By Michael/cleoharvey (160.79.83.208) on Thursday, June 05, 2003 - 01:39 pm:

I am relatively new to this Forum so you esteemed gentleman have most likely already discussed this CD (you miss nothing!!!) but I just received the double CD "A Cellarful of Motown" and am loving it. You can see why Motown might not have released some of the songs but there are some wonderful surprises.

Brenda Holloway: The cuts do her service and makes you wonder why she was not a bigger star. She comes off as being versatile and able to vocally do many things. My take is that she may have done better at another label, Stax for instance. What do you think?

Chris Clark: Love her voice on "Do I Love You" Again another case of an opportunity to make a star missed.

Tammi Terrell: Well...what can you say. It is interesting because from her solo albums and duets with Marvin Gaye, I thought of her voice in a different way than I do after hearing All I DO. She almost sound like Diana Ross on this song and it makes you wonder if the rumors were true, what she would have done as lead with The Supremes. Of course Jean Terrell was divine, but it is tantalizing to think about.

It is great to hear Dennis Edwards as a Contour pre-Temptations. You can sense from his vocal he is destined for better things.

BIG, BIG, surprise: Barbara McNair singing Baby A Go Go. I had always thought that her being signed to Motown was bizarre (like Diahnn Carroll) and a mistake but after hearing this song, she definitely could have had hits had she received the production and push.

Love Frank Wilson's voice. I was not aware that he was involved in writing/production at Motown as early as he was.

Pardon my ignorance, but who is Sammy Ward?

If you guys have already discussed this subject, treat me like an ugly stepchild and ignore this thread. If you have some other comments about this great CD, I would love to hear them.

By Scratcher (65.238.127.230) on Thursday, June 05, 2003 - 02:02 pm:

The late Sammy Ward was one of Tamla/Motown's earliest recording artists. The man was a great bluesy singer who should have done much better. Smokey wrote "You Really Got a Hold on Me" for Sammy but Berry Gordy insisted that Smokey do it on the Miracles. Ian Levine later recorded Ward on the song and the rendition is one of Levine's best efforts as a record producer. You have to check out his single "Bread Winner"--one of his best; it's available on Blues Evolution, a Motown CD.

I also think Ward was one of those singer who had a full time job cause he didn't venture much outside of Michigan. He had a handful of releases on the Tamla and Soul labels including a couple of duets with a female singer.

Shorty Long coming to Motown via Harvey and Gwen Fuqua's Tri-Phi/Harvey labels greased the exit for Ward as Long was perceived as having more potential. They were similar singers but Ward was grittier.

By TonyRussi (68.210.2.213) on Thursday, June 05, 2003 - 02:02 pm:

As a Motown "Freak" since 1961 I love hearing the unreleased material, however, I think the Motown Quality Control Dept. had a great batting average for picking the hits.I also feel certain artists did not get the proper promotion for whatever reason at a certain time in the companies history.Brenda Holloway is a first class example.Sammy Ward was a more blues styled artist at early Motown. Without a doubt Tammi Terrell would have been a major solo star. Barbara McNair was a more "adult contemporary" entertainer not known or aimed at the Soul or Pop/teen audiances.I think the later 60's is where as a Motown Fan I saw the company pushing certain artist to the detriment of other artist. Martha Reeves could have and should have had continual huge hits...from her Sugar N Spice LP the company did not even release the 2 possible monster hits "I'm A Winner" & "It Ain't Like That" .I love the Cellarful Collection its just further proof of how talented everyone at Motown truly were & are.

By Vickie (198.81.26.231) on Thursday, June 05, 2003 - 02:04 pm:

I still don't have that CD..

I must get it..
I've heard Tammi's version of All I Do..
but I dilly dallied getting it..

you just reminded me Michael Cleoharvey -
I am ordering it today...

thanks

By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Thursday, June 05, 2003 - 02:35 pm:

Cleo/Michael:
I bought the CD right when it was released and it didn't leave my Discman until a month later! My favorites are:
"All I Do" - Tammi Terrell
"Danger! Heartbreak Dead Ahead" - Contours
"A Touch Of Venus" - Patrice Holloway (too bad Motown didn't put any support behind her!)
"It Must Be Love" - Chuck Jackson & Yvonne Fair
"Baby A Go-Go" - Barbara McNair

As Harry Weinger said about Motown's release philosophy - "There's A, then there's A+". Nonetheless, the CD is a wonderful treasure trove and I can't wait for another "Cellarful" of classics.

Kevin Goins - KevGo

PS - If you like this, check out "Motown Sings Motown" - this CD features versions of Motown hits sung by other Motown folks (David Ruffin does a KILLER version of the Jackson 5's "I Want You Back" and Smokey & the Miracles' "I Heard It Through The Grapevine - which is the original version - is featured on this CD).

By john dixon (205.188.209.109) on Thursday, June 05, 2003 - 02:38 pm:

Michael, "ACOM" was my favorite new release last year. I felt that about 30 of the 40 cuts should have been released and had great hit potential. As you mentioned, I loved the Brenda Holloway, Chris Clark, Contours, and Tammi Terrell cuts. I would have to add that I'm also partial to the cuts by Patrice Holloway, Gladys Knight, Marv Johnson, Jimmy Ruffin, Marvelettes, and the Funk Brothers.

What a pure gift it is to hear new classic sounding Motown at this juncture in life; it's not at all something I was expecting. I anxiously await ACOM II.

By Handsome (170.118.157.134) on Thursday, June 05, 2003 - 02:45 pm:

Hi Everyone.

I have picked up this cd sometime ago and I love it. I agree with what everyone has said...My favorites are Tammi Terrell, Gladys Knight & Brenda Holloway. Syreeta sounds like Tammi on the track, "You made me feel like everything was alright".

On the Motown sings Motown cd, Gladys Knight puts Diana Ross to shame on, "I'm gonna make you love me", singing the song in the same key, slightly different arrangement. I also chuckled on Blinky's rendition of "The Hunter get captured by the game" when she sings the line, "love hit me like a sudden slap, and the Andantes go "Oh" like someone just slapped the hell out of them.

By Common (209.2.55.171) on Thursday, June 05, 2003 - 03:43 pm:

Hello everyone,

I have "Cellarful" & Motown sings Motown. Personally, I prefer "Motown Sings Motown" over "Cellarful". All of my favs are on the first disc, which are:

Baby A Go-Go-Barbara McNair: I never heard her sing before so this was a real treat. I'm surprised that Motown didn't release this as a single. Reminds me a little of "These Boots Are Made For Walking" in terms of rhythm. Don't why this song comes to mind but it does.

All I Do-Tammi Terrell: No explanation needed! Motown dropped the ball on this one and I agree she does sound like Diana but with more vocal power. Plus she doesn't across too "whiny" as Diana tended to come off on some records.

Lucky, Lucky Me & On The Avenue-Jimmy Ruffin: I love Jimmy's version of 'Lucky Me' which to me is better than Marvin's version (and I love me some Marvin!). Jimmy's voice sounds better with big band type of arrangements & minimal background input. "On The Avenue" reminds me of "The In Crowd". The lyrics & the music go so well together & and Jimmy's voice sounds so sweet.

Poor Little Rich Girl-Marvelettes: Another one gem that Motown let slip by. This one has "hit" written all over it.

I like Stevie's & Gladys' cuts as well. There are a couple others but don't want to get too longwinded.

Peace!

By RD (63.188.33.124) on Thursday, June 05, 2003 - 03:51 pm:

The Miracles' original version of "I Heard It Through the Grapevine" first appeared on their Special Occassion album. It's the weakest of all the renditions I've ever heard.

By Michael/cleoharvey (160.79.83.208) on Thursday, June 05, 2003 - 04:09 pm:

Scratcher:

Thanks for the info on Sammy Ward. I assumed I knew everyone who recorded for Motown. Of course, you know what you do when you assume...

KevGo: I have to get Motown sings Motown, thanks!

Eveyone:

Really great comments regarding this album. Do you think Brenda Holloway would have done better at another label? It might seem a moot point. But on some cuts a big, soulful sound comes out of her voice (sort of how Florence Ballard sang) and Brenda's voice might not have fit into the "crossover" style that Motown was leaning towards at the time. What do you think.

By jan (217.8.173.20) on Thursday, June 05, 2003 - 04:12 pm:

i would like to mention - 'riding high on love' by junior walker and the allstars from cellarful - a truly joyful recording just as strong as his bigger hits

probably MY favourite from this absolute treasure trove of motown riches

it made me want to rediscover junior's records and i came to the conclusion i just don't have enough of them

By Common (209.2.55.170) on Thursday, June 05, 2003 - 04:22 pm:

RD: I didn't care for Smokey's version of "Grapevine" either. Nor for Marvin's version of "My Girl".

Handsome: I love Gladys' rendition of "I'm Gonna.." as well. Gladys could part her heart & soul into anything & make a song her own. The J5 version of "You Really Got A Hold On Me" is the bomb! Blinky had to really grow on me & now I enjoy hearing it.

BTW, Carolyn Crawford reminded me of Diana on the "Cellarful" CD. As a matter of fact, that single could've been done on the Supremes. It would've been interesting to hear the Supremes cover this track.

Peace!

By TonyRussi (68.210.2.213) on Thursday, June 05, 2003 - 04:28 pm:

I think Brendas'voice was perfectly suited to the Motown Sound.She probably should have moved to Detroit and worked more closely with Smokey Robinson.If she never went with Motown we might not be talking about her 39 years later.At the time(after the success of "When I'm Gone")I thought she would be the Female solo star for the void left by Mary Wells departure.

By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Thursday, June 05, 2003 - 04:32 pm:

Cleo/Michael:
Brenda Holloway did audition for the LA-based Del-Fi label (home of Ritchie Valens and later the Bobby Fuller Four) and recorded an early version of "Every Little Bit Hurts" (her voice, rhythm section, fat Hammond organ)that was never released until a few years ago on a Del-Fi Girl Group CD. Unfortunately, Del-Fi did not have the capital or resources to sell an R&B/soul record even though Bob Keane (label president) did try a couple years later with Bronco Records (with a young Barry White handling A&R).

I feel that Motown was the right fit for Brenda especially when "Every Little Bit Hurts" was a hit before the Supremes even saw the Top Ten of a pop music chart(in fact, Brenda was asked to headline a Dick Clark tour and Berry agreed as long as Dick booked the Supremes as well, which Dick did reluctantly). If Motown had set up in LA a few years earlier, Brenda may have had a chance.

I couldn't see Brenda record for another label mainly because labels like the big majors (Columbia, RCA, Decca) didn't have the marketing muscle and in-roads Motown, Atlantic & Chess did to sell R&B/Soul music and the independents that existed probably would have only got as far as a couple of releases over a year or two (Brenda was on Motown from 1964 to 1968).

Kevin Goins - KevGo

By Handsome (170.118.157.134) on Thursday, June 05, 2003 - 04:45 pm:

Michael: I think Motown was right for Brenda. Her vocal style has variation. I just think the timing & location was her issue. Forgive me if, I'm being redundant.

By LeVan45789 (166.107.78.146) on Thursday, June 05, 2003 - 06:57 pm:

I too agree that Brenda should haven been a bigger star a Motown. But as we all know around that time in '64 the push was for the Supremes and Diana was Berry's woman. She had all the
right things going for her beauty and she was
very sexy for that time.

By Michael/cleoharvey (160.79.83.208) on Friday, June 06, 2003 - 12:25 pm:

Thanks for all the comments about Brenda Holloway. Of course I knew about her and I am sure the R&B world thought her a star but it seems that she had far more talented than the material she was relegated to. I suppose that is true of so many artists. That is why I asked the question about her on another label. At least we have compilations like A Cellarful Of Motown to remind us of the depth of talent of the Motown artists.

By FrankM (81.152.61.71) on Saturday, June 07, 2003 - 01:20 pm:

Brian mathews played two tracks from cellar full of motown on BBC rado 2 this morning. Brian whose voice can be heard on the Beatles Anthology and Beatle at The beeb, does a two hour Sounds of The Sixties show every Saturday morning (08:00 BST) he played Gladys Knight and then Barbara McNair whom he exlpained Motown had signed to entertain a more mature audience. He then went to explain her significance to the Northern soul scene. You can hear the whole show which includes a pile of UK and US hits and rarities by heading for www.bbc.co.uk/radio 2 and looking for the listen again button.

By Vandelron (24.44.20.172) on Saturday, June 07, 2003 - 03:19 pm:

I can definitely see Brenda on another label. Even Bery thought her first hit was atypical Motown. Brenda was a mucician as well. Had jazzy inclinations. She seems to be coming more into her own now-her album for Volt and recent apperances and bringinig the house down at Berry testemonial last year. She got the biggest rave in Rolling Stone magazine recently for her recordings on Cellarful....

By RODS (195.93.50.10) on Sunday, June 29, 2003 - 12:24 pm:

Dont know if anyone would be interested in this but here's the story regarding finding the first lot of unreleased Motown.
I was in US looking for 45s and Im at a mate's flat in '81 or '82. Stafford all-nighter had started and myself and Dave Withers had decided to try dj-ing to counterbalance the mind-numbing 70's and 80's stuff that dominated the scene back then. The guy I was with, although not in the biblical sense,was a long time soul collector with a lot of duplicates he wanted rid of. Im looking thru his stuff and there's a tape playing in the background to which Im listening with half an ear. I think it was Temps "Come on back to me baby" I first heard. Turns out he was a mate of Tom de Pierro who had compiled the "From the Vaults album for Motown. In fact same guy who had a Frank Wilson until it went missing. It appears Tom had taped a lot of tracks he didn't use for the first album and given my mate copies.I played thru the 2or 3 tapes he had and ran off those with a Northern feel."Suspicion", "It's killin' me", "Sugar's never been.." "It's too late" etc
Back in UK we cut about 6 acetates and played 'em at Stafford. With the majority of punters I think they went down like a lead brick!! Very few remember and in the Top 500 Northern book I think Richard Searling gets the credit for discovering some of them.
The guy who did the acetates in Birmingham had a hit as producer or arranger with Maisonettes "Heartache Avenue" which bears a strong resemblance to instr. of "In the neighbourhood" which was one of the tracks we had cut.
There was a really nice midtempo track called "Words" by Majestics [female lead]which Im not sure has surfaced since. I know there's a version of "Tell me" now supposedly by Magnetics. According to my mate Majestics were the Monitors in some form. I also remember an Elvis soundalike but with typical Motown backing. Long time ago now but Johnny Powers rings a bell.
For anyone into Northern this was Dave and my playlist at the time:-
Phoenetics, Limelights UNCLE, Young Brothers,Monique,Royal Robins,CODs,Combinations on KELLMAC and KIMTONE, Classics YAN-G,Del-tours, Dreams "Have your fun", Executive 4, John & Weirdest,Blue Steam. We either found them ourselves or bought off Richard S. and Dave Raistrick. Unfortunately it was a bit of a losing battle at the time and we jacked the dj-ing in. Thank Christ Butch, Keb, Rob, Guy persevered so that today we have this vibrant scene where 70's is again pushing 60's to the wall. Speaking about NW clubs as I dont get about much. If I hear that bloody NF Porter again....

By Ian W (194.75.129.2) on Monday, June 30, 2003 - 07:39 am:

Hey, is that Rod Shard out there? Rod does a pretty good job nowadays of deejaying aroung the north-west! And he probably sold me about half my collection. Hello to you and Claire.

Ian