By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 02:21 pm: |
Well, Susan Whitall, I've been waiting for this article. Congratulations on this fine article.
http://www.detnews.com/2003/entertainment/0304/09/e01-131827.htm
By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 02:25 pm: |
Thanks. Extra points for whomever can pick out the mistake, caused by too many caffeine-fueled hours at the computer, and SteveS doesn't count.
By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 02:33 pm: |
Great story, Sue, except for the tour dates bypassing the pacific northwest.
I give. Where's the error?
By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 02:38 pm: |
My brother is over here. I've asked him to find the errors. He said he has to buy an extra briefcase just for the material he has on the Funk Brothers.
I wonder if they will be selling those jackets at the concert.
By Carl Dixon London (62.31.40.155) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 02:42 pm: |
Fantastic Sue, just great! Is this the mistake 'spoke as if from atop a pink cloud '?? As far as I am concerned Sue, that is an important part of what you have written!! Do I get prize?
By Larry (216.23.183.2) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 02:47 pm: |
Great story Sue. You've done as much or more for the Funks success as ANYONE.
The error must be:
"doubling Stevie Wonder's theramin (keyboard)"
Besides the misspelling, a Theremin isn't a keyboard.
http://theremin.info/
By Larry (216.23.183.2) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 02:53 pm: |
In addition Sue,
I don't remember any Theremin (or keys) in the intro of It's a Shame. By memory I hear a couple guitars split L-R.
By 1wicked (24.126.64.120) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 02:55 pm: |
Love ya Sue ! Just as The Funk Brothers can play anything & make it sound superb, and Patti Austin can sing anything with the same result....I believe you can write about ANYTHING, including the next army worm invasion and capture the reader.
Mistake ? Hmmm...just a guess, but maybe the line about individual Funks touring with various gropus "back in the day"....because it has been written that they were far too valuable to go out on the road and were kept local.
By 1wicked (24.126.64.120) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 02:57 pm: |
Geez...that's groups...not gropus. (Uhhh..where are my glasses....?)
By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 02:58 pm: |
Bingo Larry -- theramin (sp!). It was a clavinet as I've posted here and talked about ad nauseum. Just shows you what writing a story in two hours can do. That and I had a German student job shadowing me so I was nervous having someone watch each word I wrote ...
Carl that may be over the top writing but not an error (laugh).
By Ritchie (62.254.0.9) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 03:02 pm: |
Yep - the "theremin" ref is the only thing I would dispute....?
Otherwise, it's the usual seriously-high Whitall standard :o)
By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 03:06 pm: |
Oh and wicked, individual Funks did tour -- Uriel and Jack with Marvin, Pistol Allen with Stevie, but rarely as a unit, the European tour was probably the only time and Jamerson was kept home from that. After a certain point BG kept them all home. Plus some like Joe Messina NEVER went out on the road.
By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 03:12 pm: |
Sue - "too many caffeine-fueled hours." (LOL)
By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 03:19 pm: |
Larry -- G.C. Cameron told me it was Stevie's clavinet on the opening to "It's a Shame," doubled by a Funk guitar ...giving it that extra sharpness.
Sis - this week and last has been a caffeine-fuelled mess between a bunch of radio stories, the war, and the Funks deadline. When I came in yesterday and saw the poor German student waiting to shadow me I thought OK, you can watch me write a story in 10 minutes. Oh I forgot, had to step in and take care of my infant nephew for a few days ...
By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 03:23 pm: |
Sue:
Have you ever heard of a vacation? Relax - you've more than earned it.
Kevin "De-caff" Goins - KevGo
By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 03:26 pm: |
KevGo - I agree about the vacation. Sue has to tell us about the fun she had with the Funk Brothers along with Carolyn Crawford, and Tweedy Womack. That's what I call a vacation while on the job.
By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 03:31 pm: |
Kevgo,
Journalists at dailies thrive on deadlines, honestly. You have to try not to make mistakes no matter how fast you write. I wrote especially fast so I could hustle my student interrogator out of here and to lunch. I discovered that it's awful having someone look over your shoulder as you write.
By Michael/Cleoharvey (160.79.83.208) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 03:31 pm: |
Great article Sue, thanks for all your efforts.
By Lynn Bruce (65.60.202.214) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 03:36 pm: |
Sue,you got me laughing on the new guy following you around.They used to assign new hires at Northwest to follow an old salt(me) around to familiarize them with the airline ways.I was constantly telling them to take a twenty minute break to get them off my back. Much to my dismay in five minutes I'd turn around and there they were! They were all paranoid that I'd say they were taking to many breaks!!Jeezzz
By STUBASS (64.12.97.7) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 03:38 pm: |
HEY ALL: I HAVE EXTENDED AN INVITATION TO LINDA BROWN AT NARAS (THE GRAMMY PEOPLE) TO ATTEND THE "FUNKS" LOS ANGELES CONCERT AS MY GUEST...AND SHE E-MAILED ME THAT SHE WOULD LIKE TO ATTEND...AND BRING ALONG A FRIEND OF HER'S...A WELL KNOWN MALE SINGER FROM THE ERA (NOT SOUL) WHO HAPPENS TO BE A BIG JOAN OSBORNE FAN!!!...HOPE THAT SHE CAN ATTEND...AND WE CAN ALL STRESS THE IMPORTANCE OF THAT "LIFETIME ACHIEVEMENT AWARD" THAT THE GUYS SO RICHLY DESERVE!!!...STU
By STUBASS (64.12.97.7) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 03:45 pm: |
PS: LINDA INFORMS ME THAT SHE DID SEE THE MOVIE WITH HER FRIEND...AND ENJOYED IT!!!...STU
By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 03:52 pm: |
StuBass - Is that why you purchased all those tickets? Promotion? Great going.
LOL - Sue and your "student interrogator"
By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 04:11 pm: |
Well one cute thing, a German teenager is now a Funks fan ...I sat her down with the Jamerson Bass Player mag so I could make some calls, told her that would explain to her why this story was important ...
By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 06:10 pm: |
Sue:
Hey, at least it was a student and not the boss...
The whole deadline thing is why I turned down a job compiling the R&B & jazz charts for Billboard twelve years ago - I knew that I'd go bonkers within weeks because of the stress.
Keep up the great articles on the Funks and give your niece a hug.
Kevin Goins - KevGo
By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 06:30 pm: |
Another Funk fan to count. :o)
By bmiller360 (64.164.173.148) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 01:05 am: |
stubass..........you're a classy guy. must come from that unusual lineage!
bwm
By STUBASS (205.188.209.38) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 09:38 pm: |
OK BRO: IS THE NEXT LINE..."ALL OF IT LOW"???...THANKS!!!...BY THE WAY...I'M SURE WE'LL ALL MAKE LINDA BROWN FROM NARAS AND JOHNNY RIVERS FEEL RIGHT AT HOME ON THE 23RD AT THE WILTERN!!!...STUBASS
By 65memories (66.72.179.145) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 10:20 pm: |
Sue...
Good article...You've got me hyped now for the Opera House on the 18th to see the Mighty Funks!
By Sue (205.188.209.38) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 10:57 pm: |
Rest up, 65 ...
These guys will hurt you, they're so entertaining ...
By Bob Olhsson (12.77.94.77) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 01:03 pm: |
Sue,
I THOUGHT Stevie played that and most of the rest of the tracks. I can't imagine I would remember it wrong because it was so unusual for tracks not to be by the funks.
Give my best to GC. His vocal session on "It's A Shame" remains the most memorable vocal performance of my life.
By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 01:10 pm: |
Bob,
I totally agree, about G.C.'s vocal on that. He thinks part of why the song worked so well is that Stevie wrote the song specifically for him, after they'd been hanging out and jamming for quite some time. It was recorded a year before it was released; Stevie begged and pleaded but couldn't get "It's a Shame" off the shelf. G.C. says he wrote "Superstition" for him too, but for whatever reason BG wouldn't let the Spinners cut that.
G.C. does remember Funks on that track though, but Stevie took the lead on clavinet (doubled by a Funk on guitar) which gave the lead line that special zing. G.C.'s just joined Otis Williams Temptations so he'll be going out with them.
By Kegtapper (65.58.39.193) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 01:16 pm: |
I want a Funk Bros. Jacket or T-Shirt too... Anybody gonna stock up on History being "re-made"?
Will the be sold on the site?
By bob Olhsson (12.77.95.253) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 08:10 pm: |
Wow, I didn't realize it was a year's wait!
I do remember that the song was treated as an audition for Stevie to pass before they'd let him produce himself. It was so great to see him hit that first pitch right out of the park!
By Vickie (205.188.209.38) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 09:54 pm: |
Wow Sue,
I finally had a chance to read this..
WONDERFUL!!!!
I wish the Tour was longer and had more dates...
Vickie
By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 10:06 pm: |
Vickie --
They're going to add a summer leg if all goes well, and by all accounts ... it's going well.
By Vickie (152.163.188.68) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 10:22 pm: |
I hope so Sue, this tour is something I really really want to see and experience..
it's falling in April is not good for me..if they do any dates when I am off in May, June, & July I will fly somewhere to see them..
My last day of crazy pilot season is April 25th..
Keeping my fingers crossed..I am so glad it's going well and so very happy for them and the fans..it's just wonderful...
Vickie
By Weldon A. Mc Dougal III (68.80.164.254) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 12:30 am: |
Hi Guys I just got home from The Funk Brother show it was out of sight, but the best part was I got the DVD, of the movie "Standing In The Shadows Of Motown" Allen said this is the first time it was on sale anywere in the world, Don't miss the Brother when thay come you way, Your ears will give your head a party.(smile)
WELDON
By Vickie (205.188.209.38) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 12:48 am: |
Right On Weldon!!!!!
That is a memory I want to have...
By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 01:22 am: |
I am jealous Weldon. That was in Philly, right? You see how Allen shows favortism to Philly. Well, I will see them Friday, and I hope to purchase my DVD then.
By Eli (141.151.94.143) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 10:10 am: |
Right on sis, right on!!!!!!
By HW (68.37.216.164) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 12:03 pm: |
My two cents here re "It's A Shame":
There are no keyboards on the track. I've heard the original eight-track session reel with the rhythm section and the 16-track 'bump-up' overdub reel with horns and vocals. I've played with the mix and isolated tracks. The basic instrumentation is, simply, two guitars, two drummers, tambourine and bass. No clavinet, theremin, piano, celeste, Fender, Hammond, or anything else using the 88's.
Bless G.C. Camero's one-take masterpiece, however.
By HW (68.37.216.164) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 12:07 pm: |
Credit Paul Riser's amazing arrangement, too.
By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 01:08 pm: |
HW - If you talk to Allen, would you suggest to him that fans in Detroit would like for him to introduce Paul Riser to the audience in Detroit on Friday, so we can give Paul a standing ovation? Thanks.
By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 04:44 pm: |
The clavinet can sound like a guitar -- G.C. Cameron remembers the track as Stevie's clavinet with a guitar doubling the line.
When I listened to it after that, it made sense then why the "guitar" intro is so sharp-sounding. So Harry, on this one I think G.C. is right.
By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 04:50 pm: |
p.s. It's just not the way Stevie works, to write and produce a track but not play on it at all ..
By HW (68.37.216.164) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 06:01 pm: |
OK, I know this can go on for awhile as we speculate what happened etc.
To be sure, I will listen again to the instrumental mix, look again at the track sheet and pass on my findings. Sue and I have emailed each other privately as well.
Till then,
HW
By Larry (12.141.160.25) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 08:43 pm: |
I've stayed away from the debate on the instrumentation in the intro of "It's a Shame", but, heck, since yer all still chattin' about it...
It opens with rhythm guitar (sounds like a Les Paul) and a 2nd instrument that to me sounds like a reverb laden Tele. Sue, you got me going with Mr. Cameron's recollection, so, I'm trying to stretch my brain to hear this 2nd instr. as Clavinet. I simply can't. Electric Sitar? Nahhh.
If it *is* Clavinet, could it have been treated so much to sound more like gtr than itself? I doubt it. Plus, isn't the sound of a clavinet, similar to harpsichord, in that the 'voice' is actually a combination of 2 or more timbres?
With my undying respect, I'm with HW Sue.
Boy I love this song.
By Larry (12.141.160.25) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 08:47 pm: |
HW and Sue,
I just listened to "I'll Be Around".
It has a Clavinetish-like multi-timbral instrument in the opening.
Could GC Cameron have got it mixed up??
By Sue (64.12.97.7) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 08:55 pm: |
Larry -- I love that song too.
G.C. wouldn't have been on "I'll Be Around," that's from the Atlantic/Phillipe years ...nor was Stevie. We were talking quite specifically about "It's a Shame," and it's quite a vivid memory for G.C., being the biggest record he ever sang on. He told me how Stevie happened to write it for him, and how intense Stevie was about recording it, then getting Motown to release it -- a year, it took him, to convince BG.
It was G.C. who brought up the clavinet, it wasn't a pet theory of mine or anything. I just wanted to know how many guitars, and who was playing, to get such a unique sound. As a reporter it's true, I tend to go with the account of whomever was there. And G.C. didn't hem and haw in remembering, as if he wasn't sure, but offered it right off the bat, talking a mile a minute.
I probably wouldn't feel 100% sure of anything until I heard from Stevie on it.
By Sue (64.12.97.7) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 08:56 pm: |
p.s. I have the highest respect for Harry in all this of course!
By LTLFTC (12.210.76.205) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 08:56 pm: |
It's also possible Stevie "outlined" a guitar part on clavinet that was later replaced on the tape by an actual guitar. I was going to guess maybe a Gibson 335 and a Tele ; clavinets can have a guitar-like timbre (check out Stevie's "Happier Than the Morning Sun") but it sure sounds like 2 guitars to me. As always , I reserve the right to be wrong though...
SteveK
By Sue (205.188.209.38) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 11:00 pm: |
Here's a cool Funks story from the Philly Daily News:
http://www.philly.com/mld/dailynews/5604866.htm
By HW (12.110.192.128) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 11:54 am: |
I never take no offense cause it isn't "me" - I am simply processing the information and passing it on.
By Steve Litos (209.100.86.4) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 02:57 pm: |
Wow, no clavinet on the mutitrack tapes! This is a bigger conspiracy than the JFK assasination, the which is better - Fender Jazz Bass vs Fender Precision Bass argument, or the did Ray Charles play a Fender Rhodes or a Wulitzer Electric on "What I'd Say".
HOHNER CLAVINET CONSPIRACY THEORY
After listening to "It's A Shame" a dozen times I thought I could hear a clavinet at about 15 seconds into the song for only a few seconds. The clavinet doubles the single note guitar line on the intro except for the slight variation at 15 seconds in. To me, it does sound very guitar- like, but it does sound a bit like clavinet. Anyways that's the theory...maybe I'm hearing things.
By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 03:00 pm: |
Steve,
If you're hearing things, so am I -- could it be a ghost track/note?
By Steve Litos (209.100.86.4) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 03:00 pm: |
In Chicago, WJMK Oldies 104.3, had a big push for the April 19th Funk Brothers concert last Thursday. They had ticket givaways and everything. Hopefully it should have a good turnout. The Riviera is an old movie house in the Uptown section of Chicago. It can hold about 1,500 to 2,000 people.
By HW (12.110.192.128) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 04:02 pm: |
As I discussed with Sue offline and as she describes in the "Funk Brothers Take NYC" thread, see below. PLEASE note that none of this is intended to foster anyone taking sides. It's simply the facts as it relates to the finished version of the song.
I respect that GC Cameron recalls Stevie playing the clav or anyone else recalling Stevie playing drums. They are probably both right. Motown sessions weren't one take, after all. It's just that those performances are not on the final take used. And, in Motown's vaults, the final take used is the only reel that exists.
Onward. On that reel we find:
> There is no clavinet on the finished master of "It's A Shame."
> The 16-track reel track sheet shows 13 of the 16 open tracks were used. The other three are blank.
> The basic tracks were recorded in the Snakepit of Hitsville on eight-track, as previously described. The producer and/or arranger and engineer used only six of the available tracks for the following:
track 1 - empty
track 2 - tambourine
track 3 - guitar
track 4 - drums (accents)
track 5 - empty
track 7 - drums
track 8 - bass
> This basic session was bumped up to 16-track, dubbed over to tracks 9-16. Vocals were overdubbed in the Snakepit across five of the tracks, with the lead taking track 4 on the new 16-track tape. Backgrounds are on track 1 and 5, and 2 and 3. The latter are marked as 'use for mono.' Because I was only really listening intently to the backing track, I am not sure if that means the other two BV channels were alternate harmony vocals used for the stereo mix. Track 6 is empty.
> Horns were overdubbed in Studio B - Golden World - recorded on tracks track 7 and 8.
I learn stuff like this all the time. It's always refreshing and surprising. There's new information flowing through all the time. It helps to have access and I am only happy to pass on the information for those who want to have it. Here, and the community at boards.motown.com, are great places to share our collective experience.
By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 04:17 pm: |
HW:
And we thank you for sharing this with us.
Kevin Goins - KevGo
By Steve LItos (209.100.86.4) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 05:01 pm: |
Thanks for the info Harry! Having access to the Motown vaults is actually pretty incredible.
-Steve
By Larry (216.23.183.2) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 05:07 pm: |
HW,
Were the 2 guitars bounced to Track 3? You only list 1 gtr track. Also, how are the Motown Masters holding up? Have they been copied or transferred to digital or other medium to keep their quality intact?
By HW (68.37.216.164) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 06:28 pm: |
stupid me - even after proofing I mixed up tracks 5 and 6, then left one out entirely.
the original rhtyhm tracking date was recorded thusly:
track 1 - empty
track 2 - tambourine
track 3 - guitar
track 4 - drums (accents)
track 5 - guitar
track 6 - empty
track 7 - drums
track 8 - bass
thanks for catching that.
By HW (68.37.216.164) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 08:17 pm: |
Other pertinent info I also retrieved:
It's A Shame
Written by Stevie Wonder, Lee Garrett and Syreeta Wright
Produced by Stevie Wonder
Arranged by Paul Riser
Basic track recorded in Studio A, January 27 & 28, 1970
Vocals dubbed in April 6, 1970; horns overdubbed in Studio B, April 29, 1970
The finished version was issued as Spinners single V.I.P. 25057, June 11, 1970
#4 R&B, #14 Pop (U.S. Billboard)
By Larry (12.141.160.25) on Tuesday, April 15, 2003 - 02:14 am: |
Thanks Harry. Great info.
GC recorded those fine vocals 33 years ago last week.
Jamerson puts on another clinic with his track. If his playing doesn't make you smile from joy or squint from bewilderment, I don't know what will.