By Yan (24.69.255.204) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 06:05 pm:

...OK, so I was hoping someone could help me out regarding the recordings that came out of the New York and L.A offices of Motown in the sixties. What I was specifically wondering was how much of the stuff was cut in L.A/New York as opposed to being written (and I guess roughly demo'ed??) there but then cut in Detroit by the Funks. Take the L.A office for instance- did Brenda Holloway go back and forth between Detroit and L.A during her stay at Motown? What was cut in L.A and what in Detroit?? Who were the musicians for the L.A sessions? How much did Hal Davis/Marc Gordon/Frank Wilson work in Detroit as opposed to cutting tracks in L.A themselves? What other L.A talent wrote for Motown via the office- there must be quite a lot in the vaults, yeah? Obviously Ed Cobb did but I also know the Pipkins wrote stuff too, because of those Oma Page tracks on the 1990 Marvin Box-Set. Was "Touch Of Venus" the Funks?? That's a lot of questions- sorry! If this is all really obvious stuff I apologise. Could those who know help me out and be specific about details- cheers!

The New York thing is even more complicated to me- so I've read the Raynoma book and I know that the New York offfices were in operation between about 61-64, right- with talent such as George Kerr, Sidney Barnes, George Clinton working for her?? But did they just supply songs/demos for the Detroit artists- with the hope of being invited up to Detroit for their own sessions?? Or were they recording proper finished songs in New York (again- what musicians were playing on the New York sessions?) which Motown simply didn't release. I know the Serenaders (Kerr,Barnes and Timothy Wilson) did fly up to Detroit and record (just one session?) and that one release came out of it. I haven't heard it or seen who was credited on production. Am I right in thinking that the Sammy Turner and Bobby Breen releases (MOR pop, yeah?) were New York Singleton/Raynoma productions?? How about the original Kim Weston version of "You Hit Me"- I'm assuming this was cut in Detroit (the great Mickey Stevenson on prod??) despite being a George Kerr song (with Mickey Valvano and Sylvia Moy- were they both recruited by the New York office??)- what year was this written/produced; surely after 64, right?? Finally the Raynoma book mentions that Kerr (who I think is one of the all-time greats of soul production- listen to Linda Jones' "Just Can't Live My Life"...how on earth did he do it? Amazing!) worked at Motown later as writer/producer- when??

...phew!! Sorry- thats a thousand stupid questions; anyone who can help me out can marry my sister. (she looks OK)

By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 06:55 pm:

Yan,
She looks OK???? LOL...Man if I were you I'd be watching over your shoulder for one irate sister!

By Yan (24.69.255.204) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 07:00 pm:

Ralph;

...don't worry- she's in London and I'm in Vancouver; good safe distance!

By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 07:05 pm:

Oh well, in that case Yan. Hey..Maybe good old StuBass will grant her Anglehood.

By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 07:07 pm:

Angelhood...unless of course Ol Stu has some angle here.

By dvdmike (12.84.102.46) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 08:16 pm:

From sources that I've spoken with, Brenda recorded her first two singles entirely in Los Angeles. The sessions were produced by Hal Davis and Marc Gordon and arranged by either Arthur Wright or James Anthony Carmichael and most likely recorded at Armin Steiner's TTG Studios in Hollywood. The Smokey Robinson produced sessions were Detroit recorded. There were a number of Motown sessions recorded in L.A. beginning in late 1963. The New York sessions were probably recorded at Bell Sound. I don't really know what was cut in NYC except for the "Supremes Sing Rodgers And Hart" LP and a few things by The Supremes, The Miracles and Marvin Gaye that were produced by Mickey Gentile. So far, no one has released enough information pertaining to the Motown L.A./New York sessions.

By dvdmike (12.84.102.46) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 08:21 pm:

I thought someone said that The Tempts "In A Mellow Mood" LP was cut in NYC. I wish someone would finally shed some light on all of this. This is really important and crucial information and someone has it. Maybe some year after we're all history someone will finally deem it important enough to share with inquiring minds.

By Yan (24.69.255.204) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 08:27 pm:

Mike-
...thanks for responding. I share your frustration; but just knowing Arthur Wright and James Carmichael were involved in the Brenda Holloway sessions is a revelation to me- and totally makes posting worth it. Cheers!

By Greg C. (209.71.79.185) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 10:50 pm:

"More Love" by the Miracles was cut in LA

By dvdmike (65.208.234.61) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 07:27 am:

I think some of the late sixties L.A. Motown stuff was cut at RCA

By Davie Gordon (193.122.21.42) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 03:38 pm:

The Marvelettes' "I'll Keep On Holding On" was
cut in New York but I don't know the studio.

I get the impression that, at best, Motown's NY
office cut only demos. According to Raynoma the whole operation was kept pretty short of money by
Detroit and the only full sessions that I'm aware
of were cut in Detroit.

As for L.A. it seems that the Supremes' "The
Happening" was cut there - which I'm quite pleased
to hear as apart from their pre-hit days it's my
least favourite Supremes record.

We've also just had confirmation on the official
Motown board that the pianist on Brenda Holloway's
"Every Little Bit Hurts" was Lincoln Mayorga.

Davie

By dvdmike (12.84.113.226) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 05:05 pm:

Lincoln Mayorga was an L.A. based arranger. One of his biggest hits was "The Birds And The Bees" by Jewel Akens.

By Ritchie (62.254.0.9) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 05:10 pm:

Ooo - deja-vu. To recap what I posted on the Motown BB, Linc also provided the superb piano part on Ketty Lester's "Love Letters", as well as pounding the ivories for the Piltdown Men. (Truly from the sublime to the ridiculous!) Also, it seems more than likely that the wonderful piano-and-vocal demos of the Brenda Holloway songs feature Mr M too.