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SoulfulDetroit.com FORUM: Archive - After July 12, 2003: Roy Handy

By MEL&THEN SOME (217.14.178.40) on Sunday, June 22, 2003 - 02:00 pm:

one of the earliest rare soul records I ever
heard was way way back many years ago and it was
"baby thats a groove"
which I still own today on the
Stephanye Record Label(no.334)

Over the years I have never heard anything about Roy Handy either musically or in any other form.

There is a record that has been around now by a Roy Handy on the Marton Record Label(no.1001)
called
"Accidental Love/what did he do"
and I cant recall if I have heard it or not,especially with not having my tape etc catalogues with me.
I must of heard it
anyway,
is this the same Roy Handy as on the Stephanye Label and can anyone tell me anything regards Mr Handys life.
Either past or present or if possible both.

many thanks
mel(andthensome)

By Marcel (62.194.44.181) on Sunday, June 22, 2003 - 04:11 pm:

I had both of the records. George Clinton produced both of the records. I showed George a copy of the Accidental and he went crazy. This was the first time that he saw the 45. Well, 2 days later it was his birthday and I thought what a big surprise it was to give George my copy. He had tears in his eyes.........he was going to frame the 45. Which he never did because of the 45 was STOLEN from him on his way back to the USA. I still have the other 45.....but never ever saw a copy of the one that I gave to George :-(

By Rich (162.33.235.243) on Monday, June 23, 2003 - 08:55 am:

I believe that Roy Handy was a barber in Newark, NJ - which was in part how he came to know Clinton. He also had a musical association with Gene Redd who produced & managed Kool & the Gang in their early days. I also believe that The Stephanye Label was Gene Redd's as Stephanye was the name of Gene's publishing Company listed on the early Kool & the Gang releases. There's a beat-break classic by the Gang entitled N.T. (No Title) which was a single and included on their late 1971 Live at PJ's Album. The song was written by Gene Redd, Cleve Horne, Kool & the Gang & ROY HANDY.

Where's Lars with a scan of a Roy Handy disc???

By LG Nilsson (212.247.9.242) on Monday, June 23, 2003 - 09:01 am:

... I'm right here... I have the three Stephanye releases but not Roy Handy on Marton. Only Marton disc I have is Tamala Lewis on 1002... also a Clinton production.

LG (Lars)

By Rich (162.33.235.243) on Monday, June 23, 2003 - 09:08 am:

Follow up Mel & TS on "Accidental Love". My recollection was that the single came out on the Laurie label. But Marton #1001 makes more sense, as the single Clinton produced on Tamala Lewis 45 "You Won't Say Nothing" came out on the Marton label as well, #1002. Wonder who owned the Marton label.

BTW - "Ain't That a Groove" borrowed heavy from "I Can't Help Myself". In 1969, the lyrics were set to a new Funkadelic cut and re-titled "Fish Chips & Sweat", which was sung by Billy Bass Nelson. Contratry to popular belief, the original Funkadelics cut most of their own vocals.

By MEL&THEN SOME9 (217.14.178.119) on Monday, June 23, 2003 - 09:58 am:

Many thanks to one and all
For there in-put.
"Baby thats a groove"
sure brings back some great memories for me way back arounnd 1971/2
"when we were dancing to the sound of Jnr Walker Shotgun"
and danced all night on fish and chips.

Lyric

By MEL&THEN SOME (217.14.178.119) on Monday, June 23, 2003 - 09:59 am:

Sorry for the error and double posting.
mel.

By LG Nilsson (213.89.29.129) on Monday, June 23, 2003 - 11:36 am:

Hi guys,

No wonder the record sounds like �I Can�t Help Myself�� Just look at the writer credits.

�. And the B-side �Monkey See � Monkey Do� sounds like an instrumental version of �The Tracks Of My Tears�. Wonder if Smokey Robinson have heard that song?

LG

By MEL&THEN SOME9 (217.14.178.62) on Monday, June 23, 2003 - 12:58 pm:

Does anyone know why only the 3 singles came out on the Label.
All good tracks in my opinion which I also still have today.
mel.

By Rich (162.33.235.94) on Monday, June 23, 2003 - 01:02 pm:

You really are right here !!! Thanks a ga-zillion Lars. The label I saw (not the DJ label shown here) is green.

Ahh, at least GC gave 'em credit - LOL.

Who's credited as the writer of Monkey See Money Do?

By MEL&THEN SOME9 (217.14.178.47) on Monday, June 23, 2003 - 01:12 pm:

The writers on
"monkey see-monkey do"
are J.Crosby and Gene Redd.
these 2 are also the writers on the flipside to Shirley J Scott's "goose pimples"
titled
"lonely girl"
cant find my other 45 at the moment,
prehaps youve got yours handy Lars.
mel.

By LG Nilsson (213.89.29.129) on Monday, June 23, 2003 - 02:00 pm:

Stephanye 335 THE PROPHETS "My Kind Of Girl" J.Crosby and Gene Redd b/w "I Can't Make It" C. Horne and Gene Redd.

Lars

By MEL&THEN SOME (217.14.178.123) on Monday, June 23, 2003 - 03:23 pm:

Hey Rich,or anyone
why just the 3 releases then?
was it because they were getting into bigger things then ie with Kool and the gang etc.

As for the Tamala Lewis track
yet another fave of mine
"you wont say nothing/if you can stand by me"
I have a few waxings with the name of messrs.
clinton and Redd in one form or another.
2 really talented guys.
mel.

By MEL&THEN SOME (217.14.178.123) on Monday, June 23, 2003 - 03:25 pm:

thanks for the Prophets info Lars
mine is lurking somewhere.
mel.

By Rich (12.94.184.195) on Monday, June 23, 2003 - 05:34 pm:

Mel, there's a three-year span between Gene's Stephanye releases and the first Kool & the Gang single (8/69). I assume that the labels lack of commercial success drove it under and Gene spent his time doing his thing for other people. Redd did some arranging in NYC didn't he?

Gene formed another of his own labels (Red Coach) & publishing Co (Red Lite) in 1972 after his split with the Gang. Everyday People were signed to Red Coach.

#334 (Roy Handy) & #335 (The Prophets) ... what's the third?

By David Meikle (62.252.128.6) on Monday, June 23, 2003 - 05:54 pm:

Rich

As Mel says above..

Stephanye333 was Shirley Scott "Lonely girl"/"Goosepimples". Don't know which was top side, but "Goosepimples is very popular over here.

Don't have the writing credits but arranged and Produced by Gene Redd.

By Wonder B (81.50.39.111) on Monday, June 23, 2003 - 06:00 pm:

I have that very rare Roy Handy on Marton...
It is labelled as Roy Handy and the Parlettes... no wonder why that name resurfaced in the 70's as the George produced female group (3 LP's)...

Wonder B

By MEL&THEN SOME (217.14.178.86) on Tuesday, June 24, 2003 - 12:20 am:

Cheers Rich
I know a bit about the Red Coach and Red Lite label but thats another story as they say.
The "Goosepimples" track by Shirley Scott has a similar backing track to the Inspirations track
"touch me,kiss me,hold me"which came out with 2 different flipsides on the us Black Pearl label(100)and also on the uk label polydor and was also a big dancer over here.
many thanks for the info
mel

By LG Nilsson (213.89.29.129) on Tuesday, June 24, 2003 - 04:27 pm:

David,

I think the ballad �Lonely Girl� was the A-side as the ZTSC number is one step lower. (�34) � That could be a hint.

� but I think �Goose Pimples� is a better track too. By the way, here's the writing credits too.

Lars

By David Meikle (62.252.128.6) on Tuesday, June 24, 2003 - 04:32 pm:

Beautiful image Lars!

I needed that tonight.

Note the Myto Publishing of Golden World.

Thanks again to Heikki however who proved that this was Gene's label.

I think he still recorded at GW however.

God bless the Northern Soul scene.

By MEL&THEN SOME (212.159.52.240) on Tuesday, June 24, 2003 - 04:41 pm:

Must agree David,
that image just lights up the whole screen.
In fact its given me
goosepimples
(sorry for that)
cheers Lars
and to Heikki.

"move your feet
to the sound of the beat'

Northern Soul will never die.

mel

By Rich (162.33.246.66) on Tuesday, June 24, 2003 - 10:13 pm:

Doggone Lars, I was on my feet & clapping for that one. Thanks man!!

David ... I really can't figure it out. Take for instance "I'm Into Something I Can't Shake Loose" by Pat Lewis. Its written by JJ Jackson, Sid Barnes, Rose Marie McCoy & Geo Clinton. Looks & smells like Detroit, right? But then why is JJ Jackson's name on there? I believe he went from New York to London. "Our Love is in the Pocket" another that looks and smells like Detroit. The credited writer are Geo Clinton, Rose Marie McCoy & again JJ Jackson. I believe that the expression "I'm Into Something I Can't Shake Loose" was something Detroit DJ Martha Jean (or som'n like that) used. Is it possible that Ed Wingate brought the expression to New York and asked them to write a song around it?? Ed did travel to NY quite a bit before Golden World Studios opened.

Or is it possible (again I said possible) that Wingate was buying and publishing songs for these folks between the time Motown (Jobete) New York went out of business (March 1964) and when Clinton & Barnes began commuting to Detroit to work for Wingate at Golden World? I'd always assumed that Gene Redd & R.M. McCoy remained in New York. Any thoughts?

Along these lines ... The Fantastic Four's "Girl Have Pity" was written by Gene Redd, J Crosby, Geo Clinton & T Lane.

By Ian W (194.75.128.2) on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 08:29 am:

Mel, maybe there were only three releases to create space for the bootlegged 'Supertime'? That nearly fooled me at the time. Before I found a legit copy of 'Baby That's a Groove' I had a bootleg. Towards the end of 'Monkey See - Monkey Do' the track speeds up. I was pleased to find that, on the legit copy, the track plays at the correct pace. Why begin the serial number at 333?

By MEL&THEN SOME (217.14.178.123) on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 09:12 am:

Always liked that Supertime track Ian.
mel.

By Davie Gordon (212.159.94.2) on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 10:16 am:

Rich,

I don't have time to go into this subject today but will try to get to it this week.

Meanwhile I'll just throw into the soup Darrell
Banks first album - three or four of the traks involve Gene Redd,RoseMarie McCoy and Jimmy Crosby.

I've a feeling most of the album, including the recuts, was recorded in New York.

There's been some previous discussion of Gene Redd
, a quick check of the archives should bring up the thread. His career went backk a looong , he
was singing in doowop group (The Fi-Tones) in the
early fifties and in the mid-sixties was writing /producing for Old Town (in NY) and Federal ( Hank Marr) - come to think of it didn't
Hank Marr have a release on Wingate ?

Davie

By acooolcat (61.58.181.109) on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 10:36 am:

Rich
I have a copy of the 45 "Can't Shake It Loose" and the credited writers are;
G Clinton, J Barnes, R McCoy and J Jackson. I'm pretty sure this is Joanne Jackson, not J J Jackson of "But It's Alright' fame. I'd have to check the BMI site to be sure though.
I've spoken to a few people who were at Golden World and they've told me that Gene Redd was there - in Detroit.
"Can't Shake It loose" was a catch phrase used by radio jock Martha Jean, and Ed Wingate suggested it'd make a good song title.
Graham

By Rich (162.33.246.172) on Thursday, June 26, 2003 - 09:55 am:

Bring it Davie ... when you get the chance.

Graham I believe that JJ Jackson was an arranger with Jobete New York around the time that Geo Clinton, George Kerr, Sidney Barnes & Rose McCoy wrote for the Company. There's an "unrecorded" song (Little Fooler) that was written by Clinton, JJ Jackson & Rose McCoy helping to establish a connection. The song was published by Jobete.

Helping establish a Gene Redd - Raynoma Berry - Jobete New York connection might be The Prophets. The Prophets only releases (known to me) are The Stephanye release mentioned above & a release sortly thereafter on Miss Ray & Eddie Singleton's Shrine Label out of DC. "If I Had One Piece of Gold" - Shrine #1116.

Back to Roy Handy for a minute - I believe it was Marcel who once posted that there was a planned second single for The Funkadelic Label around 1968. The first (and only) single (Whatever Makes My Baby Feel Good), was produced on Rose Williams by Mike Terry. Ed Wingate financed the Williams single, which flopped. Its possible (again, I said possible) that Wingate may have helped finance Gene Redd's Stephanye label in '66, which may in-part explain the Myto publishing. Ed was a businessman afterall, and this may have been part of the deal. Anyhow, Wingate elected not to finance any further releases for The Funkadelic label, leaving the Roy Handy single unreleased.

George Clinton did co-write and co-produce a couple of songs for Ric-Tic around this time: The Flanming Embers "Hey Mama" & JJ Barnes "So-Called Friends". Again, this may have been part of the deal to encourage Ed to finance the 1968-era GEO-Mik projects.

By LTLFTC (12.210.76.205) on Thursday, June 26, 2003 - 11:32 am:

Graham and Rich;
The BMI site does list Joanne Jackson as a co-writer ; what fascinates me, though is Rose Marie McCoy's involvement. She has hundreds and hundreds of credits and several BMI award winners. It almost seems small-time of her to be working with Sidney Barnes and George Clinton (not from a talent perspective, but with those guys at that stage of their careers ). Is there another Rose Marie McCoy ?

SteveK

By Scratcher (65.238.128.210) on Thursday, June 26, 2003 - 01:14 pm:

There's only one Rose Marie McCoy. She was a prolific writer and like most songwriters explored every avenue to get their songs cut and released. You never knew when a song was going to be a hit.

R&B and Soul music songwriters didn't make a lot of money in the '60s. The performance money for an R&B hit back then that didn't crossover was miniscule compared to the performance money paid for an easy listening, pop or rock song. Mechanical royalties were a joke and often not even paid.

Writers often got $25 to $50 when a song was contracted for and usually never saw any other monies. McCoy at times also worked as a staff writer.

By LTLFTC (12.210.76.205) on Thursday, June 26, 2003 - 01:30 pm:

Scratcher; thanks for the info - she sounds like a subject for further research ; hits for Nappy Brown, Ruth Brown, Elvis, and a hundred others.

On a related note, is Rose Marie's occasional collaborator Charles Singleton (who co-wrote "Strangers in the Night") father of Cameo guitarist Charlie Singleton?

By the way. Lars . thanks for the great scans

SteveK

By Scratcher (65.238.127.161) on Thursday, June 26, 2003 - 05:43 pm:

R&B songs didn't make as much performance money as the other genres because there were fewer R&B stations in comparison to easy listening, pop, rock and country stations and they were usually of lower wattage. The performance rights companies classified radio stations according to wattage and the R&B stations were classified low and songs picked up on these stations were paid at a lower rate. Also a multiplier is use to compensate for genres with a lot of stations playing their format; the more stations playing a genre the bigger the multiplier. An easy listening record would sell less copies but the writer would make more performance money than the writer of an R&B record that sold more copies because EL stations were usually 50,000 watt stations and had a bigger multiplier and rate going for them and EL writers.

On top of that, your song had to have been played on a station or stations that were being monitored in the quarter before you were paid anything. Many songs were played to death in certain cities and made their Top 10 R&B surveys; but B.M.I. wasn't monitoring those stations that period and the writers received nothing.

I always thought this was odd because since there were so few R&B stations across the USA all could have been monitored, or at least 80 percent of them, each quarter.

By David Meikle (62.252.128.6) on Thursday, June 26, 2003 - 06:09 pm:

Thanks to Graham

By LG Nilsson (213.89.29.129) on Thursday, June 26, 2003 - 06:47 pm:

I found some records and labels that have been discussed here�
First the third and last release on Stephanye by the Prophets (DJ Copy, other side):

Second� the Pat Lewis Golden World release with composer J. Jackson. No single on Golden World has any J.J. Jackson as writer.

WinGate single with JoAnne Jackson as writer:

� a cute little Jukebox sticker for the above single� with misspelled label:

The Fantastic Four debut single on Ric-Tic with Gene Redd as producer and writer� and the Clinton involvement:

Gene Redd was also responsible for one of the top singles on Golden World:

� and later on the Red Coach label with a wonderful release. Ordinary copies were pink and the red coach was red!

Lars

By MEL&THEN SOME (217.14.178.35) on Thursday, June 26, 2003 - 07:08 pm:

Lars
a favourite of mine on the Redd Coach Label is by
The Appointments
and a great dancer titled
"keep away"
number 732
written by R.Moore and Gene Redd
on the left hand side of the label it has
Stephanye Music
BMI 2:46
On the right hand side
RC 732
XXTZ 121008
Arranged and produced by
Gene Redd

as far as I know it also came out on the
Delite Record Label(no520)
and is worth around the 5/600 mark.
As far as I know they are both the same tracks.
mel.

By matt (208.130.56.167) on Thursday, June 26, 2003 - 07:46 pm:

additional roy handy info: he was a member of the group the chosen few, who recorded at least one lp on maple (and it's fantastic). it's a johnny brantley thing, and there's a lot of overlap that i don't fully understand with the ohio players and the adventurers.

matt

By Rich (162.33.234.6) on Friday, June 27, 2003 - 09:46 am:

Scratcher ... great info on the Radio monitoring.

Amazing scans once again - Lars, David & Graham

Mel - I believe that the Appointments "I Saw You There" was De-Lite 520, by the way - nice thread

Joanne Jackson = Joanne Bratton?

Matt - The Chosen Few - Did they have a heavy funk tune entitled "The Chosen Few?

By Scratcher (65.238.127.203) on Friday, June 27, 2003 - 10:09 am:

B.M.I. monitored stations by having the stations' program director logged the records played during peak times.

ASCAP had someone in the cities of the stations being monitored listen to what was played and jotting the song titles down. "Betcha By Golly Wow" missed a lot of performances because some logged it down as "You're The One I've Been Waiting For Forever."

SESAC goes by chart position.

All the systems were open to and often corrupted. BMI logs often had songs listed that weren't played as often as indicated; and some ASCAP monitors let it be known who they were to those who cared about such matters. As for SESAC, chart positions were often exchanged for money.

By Rich (162.33.234.6) on Friday, June 27, 2003 - 10:45 am:

I'd always thought the Red Coach started with #801 in '73. Red Coach #732 is a mystery to me. The Appointments 45 on De-Lite came out in the fall of '69. Any other known releases beginning with a 7?

Johnny Brantley is the guy who along with Clay McMurray produced a solo album on Kool & the Gang's Ricky West in 1976. Brantley produced the Ohio Players "Observation in Time" album in NY in 1968.

All of these inter-connections are mind boggling.

"Chart positions were exchanged for money" ??? More disturbing info Scratch

By acooolcat (61.58.180.143) on Friday, June 27, 2003 - 10:48 am:

I've just noticed on the Prophets' 45 that it has the name Capito next to Gene Redd. There was a Detroit label named Capito which released a really nice song by The Ulimates in 1968. I wonder if there's a connection? From memory the label was owned by Larry Capito.
Graham

By matt (208.130.56.167) on Friday, June 27, 2003 - 03:56 pm:

rich: different chosen few. these guys had a single called "birth of a playboy."

graham: i think it's lenny capito. another single on the capito label is cappy, "boss philly."

matt

By RODS (195.93.50.10) on Monday, June 30, 2003 - 06:04 pm:

Getting back to Roy Handy who along with an unknown acquaintance "picked up a bag of fish and chips" and headed off somewhere I cant make out but could be "home". That line just didn't ring true in 1972. 1979 and I go into a diner on Gratiot I think and there's fish and chips with malt vinegar on the table. All was explained at that moment. I of course had the grits.

By LG Nilsson (213.89.29.129) on Monday, June 30, 2003 - 08:00 pm:

In the Jobete vaults somewhere is an acetate by Roy Handy & the Parlettes "Let's be friends". I have not heard it.

Lars

By matt (208.130.56.167) on Monday, June 30, 2003 - 08:00 pm:

"headed for a place called home"?

and sweat was pouring off of his face, and fish and chips were all over the place...

maybe he got the food from the long-gone heather hill, on woodward just north of 8 mile.

By keith.rylatt@tesco.net (217.137.90.25) on Tuesday, July 01, 2003 - 12:57 pm:

Re Capito Records. Detroit 48207. It operated between '66 & '68 and had two releases, the Ultimates as Graham mentioned also the Quinns. Am I going mad or was there a bootleg on the Stephanye label? Keith

By MEL&THEN SOME (81.174.193.100) on Tuesday, July 01, 2003 - 01:54 pm:

Supertime by the Golden World strings that was a bootleg Keith
mel

By matt (208.130.56.167) on Tuesday, July 01, 2003 - 02:14 pm:

keith: there's at least one additional capito release: cappy, "boss philly"/"soul shaker." both sides are instrumentals, and it's definitely the same label (i have the quinns, too).

By Keith Rylatt (217.137.90.42) on Tuesday, July 01, 2003 - 02:53 pm:

Matt Please could you look at a couple of my questions on the Sam E Solo thread and here a couple more - was the Big mack label owner's name Ed Mc Coy or Mc Cay, if it's McCoy as I suspect why was it part of Macay Recording Co? Also was Sandy Hollis on Big Wheel from Detroit? Thanks Keith

By matt (208.130.56.167) on Wednesday, July 02, 2003 - 02:22 pm:

keith: it's mccoy, and he was alive and in detroit as recently as three years ago. i don't know anything about macay or sandy hollis.
m

By MEL&THEN SOME (217.14.178.36) on Wednesday, July 02, 2003 - 02:58 pm:

Didnt the Supertime track originally come from a Kama Sutra album track?
Loving Spoonful or somebody like that?
but was covered as the Golden World strings then some how bootlegged onto the Stephanye Label.
mel

By stillsoulin (81.132.154.63) on Wednesday, July 02, 2003 - 04:11 pm:

rich, the 700 series of red coach was an earlier incarnation of the label, also very elusive for me, slight change in lettering also, REDD COACH as apposed to RED COACH, can anyone offer a listing for the earlier label, i read in a fanzine once there were some gospel things on the label, but which series? as i have yet to come across any.
rob hurcomb

By Rich (162.33.235.234) on Thursday, July 03, 2003 - 09:19 am:

Thanks Rob

By Davie Gordon (193.122.21.42) on Thursday, July 03, 2003 - 09:28 am:

Keith,

Sandy Hollis on Big Wheel - looks Detroit to me.
The writer credits include "A. Hollowell" who is
probably Alton Hollowell who was in fifties group
the Enchanters (on Coral) and was also in the
Falcons on Big Wheel.

I suspect Sandy's real name might be Hollowell
and that she used "Hollis" for professional purposes.

Davie

By acooolcat (61.58.181.17) on Thursday, July 03, 2003 - 11:38 am:

Keith,
I spoke to the Rev. McCoy in Detroit last September.

Graham

By Don (68.75.57.104) on Thursday, July 03, 2003 - 07:59 pm:

I read in an interview back in the day when asked of this mysterious yet unknown artist, it seemed to me when reading Clinton's interview it seemed as if he was less than interested in speaking of Roy Handy. I'm just assuming I wonder if George and Roy are one in the same, you know, like Parliament-Funkadelic?!

By MEL&THENSOME (217.14.178.50) on Monday, July 07, 2003 - 01:52 pm:

For anyone thats interested in the bootleg of
Supertime
it was taken from the album called
"total eclipse"
issued on Imperial records no.12353.

The vocal track to it called
"six o'clock"
was by the Lovin' spoonful on Kama Sutra and was apparantly a us hit.

As far as I know the inst was pulled and then pressed on a 45.

Why Stephanye?

and who named it the golden world strings?

mel(andthensome)

By Andy Rix (195.93.50.10) on Wednesday, July 09, 2003 - 04:25 pm:

Rose Marie McCoy & Gene Redd were invited to go write & record in Detroit ... Rose told me the first thing they were asked to do when they got to the Golden world studios was to write a song for the girl over in the corner ... rose said she looked a bit like a witch so they composed 'I'm Spellbound' for Tamiko.
Gene owned Stephanye Records & it was based in New Jersey. The Prophets are a different group to Shrine guys.
If anybody has specific questions for Rose let me know off - line and I'll call her
AndyRix@aol.com

By MEL&THEN SOME (81.174.194.138) on Wednesday, July 09, 2003 - 04:41 pm:

Hey Andy
didnt Tamiko Jones go on to marry Blues and Soul Icon John Abbey
although they were divorced after a while?

talking of Mr Abbey
I actually wrote to him years ago whilst he was settling in to the usa way of life
and he wrote back with a lengthy letter
a really nice guy and a guy that a lot of music lovers owe a lot too.

cheers
mel
ps
I have a few things to ask so may well be e.mailing to your link.
many thanks

By Musicchef (68.104.25.189) on Wednesday, July 09, 2003 - 05:14 pm:

Is anyone interested in a photo shoot with Gene Redd from 10/1/68 ? According to our catalog, we got a 30 negative shoot featuring him.

By MEL&THEN SOME9 (217.14.178.9) on Wednesday, July 09, 2003 - 05:17 pm:

Musicchef
I would be very grateful to you
mel

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