By STUBASS (152.163.252.68) on Monday, May 12, 2003 - 11:31 pm:

O.K. ALL!!!...DISCUSSION TIME!!!...IT'S OFTEN BEEN SAID...THAT A LAWYER WHO DEFENDS HIMSELF HAS A "FOOL" FOR A CLIENT!!!...SAME AS A DOCTOR WHO TREATS HIMSELF...HAS A "FOOL" FOR A PATIENT!!!...THE REASON IS SIMPLE...*OBJECTIVITY*!!!...HOW ABOUT RECORDING ARTIST'S...WHO INSIST ON PRODUCING THEIR OWN RECORDS (C.D.'S)!!!...NOW THE FIRST THING THAT JUMPS OUT AT YOU IS MARVIN GAYE (WHATS GOING ON)...AND HIS HIGHLY ACCLAIMED PROJECT...WHERE MARVIN DID VIRTUALLY *EVERYTHING* ... DOWN TO SWEEPING THE STUDIO FLOORS!!!...HOW ABOUT THOSE ARTISTS WHO TRIED AND FAILED TO PRODUCE THEMSELVES...BECAUSE THEY THOUGHT THAT THEY WERE BETTER AND SMARTER THAN THEIR PROVIOUSLY EMPLOYED PRODUCERS...BUT WE NEVER HEARD ABOUT MOST OF THOSE PROJECTS!!!...WHEN DOES IT WORK...OR NOT WORK... WHEN AN ARTIST TRIES TO CONTROL THE ENTIRE RECORDING ENVIRONMENT...AND THE PROJECT LIVES OR DIES BY THEIR...AND THEIR ALONE DECISION'S!!!...LIKE TO HEAR FROM KEVGO AND THE REST OF YOU (YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE) ON THIS!!!...WHAT DO YOU SAY???...STUBASS

By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Monday, May 12, 2003 - 11:54 pm:

Stu,
Generally I have always felt that artists should never attempt tp produce themselves. Yes, there are exceptions such as Marvin and lately Aerosmith pulled it off. However these are ( were ) extremely talented and experienced people. As a rule it is just not a very good idea.

By 1Wicked (24.126.64.120) on Tuesday, May 13, 2003 - 01:37 am:

Stu...I'll give you just two words WRT self-produced artists: "Brothers Johnson". "Q's" business practices have been called "suspect" by some...but he does have the studio magic, and they (as well as MJ) should never have left the fold. Both are now candidates for the back of a milk carton.

Artists who do well at self production are as rare as good NBA player/coaches. LOL

By Randy Russi (169.139.180.100) on Tuesday, May 13, 2003 - 08:47 am:

Smokey would be an exception of an artist who can
(and should've!) produced himself.

By Edgar (200.46.12.61) on Tuesday, May 13, 2003 - 08:54 am:

Diana Ross.

By Horse (159.53.238.241) on Tuesday, May 13, 2003 - 09:39 am:

Stu,

Good topic. I believe Mariah Carey was on her way to mega stardom under the guidence of Tommy Mitola. Mariah is an excellent singer, but felt she wanted to head into a different direction. I think the route she has taken has no longevity and lacks musical quality. With Tommy, she could have surpassed the diva status of Whitney and possibly Celine. Mariah is an extremely talented artist, but she has some maturing to do in the area of the business. I would have to say that I can't blame Tommy for keeping a tight rein on her, as he was quite aware of what he had in her. As you can see, Mariah is not at the top of her game and could be on top of the world with the right guidence. Give a listen to her earlier material and you will hear the fire she is capable of.

By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Tuesday, May 13, 2003 - 10:11 am:

Horse,
I agree. She was on the right track until Sean Combs, aka Puff Daddy, aka P Diddy got his hands on her. He tried turning her into his idea of what neo R&B was all about. What a couple of idiots!

By R&B (138.238.41.215) on Tuesday, May 13, 2003 - 10:18 am:

CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG HERE,BUT DIDN'T GENE CHANDLER RUN INTO DIFFICULTY WHEN HE PRODUCED HIMSELF IN THE EARLY 70'S?

By STUBASS (152.163.252.68) on Tuesday, May 13, 2003 - 01:46 pm:

SOME GOOD TAKES: AS FOR MARIAH AND TOMMY...I BELIEVE THAT THE LACK OF PRODUCTION IN THEIR BEDROOM LED TO THEIR DECLINING RELATIONSHIP IN THE STUDIO!!!...P-DIDDY SEEMS TO HAVE INTERFERED WITH MORE CAREERS THAN MANDITORY RETIREMENT...HOWEVER...PERHAPS HE WOULD AVOID SOME OF THESE SITUATIONS IF HE LIMITED HIMSELF TO THE "HIP'HIP" GENRE!!!...WICKED...ARE YOU SAYING THAT BILL RUSSELL COULD HAVE PRODUCED A HIT RECORD OR TWO???...AND R&B...WE'RE TALKING "PRODUCTION HERE...NOT "REPRODUCTION"...AS IN THIS RABBIT KICK YOU'VE BEEN ON!!!...SERIOUSLY...AT WHAT POINT DOES AN ARTIST...HAVING HAD SPENT SO MUCH TIME IN THE STUDIO...WITH VARIOUS PRODUCERS...GAIN THE ABILITY TO TAKE THE BEST OF EACH...AND TRANSFORM IT INTO AN ECLECTIC KNOWLEDGE WHICH THEY CAN THEN UTULIZE TO CREATE AN INDIVIDUAL PRODUCTION STYLE!!!...PERHAPS THE PROBLEM EXISTS WHEN THEY TRY TO MAKE THOSE OBJECTIVE JUDGEMENTS ON THEIR OWN MATERIAL...VERSUS...AN ARTIST...WHO GAINS KNOWLEDGE...AND BEGINS TO PRODUCE "OTHER" ARTISTS...AND I'M SURE THAT WE CAN ALL THINK OF THOSE PEOPLE WHO MOVE FROM THE MIC TO INSIDE THE BOOTH...SOME WITH GREAT SUCCESS!!!...STU

By Wondering (169.139.180.100) on Tuesday, May 13, 2003 - 02:11 pm:

I'm not so sure Diana Ross did a good job of
producing herself, or are you saying she
should not have?

By Davie Gordon (193.122.21.42) on Tuesday, May 13, 2003 - 02:23 pm:

I think Edgar was succinctly saying that Ms. Ross
is a prime example of the pitfalls of self-production. I completely agree with him.

By STUBASS (205.188.209.109) on Tuesday, May 13, 2003 - 02:54 pm:

THE X FACTOR IN MANY OF THESE "SELF PRODUCED" PROJECTS...IS THAT THE ARTIST'S SOMETIMES PRODUCE IN NAME ONLY...WITH A "REAL" PRODUCER SOMEWHERE IN THE BACKGROUND PULLING THE STRINGS!!!...IT SURE MAKES INTERESTING LINER NOTES WHEN AN ARTIST MAKES THEIR PRODUCING DEBUT...WHEN THE ONLY THING THEY MAY BE PRODUCING IS THEIR NAME ON THE PRODUCTION CREDITS!!!...STU

By Edgar (200.46.133.196) on Tuesday, May 13, 2003 - 05:38 pm:

Yes, Davie, that's what I meant.