you will hear the two lines that Bobby sings (only those two). All the rest is Philippe'. So it must be considered a shared lead production. Next dilemma is who is singing the high pitched voice on "Games people play"???
Side note is that I always thought that Thom was grooming Bobby to be able to continue the sound in case Phillipe decided to leave.

By RD (65.150.228.122) on Tuesday, July 15, 2003 - 06:11 pm:

Doowopsvoice, what are those two lines? I want to play the song and listen and see if I hear what you and some others seem to be hearing?

Bobby couldn't have took over for Philippe on the songs Wynne made famous cause his voice is too light and isn't strong enough; he also doesn't project as well on stage. This was the problem Motown had with Bobby Smith and why they barely promoted the Spinners when he was their lead singer. They didn't get behind them until G. C. Cameron joined.

By Handsome (170.118.157.134) on Tuesday, July 15, 2003 - 06:15 pm:

. Next dilemma is who is singing the high pitched voice on "Games people play"??? That is Barbara Ingram (who used to background with Carla Benson & Yvette Benton) I may have their last names reversed) I'm quite sure Bobby Eli knows them.

By Handsome (170.118.157.134) on Tuesday, July 15, 2003 - 06:18 pm:

And RD, I beg to differ with you, Bobby & Phillpe's voices were similar but you can tell the difference listening closely. Mighty Love is one example where they trade off leads, Bobby starts it off, and Phillipe' brings it on home. I remember seeing the Spinners back in the 70's where Bobby sang, I'll be around. That's him on lead by himself.

By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Tuesday, July 15, 2003 - 06:40 pm:

(Copied and pasted from above)For RD
Hey guys, you are homing in on some of the aspects of the Bell, Wynne, Spinners phenomenon. I made the statement that Bobby and Phil's voices were very, very similar and RD says that Phil sang the lead on "One of a kind" 100%, I say he did not (my ear says he did not). My ear says that 'I never thought about the day would come' is Bobby' then Phil sings the next line, then Bobby sings 'She wrote a line or two upon the wall' and Phil's next note overlaps Bobby's last melismatic word (wall) when he says 'Said i'm leavin' you---'. Listen to it and tell me why they would have Phil overdub Phil at that point. Me thinks Thom Bell fooled you. Ask Bobby Eli.
(..)Back to my original ?, What song did Bobby Smith definitely sing all the way thru (alone) that was a megahit for the Spinners?
*************************************************
(Another copy paste) Someone said
Bobby couldn't have took over for Philippe on the songs Wynne made famous cause his voice is too light and isn't strong enough; (Never said he could replace Phil but I implied that "I'll be around" proves he could hold his own, says doowopsvoice)he also doesn't project as well on stage (you are right, VERY LITTLE CHARISMA). This was the problem Motown had with Bobby Smith and why they barely promoted the Spinners when he was their lead singer. They didn't get behind them until G. C. Cameron joined.

By RD (65.150.229.94) on Tuesday, July 15, 2003 - 06:55 pm:

I suggest some of you should listen to the Original Spinners LP and their early sides on Tri-Phi Records to get a better feel for Bobby Smith's voice. Though the examples you brought up Lonnie Cook are definitely borderline.

I'm a Spinners fan from way back, I use to see them sing in little bucket of blood clubs. I like Bobby Smith's voice, always have. But it's not the strongest instrument in the world and I fail to see any resemblance with Wynnes' but then I was on their bandwagon long before they signed with Atlantic Records.

By doowopsvoice (198.81.26.170) on Tuesday, July 15, 2003 - 07:15 pm:

RD'
My only point was that the bridge on "One of a kind 'sounds like' Phil sang all four lines but he did not. I do believe it was no accident that that was the case. I think Thom did it on purpose. Cannot think of any other reason for someone to sing only two lines of the lead in a song. You are absolutely right about Bobby's voice in the past but please allow for growth and learning. He also may not have had to tackle such as the intricate melodies that Thom laid on them. From Motown to Atlantic they were as different as night is from day. Everything changed so much I was traumatized and delighted at the same time.
Bravo Thom, Phil, The Spinners, and the writers.
They all were in a musical zone for a few years, now I hope to spearhead a movement to do at least one more recording of that quality, with them.

By RD (65.150.229.94) on Tuesday, July 15, 2003 - 07:36 pm:

Doowopsvoice, like the Four Tops the Spinners are skilled singers. Intricate harmonies were no problem for them and they were much faster learners than the Temptations who were notoriously slow to nail intricate harmonies, which frustrated some producers. The Tempts' liked Smokey's stuff because it was relatively simple and he let them add their own harmonies. The Spinners' roots are doowop/R&B with shades of modern harmony taught to them by Havey Fuqua.

While more skilled than the Tempts their voices aren't as dynamic or as diversed. What attracted Thom Bell to the Spinners was the harmony they did on "That's What Girls are Made For."

In the old days, Bobby Henderson handled the high parts, he has the highest voice of the original four but long ago lost the ability to hit certain notes with any consistency.

By bluedragon (64.236.243.31) on Tuesday, July 15, 2003 - 09:35 pm:

I like Henry's voice a lot too. Thom Bell really knew how to make good use of him in the vocal arrangements.

John Edwards (Phillipe's replacement) also gets overlooked, probably because the group got into disco. But there's some amazing stuff on the box set. The last track ("Memories Of Allison") sounds like a return to doowop and John's vocals are unbelievable. There isn't one kiddie group today that can compare to these guys!

By RD (65.150.242.102) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 04:12 am:

It's quite possible that T. Bell punched in Bobby Smith's on those two lines because Philippe wasn't doing them quite the way he wanted them done and time was of the essence. Providing that is indeed B. Smith singing those two lines.

By Handsome (170.118.157.134) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 10:35 am:

Bobby Eli, where are you? ha ha ha!

By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 12:42 pm:

Handsome,
Eli could probably attest to or verify what the guys have said in the boxed set because, more likely than not , he was there for those sessions.
Maybe he is on vacation and not monitoring the forum. Even if he comes in everyday there are way too many topics to get involved in.

By Eli (172.144.221.15) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 12:47 pm:

Ok, here 's the deal.

I was with Thom in his office one day when he told me his intention of recording the Spinners.
I asked him why the Spinners when he had carte blanche and could record anyone he wanted to.
He said that he liked Bobby Smith's voice because he had a peculiar style where he had a lot of inflections on the upbeat as in an eighth or sixteenth note tie over in to the next bar which stylistically(no pun intended) is prevelant in a lot of the Spinners material.

All of the lead tradeoffs that you hear are intentional and an indication of the genius of Thom Bell. Phillipe did not sing those two lines, originally.

Also, Thom discovered Henry's lush baritone quite by accident one day and I believe that I dont want to lose you may have been the first one, but dont quote me on it.

Thom is a master producer and IMO, his time wil come around again.
At that time Phillipe had not joined just as yet but Thom was told about him via the group.

By Handsome (170.118.157.134) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 01:04 pm:

Thanks Lonnie, you are right,but I found Eli.

Eli, thanks for clearing this up!

Handsome

By Eli (172.144.221.15) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 01:13 pm:

The last line of my previous post should have been placed at the end of the first paragraph!!

By bluedragon3 (64.236.243.31) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 01:24 pm:

Hey Bobby, were you on the "Then Came You" sessions? I read somewhere that Thom cut that track with some of the Funk Brothers at the Beach Boys old studio in Hollywood, but kept it quiet. Do you know anything about this? Also there are rumours about the Winter Brothers (Johnny & Edgar) playing on "Rubberband Man." Is there any truth to that also?

By RD (65.150.242.66) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 02:03 pm:

Jimmy Roach cut four songs on the Spinners for Atlantic that included "Oh Lord I Wish I Could Sleep," prior to Thom Bell working with them. Philippe Wynne was a member and sang on the four songs that were shelved so he was with them at their inception at Atlantic Records.

Bobby Smith may have cut the tune originally and Thom Bell decided he wanted a stronger vocal. I don't doubt this at all, but is Smith singing on the version that was released? He certainly doesn't sing those two lines live.

By doowopsvoice (198.81.26.170) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 03:36 pm:

Eli,
I am still waiting for the answer to an e-mail that I sent you. I have enough material to do twenty lp's on the Spinners that would rival anything they ever did. I want Thom to work with me. I have spoken to Buddy Allen three times about it. Proof is in the pudding. Clicking on my name on the forum will produce an e-mail form.

RD
The horse is dead you can stop beating it.

By RD (65.150.228.192) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 04:06 pm:

Doowopsvoice, this horse isn't dead and nothing has been proven. Maybe Heiki can jump in on this one he recently spoke with the Spinners. I don't hear Bobby Smith singing any lead lines on "One of a Kind" and I've been listening to the Spinners longer than you or Bobby Eli. You put too much stock in liner notes, previous liner notes on Spinners CDs and LPs said Harvey Fuqua sang lead on "That's What Girls are Made For." Do you believe that too?

By Handsome (170.118.157.134) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 04:12 pm:

Can anyone get a hold of Bobbie Smith?

Bobbie, can you hear us...It's SDF!

By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 04:50 pm:

I've listented to that song over and over because of this debate. I surely can't tell whether it is Bobby on those two sentences. It sounds like Phil with an overdub.

By bluedragon3 (64.236.243.31) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 04:59 pm:

Re "the dead horse" (Bobbie's vocals on "One Of A Kind"): Record labels often get things wrong with liner notes, but it'd be pretty embarrasing this time around with the box set, considering that the Spinners are listed as producers. I would think that, at the very least, Bobbie & the others looked over that information, which includes lead vocal credits - for the first time! How else could they (the label) verify that stuff?

By bluedragon3 (64.236.243.31) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 05:01 pm:

P.S. And Bobbie is listed as a lead vocalist on that track

By bluecragon3 (64.236.243.31) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 05:02 pm:

P.S....with Phillipe.

By brown8644 (166.107.155.42) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 05:22 pm:

It's Bobby on those two lines, I been a spinners
man since 1972. It's was that sound that defines
my music style to this day. It is beyond a doubt
that it's bobby on those two line. There are
time on various song that bobby and Phillipe
sound just alike. It's incredible, that has been
my group and if you listen for the inflection on
that song when those two line come up you can tell
that the voice changes. It's the talent of Bell and the powerhouse vocals of each man.

By Chad (152.163.252.68) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 05:39 pm:

You guys are nuts, Bobby's not singing lead on that song and I've been a fan since the mid-sixties.

By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 06:26 pm:

RD
Yes that is Harvey's voice on that song, listen to many of the Mooglows records and then listen to "That's what girls are made for" again.

When I first heard "One of a kind" I could hear the differences in the lead, (I rely on my ear not liner notes). The horse is stinking up the place.

Chad
Looks like you are trying to ride it.

Everyone
I asked for an evaluation of the last 50 sec of "Payback is a dog" found on my resume page and got no response. Noone listened? Here it is again. www.soulwalking.co.uk/Lonnie%20Cook.html
(bottom of the page)
I need your feedback

By Handsome (170.118.157.134) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 06:30 pm:

Lonnie, are you a singer?

By RD (65.150.229.37) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 06:38 pm:

Hey Lonnie, Bobby Smith told Sue, one of the liner notes writers for that Spinners' CD to make sure the true story about "That's What Girls Are Made For" finally came out, which is, Harvey isn't singing the lead. Now I know you don't have a clue as to what Bobby Smith sounds like if you think Harvey is singing lead on TWGAMF. I hope you're not still spreading this untruth that few people believed in the first place.

By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 06:45 pm:

Guys,
I did not mean to set you against one another but a part of what this forum has to be about is arriving at the truth. When you read a biography do you not want it to be truthful. There are many ironies and oddities surrounding the Spinners but the bottom line is that they were (and historically are)the greatest soul group ever.

(On another note.)
You get spoiled when you expect those you hold in high regard to live up to your expectations and I was totally disappointed when the Happiness is lp came out because I did not consider it up to the standard that had been set. In later years I listened to it over and over and decided that on a scale of 100 (for Thom, Phil, and the Spinners)I would have to give an 85.

By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 06:58 pm:

Handsome
I am singing over the last 50 seconds of the song "Payback is a dog" on my page. I am also singing on three other songs there.
www.soulwalking.co.uk/Lonnie%20Cook.html

RD (It ain't about confrontation)
Bootsy Collins will tell you that Phil Wynne told him and many others that his name was Walker. (Please read the very first comment on this thread) The horses mouth is not reliable. I will conceed that if what you are saying is true he was doing his best to imitate Harvey (the owner of the label). Let's ask Harvey.

By RD (65.150.229.37) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 07:22 pm:

Ask Harvey! Harvey is probably the one who started the rumor.

Lonnie, so you're saying Bobby Smith lied to Sue Whithall? And that my ears aren't worth a damn? Dude, that's Bobby Smith singing lead of TWGAMF period.

By bluedragon3 (64.236.243.31) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 07:56 pm:

I agree with the assessment that "Happiness Is" was a real letdown. And in my opinion, the followup, "Yesterday, Today & Tomorrow" was even worse.

What I really don't understand is why Bobbie wasn't used more after Philippe left (by ANY of those later producers). It's as if they BOTH left the group! John Edwards came on board and sang almost all the hits from then on.

By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 10:22 pm:

Sorry to be controversial but what hits did John sing, they haven't had a HIT with him ever. The PURPLE PEOPLE EATER sold six million in the fifties but was hyped crap, so was "Working my way back", "Cupid", Games people play and "Then came you". The powers that be can do anything they want, have you never wondered why their real chartbusters were not Phillipe lead? John had a very nice voice but he never had a hit as a solo and he never had a real hit as a Spinner.

By Scratcher (65.238.127.118) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 10:25 pm:

Lonnie F.Y.I., the late Bobby Lester led most of the Moonglows' recordings not Harvey Fuqua. So if you're listening to the Moonglows thinking that's Harvey leading "Most of All," Sincerely" and some others, think again.

By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 10:39 pm:

(I say it should not be confrontational)

RD you said
Ask Harvey! Harvey is probably the one who started the rumor.
(You are suggesting that maybe Harvey is the liar, you do not know. do you?)

Lonnie, so you're saying Bobby Smith lied to Sue Whithall? And that my ears aren't worth a damn? Dude, that's Bobby Smith singing lead of TWGAMF period.
(My post said that if what Bobby said was true he was nevertheless doing an impersonation of his mentor, Harvey) (Do not recall commenting on your ears)

By doowopsvoice (198.81.26.170) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 10:44 pm:

Scratcher
I am not trying to prove anything but as founder of the DOO WOP HALL of FAME I can assure you that I am well aware of who sang what with whom. Harvey sang many of their hits, I never said he sang them all, you assumed that.
www.doowophalloffame.org

By bluedragon3 (64.236.243.31) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 10:46 pm:

Lonnie, Can't believe you feel "Games People Play" & "Then Came You" were "hyped crap." I love that stuff. Thom Bell at his best, in my opinion.

Regarding the post-Wynne era, Whitburn's R&B singles book shows 16 chart hits after Wynne left (12 of those were in the top 40!). I agree this material pales in comparison to the classic era, but geez, it's not like they quit having hits. Working My Way & Cupid got tons of airplay.

By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 10:57 pm:

"Games People Play" was one of the greatest recorded by the Spinners.

By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 10:57 pm:

Bluedragon says:
I agree this material pales in comparison to the classic era, but geez, it's not like they quit having hits.
I say
(Ask yourself what accounts for the fact that the really great songs were not pushed like that stuff you admit was inferior? The answer stinks)

Don't kill me guys

By RD (65.150.229.106) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 11:15 pm:

It seems Doowopsvoice and Lonnie are the same person.

Lonnie, Doowopsvoice or whoever else you might be: You're confusing Harvey Fuqua with Bobby Lester. Bobby Smith was doing a Bobby Lester imitation not a H. Fuqua imitation.

And if your site is a doowop site why is the Valentinos' (Womack Brothers) picture featured so prominently? The Valentinos, a Cleveland group, didn't have a shred of doo wop in them. They didn't sing on street corners they sang gospel music in churches.

By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 11:18 pm:

Here is a hint for all of you that are not in the music business:

When the Temptations went back to Motown Ron Wilson (Later lead with Bloodstone) was a member
of the Tempts, had been for six months. He said the first act on the part of Berry Gordy was to call the group to his office and tell them 'I told you #@&^%$ that you would never have a hit after you left here'. Point is that mucho bucks are spent and influence is exerted to make sure that certain things never happen in this business. What happened to the musical empires of Al Bell, Maurice White, and Philadelphia International? Why do you think it is that as good as luther is he can only garner just so much of that music dollar out there? How did Leon Haywood get blackballed? What contributed to the downfall of Leon Sylvers? Why did Bill Withers disappear from the music biz for six years before "Just the two of us"? Finally, how did Easy E get diagnosed with aids and die within thirty days? What experience did George Benson have with the powers that be? The story was in the Jet mag in the early 80's.
Peace People

By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 11:21 pm:

Don't tell Bobby he never sang Doo Wop.

By RD (65.150.242.5) on Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 11:35 pm:

Lonnie I went to school with Cecil Womack, my sister went to school with Bobby and Friendly, knew them quite well. Please tell this forum when the Valentinos sang doo wop? I use to see them sing in little storefront churches. If they sang doo wop it was in private. The only music they sang in Cleveland before leaving was gospel. You don't have a clue as to what you're talking about. They never even sang their secular recordings on SAR Records in Cleveland because at the time their father was still living and only wanted them to sing gospel.

By Eli (64.12.97.7) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 12:07 am:

Bluedragon,

Let me correct your information, remember when you
hear it from myself or Babbitt it is FIRST HAND INFORMATION.

"Then Came You" and "Rubberband Man", had the following personnel in the rhythm section: Bob Babbitt on bass, Charles Collins on drums, Bill Neale and myself on guitar, Thom Bell on keyboards, Ed Shea on vibes and Larry Washington on percussion.

All of the rhythm tracks to the firdt five produced Spinners albums were produced at Sigma Sound Studio in Philadelphia. The rhythm tracks to the final Thom Bell produced Spinners sessions were recorded at Sound Lab Studio in Los Angeles.

Eli

By Eli (64.12.97.7) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 12:18 am:

Hey RD,
A coupla things.
Bobby Smith IS the lead singer on TWGAMF.
As a teen I was even on a show with them in Philly where they performed the song and BS was the lead.

Also, Phillipe and Bobby share leads on One of a kind.
I was there at the session and you can not argue with that!!

By RD (65.150.229.152) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 12:25 am:

Eli, I'm not the one saying Bobby Smith is not the one singing lead on TWGAMF, Lonnie is. I know Bobby Smith is singing the lead. Lonnie thinks it's Harvey Fuqua.

As for One of a Kind, they might be, the argument is over two lines that possibly were dubbed over.

Ron Wilson sang with Bobby Taylor in the Columbus Pharoahs a.k.a. the Four Pharoahs; this was way before Bobby Taylor & the Vancouvers. I never knew he sang with the Temptations and apparently neither did anyone else except Lonnie. He's not on any of the "use to sing with the Tempts" lists. Did he tell you he was an O'Jay too?

By Eli (64.12.97.7) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 12:33 am:

RD..
My bad!!!
But, One of a kind was intentionally done as a double lead.
Thom wrote it that way.
As I had said , I was there, and you cannot dispute that!!

I witnessed many Thom Bell vocal sessions.
We were and are close friends dating back to our high school days and before and I was always invited in to watch, if I wanted to.

By A Discerning Eye (171.75.81.117) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 12:58 am:

A slight correction on the personal on Then Came You and The Rubberband Man-Andrew Smith was on drums on the both of them.Was posted above that Charles Collins was on these.This is incorrect.Also,Spinners 8 was credited as being recorded at Kaye Smith Studios in Seattle.Lastly Bill Neale and Ed Shea were not on Then Came You and The Rubberband Man.They both had Tony Bell on them instead of Bill Neale.Neale and Shea didn't come on the scene as a musicians for Thom Bell until years later.I know you were there Bobby but I'm not sure where you are now.Still love ya

By RD (65.150.229.152) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 01:07 am:

Eli, I was going to question you on the vocal sessions since I know that the musicians usually were not there...but I guess you cleared that up?

I read your quote in Soul Express. F.Y.I. Chico Edwards was not a lead singer with the Spinners.

As for "One of a Kind" if it was done as a double lead then why is Smith supposedly singing only two lines? What happened to the double lead?Whatever went on in the studio was modified in the mix. I've seen cases where vocals were completely buried, I'm going by what I hear not what happened in the studio when you happened to have been there.

By Eli (64.12.97.7) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 01:09 am:

Discerning eye,
Will you please explain what you meant by the last line which says "I'm not sure where you are now"???
What exactly is your implication??


As previously mentioned, you cannot always trust liner note info, but you CAN trust the ones who were there.
By the way, Bill Neale and Ed Shea came on the scene in 1974.

By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 01:19 am:

Think about this statment

I'm going by what I hear not what happened in the studio when you happened to have been there.

The old adage is do not believe anything you hear and only half of what you see!!!!!

We are all wrong at some time or another and noone can point accusatory fingers with impunity.
Putting all of the facts together should come near to the truth. And please stop assigning statements to people that they never made, read and understand first.

By RD (65.150.229.152) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 01:27 am:

Lonnie, things are recorded in the studio that are buried in the mix that as a consumer, I don't hear; this is what I was speaking of. It's easy to be accusatory of you because you say stupid things like Harvey Fuqua is singing lead on TWGAMF, Ron Wilson was a Temptation and suggesting that Bobby Womack sang doo wop. That Blowhard BS won't fly on this forum.

By lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 01:27 am:

Just to clear this up, if you look into the back seat of the car on the cover of the Bloodstone lp from 82, the guy with the red shirt is Ron Wilson.
He never told me he sang with the Vancouvers but he and I are doing all of the backgrounds on my demos and he is leading on the one that he used to convince Ron Isley to join Bloodstone. Otis can tell you he was a member of the Tempts. All who do not live in Los Angeles, there is a lot that you were not privy to.

By RD (65.150.229.152) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 01:32 am:

Who said he sang with the Vancouvers, Lonnie? Certainly not I. If you read correctly you'll see I posted he sang with the Columbus Pharoahs a.k.a. the Four Pharoahs. Bobby Taylor was also a member of those groups.

"That he used to convince Ron Isley to join Bloodstone." When was Ron Isley a member of Bloodstone? This gets deeper and deeper.

By A Discerning Eye (171.75.81.26) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 01:42 am:

Bobby,so your saying Charles Collins,Bill Neale and Ed Shea were on Then Came You and Rubberband Man?I'm reading the credits off the album covers and it lists you and Tony Bell on guitars on those 2 tunes along with Andrew Smith on drums.Also,just recently read on Babbitt thread the Then Came You personnel,which was a great rhythm section.It did not mention Bill Neale or Ed Shea.Is all this posted here and what's written on the back of these album covers as far as player personnel incorrect?

By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 02:03 am:

Bloodstone was on T-Neck (Isley's label), the group was signed to the label but had not replaced Charles McCormick yet.

By RD (65.150.229.152) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 02:08 am:

Everybody knows that Lonnie (I go a long ways back); but you said Ron Isley joined Bloodstone. Tell us when Ron Isley left the Isley Brothers and joined Bloodstone? Or did you mean something else?

By PhillyGroove (64.12.97.7) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 07:45 am:

Eli,

I was surprised that Earl Young wasn't the drummer on "Then Came You." Any comments? Thanks.

By Eli (172.142.49.202) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 11:34 am:

After the Mighty Love album, Thom wanted to try "something a little different" on his sessions.
Also, BH&Y were for some unexplained reason "getting a little difficult".
I could not understand this for the sessions were everybody's bread and butter.

By bluedragon3 (64.236.243.31) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 01:10 pm:

RD, Chico replaced George Dixon in '62 and is shown with the band in a number of photos in the box set.

By Heikki (62.71.79.239) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 01:19 pm:

Hi Bluedragon3!
Actually Chico was in the picture from the day one in 1954. The group rehearsed in his house, but that time they had his brother, James, as a member, but only for a couple of weeks.
When C.P.Spencer left in late '56/early '57, they asked Chico to join the group.
In 1960 Chico left for the first time and was replaced by George Dixon, but Chico came back already in 1961, when George was still with the group.
Best regards
Heikki

By A Discerning Eye (171.75.81.100) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 01:44 pm:

Word has it that BH&Y also requested a pay increase and T.Bell wasn't buying(no pun intended).

By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 02:02 pm:

Eli,
I asked a question that I've always wondered about a while back but noone responded. Are you aware of a duet with Phillipe and a famous lady vocalist that was canned? I do not want to mention her name for fear of launching a canard.
Either Alan Thicke, Neil Rosen, or a Spinners former road manager told me about it.

By Eli (152.163.252.68) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 02:08 pm:

That is what I meant by "getting a little difficult"
Thom took care of us better than anyone else, so I don't know why they wanted a "pay increase"
No one else complained

The reason that Vince Montana stopped working with Thom was that he was caught one day with a cassette player in his briefcase recording the happenings in the studio.

It really was a pleasure to work with Babbitt, Andy, Bill, Ed and Charles as their demeanor was totally professional.
Tony Bell started to have some "problems" that needed to be attended to so Bill Neale was then brought in.

For some reason some of the guys' participation was documented propperly over the years , including some very important albums which I played on where my name does not even appear at all or my "real name" is listed, but that is another story!!

By RD (65.150.228.241) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 02:09 pm:

Hey Blue Dragon: I know Chico Edwards sang with the Spinners, I never said he didn't. I was referring to a statement attributed to Bobby Eli in the latest Soul Express magazine where he said Chico Edwards was the Spinners' lead singer in 1967. He was not a lead singer; not on their recordings anyway. All the Spinners' Motown leads prior to G. C. Cameron were done by Bobby Smith. George Dixon sang some leads on Tri-Phi but I've known of a recorded lead by Chico Edwards--this is what I was referring to.

By Eli (152.163.252.68) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 02:16 pm:

RD,I never said the Chico was their lead singer in 1967!! Read it more carefully my brother!!

Lonnie,I vaguely remember something like that going down but the events are not very clear at this moment.
Thom was always trying new ways to do things so that does not surprise.
By the way, did you connect with Thom yet??

I told him and Barbara about this forum in January but I suppose he does not have the time right now.

By RD (65.150.228.241) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 02:22 pm:

Eli, here's the exact sentence. "That was when Chico Edwards was the lead singer (in '67)."

Was you misquoted?

The next sentence says: "I didn't know them that well but we ran across one another on the road.

By Caleb (171.75.84.25) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 02:25 pm:

Bobby,what is your real name?

By WaltBaby (152.163.252.68) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 03:04 pm:

Eli: If you're trying to reach Lynn Tolliver I can put you in contact with him.

By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 03:10 pm:

Eli,
Who is Barbara? I was told to e-mail Vanessa.

I made a call and left a message but have not heard from Thom, yet.

Did you listen to the song I asked you to?

By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 03:14 pm:

WaltBaby
Were you once in an office in the old Motown building and Michael Jackson's Father shared it?

By Heikki (62.71.79.239) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 03:24 pm:

Hi Bobby and RD!
Regarding the quote by Bobby about Chico being the lead singer of the Spinners, here I must come to Bobby's defence and admit that it might have been my mistake. I tried to search the tape, but I guess I don't have it anymore, or by now it has other interviews on it. But I know Bobby knows all the details and has a great memory.

As every reporter knows, you can't always print somebody's sayings as such, word-to-word, as often it isn't logical, fluent and even makes the interviewee sound silly. You can all try it. Tape your normal - and I mean normal - talk, and then write it down. You wouldn't publish it. You have to make it readable, while trying to retain the facts, the idea, structure and mode of expression. I remember Bobby talking about a guy in the Spinners before G.C. became the LEAD. If it's my mistake, my apologies.

Another minus in those telephone interviews is bad line (between Europe and U.S.A.). In almost 50 % of the cases I have to call back, or send a fax or an email and ask the same question again.
In our next issue Bobby - as everybody else - is quoted as accurately as possibly can be done. Bobby is also featured separately.
Best regards
Heikki

By WaltBaby (152.163.252.68) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 03:38 pm:

Lonnie, please don't confuse me with Walt "Baby" Love. I reside and have always resided in Cleveland, Ohio. I have met Mr. Love and know that he also is from Ohio, but I am not him.

By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 03:59 pm:

Hey Gang!
I read the article Heikki wrote (thanks for the magazine, Heikki!) as well and I'm glad she has set the record straight.

We in the world of reporting and liner note writing do our best to get it right and get it right the first time. However, errors do occur and if we are wrong we are big enough to admit our mistakes.

I make sure that I check my sources with their colleagues, label execs, news articles, media interviews to make sure I have the most accurate information possible.

BTW - I spotted the mistake Rhino made regarding the Spinners being the "Dominoes" as well and brought it to the attention of my colleagues at Warner Music and told them they better correct it or I'm gonna sic a bunch of Soulful Detroiters on the Rhino website!

Kevin Goins - KevGo

By WaltBaby (152.163.252.68) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 04:09 pm:

To Everyone re: My screen name: To eliminate confusion with Walt "Baby" Love I am as of now shortening my screen name to WaltB

By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 04:20 pm:

I just spoke to Ed Wright former President of the Black DJ's Assc. He had a stroke a while back and is troubled with eye problems but overall seems to be faring well. I told him about you guys here and he says Bobby should know him. At on time (he says) he was the O'Jay's' manager. His e- mail is ewwmedia@hotmail.com .

By Scratcher (65.238.127.48) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 04:27 pm:

Ed Wright was once a DJ up in Cleveland and had something to do with the O'Jays Minit Release "Working On Your Case" and maybe some others.

By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 06:02 pm:

Ed is in cincinnati, these days, went back close to home. He left L.A. a couple of years ago after a stint with Ed Townsend's nonprofit and a few deals with Wally Roker. Wally was on the Doo Wop Hall of Fame's internet show 10 or 12 times. He was the bass with the Heartbeats.

By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 06:11 pm:

Guess we should always try to keep the thread on point, if possible, so.

Here is a cut and paste from an interview that was done with Bootsy Collins
88888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888
You had your own outfit 'Rubber Band' that in itself was influential and is still seen as a hall mark or trademark of the funk era - how did that come about?
-------------------------------------------------
Well I always had my own band anyway, even before we got with James Brown. We were doing ghetto tours, you know promoting ourselves - we called ourselves The Pacemakers and we had Philippe Wynne who actually went with the Spinners once we joined The Funkadelic - but that's a whole another story. Philippe was from Cincinnati, he started out with us also. When we went with James you know we told him once we get in a position, coz you know we had this instinct that once we get finished and do our thing with James you know we'd be back to the get you.
88888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888
See where he says Phil came from?

By Wendal (68.42.209.170) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 06:52 pm:

I have a home video tape of a concert with Geo Clinton, Funkadelic, and Phil.

By Eli (64.12.97.7) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 06:56 pm:

Lonnie,Barbara is Thom's sister.Caleb, my birth name is Eli Tatarsky.
"Bobby Eli" , came about when I was 14 years old and I was just beginning to create music and I needed a name that was easy to remember so one day on the corner of Broad and Locust on the way to cameo for an audition, I devised that name and it kind of stuck!!

By WaltB (172.155.183.247) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 07:51 pm:

Eli: I am sure you know Buddy Dee. How is he?

By Eli (172.137.159.160) on Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 09:45 pm:

Hi Walt,

Yes, I have known Buddy Dee for over 35 years.
His mom Mary Dee was a radio personality on WHAT in Philly.
After he leftWEA he worked for Universal one stop who recently filed chapter 11.
I have not seen Buddy in several years now, though.

By Heikki (62.248.250.20) on Friday, July 18, 2003 - 01:24 am:

Hi KevGo!
Heikki is actually he, not she. That's why I don't qualify as one of Stu's Angels. It's rather interesting. Many in the U.S. (and incidentally Russia also) after reading the name 'Heikki' think it's she. Is there something close to it?
Henry is of the same origin.
Best regards
Heikki

By stephanie (64.63.221.192) on Friday, July 18, 2003 - 12:08 pm:

Lonnie

I have a question when it comes to Easy E and some of the other things you said. You said money and power is exerted to make sure that things happen. Are you saying someone killed Easy E or that Bill Withers was blackballed? I know the music industry can be cruel but do you think that drugs is running it now. Oh by the way I always wondered why some of the other Spinners were not given lead duties and they got John Edwards. Edwards was not bad and he was capable of more than Cupid but he did have a good sound..
Stephanie

By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Friday, July 18, 2003 - 03:46 pm:

stephanie
When Eazy was first approached and advised to accept a set payment for the contracts of 3 acts he managed (they are all megastars now) he ran those that offered out of his office with a baseball bat. The entire incident was on the news nationally, the next day. Eazy called all the major networks and reported it so that if there were repercussions it would be obvious who did it. A year later he was diagnosed and died of aids within 30 days.

Bill was told to get out of the business if he did not sign the contract they offered, so, he says, he sold real estate for six years.

It's all about money not drugs. Drugs are used to control.

No comment on the Spinners.

By doowopsvoice (198.81.26.170) on Saturday, July 19, 2003 - 09:49 am:

steph
Point I was making was that money is spent,favors are called in, and influential power is employed to make sure certain things do (not) happen, like an artist not having a hit with a killer song. Some never even get airplay for that reason.

By Caleb (171.75.80.222) on Sunday, July 20, 2003 - 02:26 pm:

Bobby,the tune"Got To Be There"-Michael Jackson was written by an Eli Wilensky.For a long time I thought that was you.Knew you real last name ended with a "sky".Just wanted to share that with you.Have a good day.

By Eli--sky (151.197.27.222) on Sunday, July 20, 2003 - 10:19 pm:

Hi Caleb,

I wish that were my song as it would be a great song for my resume , but unfortunately it is not mine.

By Caleb (171.75.84.226) on Sunday, July 20, 2003 - 10:27 pm:

Bobby,Love Won't Let Me Wait-After The Lovin'-Sideshow,and Just Don't Want To Be Lonely-were there any others?Also,were those 4 tunes written with a V Barrett?Caleb

By SoulJones (62.252.69.145) on Monday, July 21, 2003 - 06:44 pm:

Lonnie,

Great Thread. Undoubtedly a shared bridge, whilst I think Phil is a soul singing genius I was always kinda pissed off that Bobby never got his due.

When I was growing up and first got into soul full time (in the early 90's) and before I discovered record fairs It was difficuilt to get hold of the Spinners (cassette was my format of choice then).

I used to occasionally hear their hits on my local radio station on the way to school and could always hear several different singers but my only reference was The Heart Of Rock & Soul's 1000 songs of all time, a book written by Dave Marsh, who credited Phil on just about everything.

SoulJones

By SoulJones (62.252.69.145) on Monday, July 21, 2003 - 06:53 pm:

Bobby,

I'd be interested in getting hold of a list of recorded songs you've written. There's the aforementioned songs as well as 'Sweet Love Of Mine'(a personal favourite)and the Blue Magic albums. But what else is out there? Why are there none of your songs on '13 Blue magic lane'?

SoulJones

By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Monday, July 21, 2003 - 09:14 pm:

SoulJones
To reiterate, Bobby's voice sounds a lot like Phil but, Phil was an extrovert Bobby seems to be introverted. Phil overtly craved attention, Bobby is reserved and cool. Phil was loquacious Bobby talks when he wants or needs to. Having similar voices ended with the sound.

There is style to be considered for the public craves excitement and Bobby chose to be in this arena that demands stars to be out front and commanding in personality. Bobby is a greatvoiced, talented, lovable guy but he weren't no 'Showboat'. People love a mystery and Phil worked hard at that as well, The title of this thread is what it is owing to that fact. He told different people different things, there are 4 surnames attributed to him Wynne, Walker, Wainwright, and the true one Wright (which I do not think he ever admitted to). To further convolute things he spelled them differently, as well.

There has always been room for both of them but the industry will invariably back the one that is generating attention, so as to be in position to capitalize on it. I think most of us loved them both but, like in parenting, it is hard not to have favorites.

By lonnie cook (198.81.26.170) on Monday, August 04, 2003 - 04:14 pm:

I just e-mailed Bobbie Smith to confirm Phil's last name, if need be I will call the Spinners's manager Buddy Allen as well.

By Scratcher (65.238.127.78) on Tuesday, August 05, 2003 - 02:24 pm:

Soul Jones, Marsh got the members of the Temptations, the O'Jays and others mixed up in that book too. I don't think he really knew the music, particularly soul music, he was writing about in depth.

By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Thursday, August 14, 2003 - 12:35 pm:

Kitty Sears via Spider Harrison says that Phil was raised in an orphanage and never was sure of his last name. She reportedly grew up with him in Cincinatti. This is something that Heikki is trying to establish so if anyone has verifiable info please be forthcoming.

By Eli (141.151.17.120) on Thursday, August 14, 2003 - 01:15 pm:

Lonnie,

Its unbelievable that after all these years Buddy Allen still manages the Spinners.
Is his son Steve also involved as before??

By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Thursday, August 14, 2003 - 05:36 pm:

Bobby
The only time I spoke to Steve was when Phil quit, I called and volunteered to take his place. They told me they were satisfied with the guy that had subbed for him when he had his operation, John Edwards.

I have talked to Buddy twice in the last month and he is always aided by his wife. He is gung ho on the recording idea, though.

You have never listened , have you?
www.soulwalking.co.uk/Lonnie%20Cook.html ???
Last 50 seconds of "Payback is a dog"

Didn't I see somewhere here that you plan to be in L.A. soon?

By P.J. (209.166.149.93) on Thursday, August 14, 2003 - 09:41 pm:

Hi, This is quite an interesting thread. I went back to listen to 'One Of A Kind Love Affair' and even with my untrained ear I can hear what you're debating about especially at 1:20 into the song.
With all this talk about Harvey Fuqua, I have a question that I've always wondered about. Singles on Tri-Phi 1001,1004,1007,1013 list the Spinners as artists. Tri-Phi 1018 lists Bobby Smith and The Spinners. Does anyone know why?
Also Tri-Phi 1010 lists the artist as Harvey with ("Formerly of the Moonglows and The Spinners") printed underneath the artists name; Tri-Phi 1017 again lists Harvey as the artist, but this time ("Formerly of The Moonglows" ) is printed under the artists name. Was a correction demanded by the Spinners for the second Harvey (Tri-Phi) single?
Has anyone gotten hold of Bobby Smith yet?
I was surprised to see in print (The Chrome Collection booklet) the claim that Stevie Wonder had written "Signed, Sealed, Delivered" for the Spinners (with G.C. Cameron on lead) to record and that Motown would not let Stevie record it on them. Had anyone else at S.D. ever heard this before?

By Lonnie Cook (198.81.26.170) on Friday, August 15, 2003 - 10:12 am:

PJ
Looks like you have been busy, busy, busy and are more musically mixed up than when you started. You've ended up with a lot of great ???'s.

Just last week I told my 30 yr old daughter that the more she learns the better equipped she will be to understand how much she doesn't know. She is not the Lone Ranger, we are all in the same boat.

Look out for the trainwreck that is sure to come from the 'formerly of the Spinners' statement. Of course who can argue with black and white, Indians?

The lead on "That's what girls are made for" sounds like a Moonglows lead. One possibility is that Harvey laid down a lead track for Bobby, never liked what Bobby did with it and released their first record with that reference track. Thereby he could lay claim to being one of the Spinners and the group would be opposed because they never agreed to it. That is the only scenario that accounts for all that you called attention to.

"Signed, Sealed, Delivered" impresses me as a near twin to "It's a shame" as far as being one written for that lineup.

It sounds more and more as though Harvey Fuqua was the reason for the persona non grata status of the Motown Spinners. Beginning to look as though Berry didn't like him much and it rubbed off on the Spinners. They had great stuff there.

By P.J. (209.166.148.173) on Friday, August 15, 2003 - 10:37 am:

Lonnie,
Things get even more confusing considering that Harvey Fuqua originally helped head up Artists Development with Maxine Powell, Maurice King etc. ; teamed with Johnny Bristol as producer and/or writer of several beloved hits (especially Marvin & Tammi); after leaving Motown, worked with New Birth at RCA and Marvin Gaye at Columbia.
Perhaps Harvy's divorce from Gwen Gordy may have entered into the picture somewhat..... but then there was also Marvin's divorce from Anna Gordy some years later.......