By dvdmike (12.84.141.142) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 08:02 pm:

Some George Jackson's hit songs:

BACK IN YOUR ARMS - Clarence Carter
DOUBLE LOVIN' - Spencer Wiggins
DOWN HOME BLUES - Z.Z. Hill
I'D RATHER BE AN OLD MAN'S SWEETHEART - Candi Staton
IT'S TOO FUNKY IN HERE - James Brown
MAN AND A HALF - Wilson Pickett
OLD TIME ROCK AND ROLL - Bob Seger
ONE BAD APPLE - The Osmonds
SLIPPED, TRIPPED (FOOLED AROUND AND FELL IN LOVE) - Clarence Carter
SNATCHIN' IT BACK - Clarence Carter
TOO HURT TO CRY - Candi Staton
TOO WEAK TO FIGHT - Clarence Carter
VICTIM OF A FOOLISH HEART - Bettye Swann

By Garry J Cape (80.1.14.210) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 06:31 am:

Can't quite figure where this thread came from ??

Someone wrote earlier about Homer Banks RIP being the greatest Southern songwriter - so where does that put George Jackson, Sam Dees, Phillip Mitchell, Tommy Tate...........

Thanks for giving me opportunity to plug the recent George Jackson "In Muscle Shoals' CD - www.grapevine-soul.com......20 1978/79 Muscle Shoals Sound Studio recordings....check it out.

Don't quite know what this has got to do with Detroit, tho'......

By dvdmike (65.208.234.61) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 06:59 am:

If you've been reading the past threads, you'll notice that that although this forum originated from Detroit, the discussions about music are not limited to Detroit.

By JSmith (212.39.231.20) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 07:03 am:

Don't (Find Em, Fool Em &) Forget (em).....or he will Sing One For Aretha.....that's George's own recordings I'm refering to.

By TonyRussi (68.210.2.125) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 08:06 am:

Well, check out two of the best George Jackson compositions "I Found What I Wanted" and "I See A Future In You" by MARY WELLS produced in Muscle Shoals by Rick Hall & Sonny Limbo and released on Reprise 70/71.

By Scratcher (65.132.79.159) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 10:10 am:

Gary no disrespect to George Jackson but I simply like Homer Banks songs better. I excluded Sam Dees and Philip Mitchell because though excellent writers they strayed and became more mainstream. Homer never did, he stayed true to his southern soul roots and would have never wrote a song that sounded like "One In a Million You" as Dees did.

His stint as a staff writer at Stax when Don Davis produced some songs he co-wrote were as mainstream as Homer Banks got, and he wasn't in control then.

If you like southern soul music it's a safe bet you'll like anything you come across at a flea market, goodwill or somebody's attic that has the name Homer Banks in the songwriting credits.

By Sly fan (67.115.74.237) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 02:41 pm:

Homer Banks (May His Soul Rest) and George Jackson go hand in hand..They stayed true to the roots and kept it raw.

George Jackson was in a documentary called "Blues In The Delta"..

Still Call It The Blues..Johnnie Taylor

and he did a lot of Candi Staton's early material on FAME records (the titles escape me right now), really great songs my mom use to wear out.

By TonyRussi (68.210.2.125) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 03:47 pm:

Candi Statons' Fame recordings were by far her best,in my opinion

By Scratcher (65.132.78.126) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 04:45 pm:

I never cared for anything Candi Staton made after her Fame Recordings. I loved "I'm Just a Prisoner (Of Your Good Loving)" and the others. But later stuff like "Young Hearts Run Free" did nothing for me.

By Sly fan (67.119.52.31) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 05:52 pm:

Tony I agree..Candi is criminally underated and is to me the last of the "great era" in female soul singers just as some would say Al Green is the last for male soul singers (which I totally agree!!)...Although, I did like "Victim" and "Young Hearts", she always sung with conviction. I always tune in to hear her sing on a Christian based network and she STILL has it.

By stephanie (64.63.221.59) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 06:09 pm:

Scratcher
I agree Miss Staton was better in her earlier years. To me Young Hearts Run Free was a shadow of her true talent although it was her biggest hit.
Stephanie

By JSmith (212.39.231.20) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 08:57 am:

RE: Candi Statons' Fame recordings were by far her best,in my opinion .........
the Fame catalogue master tapes have been locked away in the vaults for years.
Rick Hall was more than content to just sit on them. But under pressure fronm his son Rodney & numerous enquiries from re-issue labels / fans......the doors to the vaults have been slightly sprung recently.
No actual Candi St tracks have escaped but some less commercially successful artist cuts have. If these do well (& make some money for Fame), then we can expect more 'escapees' in the future.

By TonyRussi (68.210.2.125) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 12:21 pm:

Thanks JSmith,I just don't get why Rick Hall would be "sitting" on this stuff.I want the recordings Mary Wells made there in 1970...only the 1 45 was released (and not promoted by Reprise).The Candi Staton stuff would sell on CD because its pretty well known.

By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 02:00 pm:

JSmith:
Thanks for the update regarding Candi's FAME recordings. I remember hearing the 45s years ago and wondered why these tunes didn't make the light of day on CD also.

I'm looking forward to hearing her rendition of "Stand By Your Man" and Elvis covers she did.

Kevin Goins - KevGo

By Reese (12.15.169.254) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 02:15 pm:

Some of Candi Staton's FAME recordings are being released on CD this week. I've never heard of the label(Future Groove, or something like that), and the artwork seems cheap (a black and white photo of Candi from her WB years). But I'll accept anything that will replace my scratchy vinyl.

Speaking of Candi, she re-recorded a lot of her FAME hits a few years back. I think the results were only released in Europe, but a few made their way here. I bought the album and while I love Candi, I hate remakes. No matter how well an artist sings, they can never quite recapture the original version.

By Davie Gordon (193.122.21.42) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 04:59 pm:

Tony,

Mary's Reprise tracks are owned / controlled by
whoever currently owns Warner-Elektra-Atlantic.

Rick Hall doesn't own the tracks - he doesn't own
evetything recorded at Fame just those artists
signed to the Fame label (and even that much is
probably arguable)

By Sly fan (67.115.74.6) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 05:16 pm:

Its about time that they put out those FAME releases..I am fortunate to have a lot of Candi's 45's on that label along with Jimmy Hughes and others..Fame was when Candi was at her best but the Warner Bros. material held its own.

By Paul Mooney (62.254.64.5) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 06:17 pm:

Hello everyone,

Interesting stuff, but I think it's unfair to say Sam Dees "strayed" just because he wrote some big hits! Thankfully, his songs come in many moods and styles - colours and shades - otherwise things would get a bit stale sometimes.

And even George Jackson "strayed" too. For example, "One Bad Apple" makes him a lot of money - which he deserves. Like all of us, he has to eat.

Finally, Candi Staton cut MANY nice things after the Fame period. One particular favourite of mine is her version of Al Green's "Livin' For You", produced by Dave Crawford.

Best regards,

Paul Mooney
South Union

By Sly fan (67.115.74.6) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 06:59 pm:

WOW!! are you THE Paul Mooney?? If so I a honored sir...I love all of your work!!

Damn, I didnt know George wrote "One Bad Apple"...

Amazing...

By Sly fan (67.115.74.6) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 07:01 pm:

WOW!! are you THE Paul Mooney?? If so I am honored sir...I love all of your work!!

Damn, I didnt know George wrote "One Bad Apple"...

Amazing...

By Paul Mooney (62.254.64.5) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 07:22 pm:

Hello Sly fan,

Are you getting me mixed up with somebody else???

Paul Mooney,
Not The Famous Comedian But Still Funny Sometimes

By Sly fan (67.115.74.6) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 07:32 pm:

LOL, I heard that!! Thanx!

By Scratcher (65.132.78.26) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 08:00 pm:

Paul, nobody is saying Sam Dees and Prince Phillip Mitchell are bad people for straying from their roots. But the facts are, they did stray. So, how is it unfair to state what they actually did?

What I stated on another thread that prompted the post here was that Homer Banks was the greatest southern soul songwriter ever. If you're talking "around songwriter" I would put Sam Dees ahead of him. The facts are, Homer Banks was writing aching soul tunes in the '90s just like he did in the '60s. I didn't think his style of writing got boring at all because he was the cream of the crop.

George Jackson only strayed that one time with "One Bad Apple" and knowing what I know about songs and how some writers obtain them, I wouldn't be suprised if that one came in the back door.

By Paul Mooney (62.254.64.5) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 08:26 pm:

Hello Scratcher,

There's no argument here, I rate the songs of Homer Banks very highly - and yes, he was always consistant. I just can't see any point in debating who is better than who - Hayes & Porter, Penn & Oldham, George Jackson, Sam Dees, Phillip Mitchell, Homer Banks... they have all written dozens of incredible songs.

As for "One Bad Apple", George really did write this song. He actually wrote it with the Jackson 5 in mind but Motown turned it down and it was then offered to The Osmonds when they went to Fame.

Regards,
Paul Mooney

By Scratcher (65.132.78.26) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 08:40 pm:

Hi Paul,

So he (George Jackson) says. I know the history of the song and how Motown supposedly rejected it. But I've learned long ago not to assume a person wrote a song simply because it's credited to them. Many hot producers buy songs, always have, always will. Did George ever "write" any other songs in that vein?

I'm just a big Homer Banks fan. I also loved Sam Dees' "Send for Me" and "Am I Dreaming." I must admit a lot of his earlier stuff I've only heard in bits and pieces as most of the songs he wrote for others in the '60s and early '70s didn't get aired much outside the southern states. Nor did much of Homer's, but he often did albums on artists and I would purchased them at discount prices at those resale record exchange stores.

BTW, Prince Philip Mitchell is the best singer of all those you mentioned.

By Paul Mooney (62.254.64.5) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 09:20 pm:

Hi Scratcher,

Yes, George Jackson has written many songs in styles other than southern soul and country. Many of these songs never came out but Garry Cape came across a lot of them when he was selecting material for "George Jackson in Muscle Shoals" (and the next Grapevine album) and I have already been working on some of them.

George is capable of writing very pop-flavoured songs; many were specifically 'tailored' for whoever they were going to be pitched to: Candi Staton (country-flavoured soul), The Staple Singers (funky gospel-soul), Z.Z. Hill (bluesy soul) or whoever. In fact I think "One Bad Apple" was quite typical of his style, lyrically and melodically.

When we first heard the song "Weekend" we immediately saw its potential as a hit pop song if somebody famous ever covers it. And that may well happen.

As for Homer Banks, I'm glad you admire his immense talent and I hope one day many others will recognise what a genius he was. I love all his songs but always had a special thing for "It's Gotta Be This Way". The man was extremely underrated and will be sorely missed.

Regards,
Paul Mooney