By Bob Hopeful (67.249.57.171) on Thursday, May 29, 2003 - 11:42 pm:

There's a piece in today's New York Times about various vintage soul music projects, including "Standing in the Shadows of Motown."

By RJ Spangler (64.12.97.7) on Friday, May 30, 2003 - 12:52 am:

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/05/27/movies/27SOUL.html

By John Lester (217.40.234.68) on Friday, May 30, 2003 - 02:13 am:

I couldn't get to that article via that link!

:-(


However, it can't be long before the public gets fed up with is considered "current music" and replaces it with perhaps a "soul revival" that contains real music....music that has a tune that you can whistle to and lyrics that you can sing along to without fear of being slung into the slammer for bad language.

By Carl Dixon London (62.31.40.155) on Friday, May 30, 2003 - 03:19 am:

John - I think you have to register with the New York Times to get access to the stories. I did, and can see the story. And yes, I think you are right about a revival. It is only a matter of time. The solution to all this is the ladies! I am sure they pull the strings on many things. Once they are hooked, the boys will be there hook or by crook as well. I could go on forever.....

By RJ Spangler (64.12.97.7) on Friday, May 30, 2003 - 05:19 am:

I have the new Jazztimes mag and they have an interesting article about Roy Hargrove and the new neo-soul movement. Kind of interesting.

By RJ Spangler (64.12.97.7) on Friday, May 30, 2003 - 05:22 am:

I just took a look at that NY Times article. Its by Elvis Mitchell. He used to live in Detroit and write for one of the big Newspapers.
Sue might remember...

By medusa9e (66.73.10.9) on Friday, May 30, 2003 - 08:38 am:

Now John,
I really feel ya on that, I mean, how long can a person live without REAL music like we had?
I believe there's a saying that says something like "Music calms the savaged beast"...well...yes, this is true, only if it's Music and not NOISE...this is one reason Y some stations 2 day (still) play our kind of music.
I would love 2 C a savaged beast calmed by some of what is called music 2day. The beast would probably >>> LOL!

By Sue (64.12.97.7) on Friday, May 30, 2003 - 10:14 am:

Oh yeah, Elvis Mitchell is a Detroit guy -- went to Wayne, wrote about movies for the Free Press, for a short, memorable period. He managed to tick a lot of people off with his very pointed reviews, which is hilarious in retrospect -- the times just had to catch up with him.

I ran into Elvis a couple of years ago at the Almost Famous junket where he made me laugh hysterically with a sharp crack about a movie critic I worked with. I was glad to read his thoughts on the Jackie Wilson musical; although the play has flaws it's such a stage-worthy story, as he wrote.

By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Friday, May 30, 2003 - 10:40 am:

Elvis also hosts a great NPR show called "The Treatment" where he inteviews those involved in all forms of entertainment. He also served as editor in chief at Spin Magazine.

Great article in the Times...kinda reflects what we've been discussing out here on the Forum.

Kevin Goins - KevGo

By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Friday, May 30, 2003 - 11:41 am:

And Elvis is my brother in the Guild.

By RJ Spangler (64.12.97.7) on Friday, May 30, 2003 - 05:55 pm:

I finished the Hargrove piece last night is its a good read. Very informative on the neo-soul movement!

By Fred (205.188.209.109) on Saturday, May 31, 2003 - 04:19 pm:

The only problem I have with the Mitchell piece is that it tends to view soul as merely an object of historical interest. The movies and (few) recordings he mentions are, in essence, retrospectives. Absolutely no disrespect meant to SITSOM, but the concert footage is new renditions of old songs, and so is OTSS. That's what they were meant to be, and both succeed.

It is always nice to get positive coverage like Mitchell's, but soul doesn't need to be seen in the rearview mirror. Look at the Solomon Burke CD, Bettye LaVette's, and the new Isley Brothers. Mitchell appears to ignore these as evidence of anything, and he doesn't notice that soul music is alive, well, and thriving. Soul music doesn't need a revival. What needs to be revived is the wider audience and the means for sating the appetite they have today.

If someone sees OTSS, what CDs are they inspired to buy? New CDs by the artists or Greatest Hits compilations (which a lot of the audience, God bless them, already have)? Jerry Butler hasn't had a release of new material in seven or eight years. The same with Ann Peebles. Pickett's got one from 1999, but try and actually find a copy. Sam Moore's "new" CD was recorded over 30 years ago. As long as soul music is treated as some kind of cultural artifact, which Mitchell does, we're stuck with things as they are. I'd rather read "In The Basement" or "Soul Express" and see what people are trying today, and someone should send Mitchell a subscription to both of them.

Don't get me wrong, the history is wonderful and the common ground gives us (especially us here) a place to stand, but I would rather see something new built on that foundation rather than just preservation of the ruins.

By Eli (172.160.200.191) on Saturday, May 31, 2003 - 04:43 pm:

I refuse to be relegated to some dingy, musty old building as in New Orleans' Preservation Hall.
This guy ought to reexamine his mode of gathering his info.
He probably couldn't differentiate the Soul of a great artist from the sole of his worn out shoe!!
Please!!!

By Bob Hopeful (68.129.149.102) on Saturday, May 31, 2003 - 05:31 pm:

One of the things "Standing in the Shadows of Motown" does is show that a number of these cats from the past are still doing it. So, they're not really "past," they are present. The recent, newly recorded Solomon Burke album, for instance, is evidence that he continues to be a great artist. And to quote Willie "Teasin' You" Tee's words at Earl King's memorial service, �One of the things we have to do is find a better way to give the flowers to our legends before they pass.�

Though I, too, have been guilty of not recognizing and appreciating these surviving classic artists, I'd like for us to buy these great folks' new recordings, go see them in concert, ask the media to cover them and insist that all the snakes, sharks and cheats in the music industry pay them every dime they ever earned but did not receive.

By Sue (152.163.252.68) on Saturday, May 31, 2003 - 11:03 pm:

Excellent points, Fred. When I first heard of Elvis' story I assumed it was about the current popularity of stuff like the Isleys, Solomon Burke etc.

As it is, I think he just took a different tack, going to see the Jackie Wilson musical and of course, as the movie critic, he's been on SITSOM and OTSS.

It'd be a different story, a music story, if he wrote about the current stuff. Elvis is quite a good writer even if you don't agree with him all the time -- in fact it's sometimes more fun to disagree with him.

By Jim Russell (68.129.149.231) on Sunday, June 01, 2003 - 12:00 am:

I've been impressed with Elvis Mitchell's movie reviews on some occasions I saw them, but other times he's like many modern scribes in high places -- more attitude than talent. I didn't get that much out of his piece.

Though Mitchell is officially a movie reviewer, he goes well beyond film in his story, including sampling and musical theater. Maybe that's why the piece loses focus. But I'm glad he put a spotlight on the topic and I hope he didn't have sit near Jayson Blair, who must have been quite the prima donna.

By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Monday, June 02, 2003 - 11:35 am:

Folks:
I'm just glad that Elvis Mitchell has given OTSS and SITSOM exposure through his NYT articles and reviews because at least he's getting the word out that these things do exist.

At my part time record retail gig, whenever I saw a customer pick up the SITSOM DVD or CD & asked them how did they hear about it, half the folks I spoke to said they saw Elvis' review in the New York Times.

If Elvis' reviews mean that folks run out & buy CDs or see films regarding our soul legends - whereas they may not have in the past - then he is doing the genre a great service, regardless of what his journalistic leanings may be.

Kevin Goins - KevGo