By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 11:50 am:| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 11:50 am: |
Esteemed Forum Colleagues,
Several months ago, I posted a "Farewell to ERRGGH", as I felt that the popularity of that thread was interfering with the main thrust of the forum. I have come to realize that I made a dreadful miscalculation, and I wish to apologize to the forum for my role in prematurely truncating this truly valuable service. I began to have guilt pangs during a recent trip to Europe, where I heard both Feelings and Having My Baby (TWICE!) played as background music in restaurants. However, the true severity of the situation hit home when I saw a recent TV commercial for a Cher "Farewell Tour" special. It occured to me that without ERRGGH, we were essentially defenseless in the face of what is sure to be a horriffic onslaught, and that innocents might tune in, unaware of the dreckage (thanks again, John Dixon) that awaits them. Thus, I suggest, that as a national service, we resume the difficult and challenging task at hand.
For those who are unfamiliar with ERRGGH (or who had the good sense to stay away the first time around), the thread was originally started by R&B, and was quickly embraced, primarily by incarcerated and underemployed members of the forum. The ostensible goal was to identify tunes and artists that fell into one of the following categories:
a. The terrible.
b. The horrible.
c. Neil Diamond.
The point here is not simply to list tunes and artists that you don't like. The point is to identify tunes and artists that pose a clear and present danger, that transcend all time and genres in their terribleness, that require a courtesy flush after airplay, that could best be described by the phrase "if you don't stop it, you'll go deaf".
I sincerely apologize for my transgression, and hope that it is not too late to do what must be done.
Steve S
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 12:05 pm: |
Beautiful, SteveS.
May I propose a theme song?
"To Much Time On My Hands"--Styx
| By LTLFTC (12.210.76.205) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 01:00 pm: |
And let this semi-underemployed forum inmate kickstart the festivities with a little ditty we March Madness fans will be wretching to later -
"One Shining Moment"
Written by a Michigan homie too ; David Barritt - sorry , Dave
SteveK
| By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 01:47 pm: |
Steve,
I just look forward to your intros. Thanks for the laugh of the day.
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 01:54 pm: |
I don't want to give away any state secrets, Geralso Rivera style, but I was watching a report on Special Ops in Iraq, and I would have sworn that amidst the din of artillery fire I could hear strains of The Macarena coming from specially outfitted tanks, obviously intended to drive the enemy into submission. Oh, the humanity!
| By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 02:27 pm: |
The trouble is, the troops would have to be wearing special chemical suits while playing the "Macarena," we don't want any more friendly fire accidents ...
But as long as it isn't against the laws of war ...
p.s. I heard that Bruce Willis offered to enlist but was gently told he was too old. Where is Michael Bolton in his country's time of need? They could pipe "If a Man Loves a Woman" down into Saddam's bunker.
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 02:43 pm: |
Perhaps we should reconsider that decision, Sue. If Bruce brought his harmonica along and Don Johnson could get the band back together to sing "Heartbeat" one more time, is there any foe who could survive?
| By stephanie (64.63.221.54) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 03:13 pm: |
Ring My Bell - Anita Ward...YUCK!!!!
Stephanie
| By Sue (205.188.209.38) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 06:44 pm: |
Ah, I forgot ..."The Return of Bruno" his album was called, I believe. Hey, wasn't it on Motown? Oh my gosh...
| By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 06:52 pm: |
To think, Bruce's version of "Respect Yourself" was a top ten hit as well as Don Johnson's "Heartbeat."
I thank the Dear Lord Above that I didn't have to play either record during my salad days as a radio DJ. To think of the opposite...hearing the sounds of Don & Bruce during my radio show as I broadcast from a dark room with nothing but a microphone, tape machines and razor blades on the editing board...Perish the thought!
Kevin Goins - KevGo
| By john dixon (152.163.188.68) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 07:19 pm: |
Humorist Lewis Black said something very funny on Comedy Central's "The Daily Show" last week; reviewing Celine Dion's 100 million dollar Vegas extravaganza, he called it "the second worst thing going on in a desert right now".
Lewis done got his errggh goin' on!
| By john dixon (152.163.188.68) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 07:21 pm: |
SteveS, you rock, buddy!
LMAO
| By Sue (64.12.97.7) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 07:37 pm: |
John,
The "second worst thing going on in the desert" ..ooo that's good.
I accidentally punched onto one of Detroit's "soccer mom" radio stations, and I was bracing myself for a good dose of Neil Diamond, some Dion or Carey style caterwauling, a dose of schlocky Bolton ...but I was shocked, they played some Motown then some new song I liked.
Is there nowhere for the taste-impaired to go now to hear these crimes against music?
| By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 08:09 pm: |
I'm with you Stephanie, please don't "Ring My Bell" any more. I would scream.
But SteveS - Don't start again on "Feelings." Walter Jackson sang his heart out on that song. :o) I played his cut over and over and over, and still love it.
| By Sue (64.12.97.7) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 08:15 pm: |
Oh hey, Walter somehow took a schlocky song and wrung some soul out of it ...
| By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 08:26 pm: |
Hahahahahahah ROFL
| By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 08:27 pm: |
That was a good one Sue. (LOL)
| By john dixon (152.163.188.68) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 08:30 pm: |
Sue, surely that was a computer scheduling glitch! A programming aberration to be cherished. Somebody probably got their butt reamed out. I think corporate programming gets it right on a 'lunar' rotation.
Actually, even Clear Channel Oldies can occassionaly get it right for your personal time spent listening, making it all the more frustrating when its back to the usual uninspired mix, overplay the 'power' rotation songs to the sad neglect of many secondary and all tertiary hits which now sound more vital than ever because they aren't worn slap out, like Sugar Pie Honey Honey Bunch and Baby Love, just to name a couple of beloved but overplayed Motown classics. It has nothing to do with the artistry and excellence involved in those records. Some are sturdy and and weather the hammmering of power rotation quite well, but there's a few that could regain some freshness with a time out in the song hamper.
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 08:32 pm: |
John Dixon, Sue, Douglasm & SteveK,
Nice to know you folks are still out there. Gee, it's like getting the old band back together! Come on - Havin My Baby in G - 1,2,3 4.
Actually, Sue raises a good point about schlocker mom radio stations. I'm beginning to think that those stations perform a public service by reminding us of just how bad music can be. Without them, another Harry Chapin could come along out of the brown and foist himself on an unsuspecting public. Those who ignore the lessons of history would be doomed to listen.
I noticed that someone trashed "Float On" on another thread. Truly a worthy object of scorn and ridicule (and reminiscent of another more scatalogical definition of "floater"), yet I believe we made short work of it on errgggs previous. On the other hand, someone else mentioned "ring my bell", which we somehow overlooked, wich reinforces the point that there's work to be done. We must remain vigilant!
SteveS
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 10:11 pm: |
You know, in a way syndicated radio has doomed a lot of these allegeded songs. I don't mean to take these tunes seriously, but we savaged "This Diamond Ring", but that's all you hear. But when was the last time you heard "Green Grass"? I'm sick of "You Don't Own Me", but would almost kill to hear "Sunshine, Lollipops and Rainbows". And except for the annual appearence of Bob River's "Twisted Christmas" (I look forward each year to "I Am Santa Clause"), there's very little "funny" stuff out there. No "Ballad Of Irving" or "The Last Blast Of The Blasted Bugler", no "Ringo". Show me a corporate radio station that played the "Beatles" knockoff of "Stairway To Heaven".
Phew.
Let me leave you with this thought....
"Blue, Navy Blue
I'm as blue as I can be
'cuz my sailor boy went ship-a-hoy
and joined the Na-a-vee.
Diane Renee
| By Sue (205.188.209.38) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 10:24 pm: |
Diane Renee -- ah, a golden name in pop.
What I loved about a record like "Navy Blue," schlocky though it might be, is that it sounds human and handmade, like some bratty high school girl forced her way into a dumpy recording studio and cut a record on the fly.
Today's schlock is tricked up with million dollar effects, recorded in pristine digital splendor, so the quirky human factor is totally lost.
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 10:27 pm: |
As a public service, I'd like to reprint the follwing excerpt from the old errggh thread, in anticipation of tomorrow night's televised Cher Farewell special. If you must watch, I recommend that you take precautionary measures and wrap either the TV, or yourself, in duct tape:
"I think it should be said that when you're talking about the likes of Having My Baby or anything by Cher, just turning off your radio may not be sufficient protection against the incipient horriblitude of it all. It is a scientific factoid that tiny particles (tunons) can seep out of the knob, even in the off position, and infect humans in the vicinity of the radio. The effects of prolonged human exposure to low doses to tunon radiation are, as yet, unknown. I suspect that the record companies and the government have done their best to suppress this information. Be careful out there!"
| By Jim G (205.188.209.38) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 10:29 pm: |
Jeez, I remember "Blue Navy" too...and I liked it, kind of like "Icicles, Popsicles", which I really grooved to. Who was it sang that song?
| By Sue (205.188.209.38) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 10:32 pm: |
HEY it's "Popsicles, Icicles" Jim ...is that a Commie plot, to switch the lyrics of songs?
The Murmaids did "Popsicles, Icicles" ...I received it as a child as a prize at some Christmas fete. It was a good pop song although they sort of sounded like the McGuire Sisters to me ...
| By Sue (205.188.209.38) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 10:33 pm: |
p.s. I don't think SteveS agrees, but I think you can have a grudging fondness for some of this stuff. To me, the amateurish, early '60s (or earlier) ones are acceptable kitsch ...
| By Sue (205.188.209.38) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 10:39 pm: |
they just don't write 'em like this any more:
"...Popsicles, icicles, baseball and fancy clothes
These are a few of the things he loves
He loves Levis and brown eyes
And wind blowin' through his hair
These are a part of the boy I love ..."
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 10:49 pm: |
Nah, Sue, I liked Blue Navy and just about everything else back then. You can't knock a tune for being "of it's time". For example, Frankie Valli sounds pretty silly today, but like the Edsel, Richard Nixon and Durwood Kirby, he made sense at the time. Consequently, he's not true errggh material (IMHO). However, that "grudging fondness" you mention suggests a different category, truly terrible stuff that you like...what an athlete might call his "personal worst".
| By Sue (205.188.209.38) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 11:07 pm: |
Yes! I've been wanting everybody to own up to the dreckage they like ...
| By Mark Speck (65.56.217.227) on Monday, April 07, 2003 - 11:47 pm: |
We have David Gates to thank for "Popsicles & Icicles"...he wrote that several years before hitting it big with Bread.
Speaking of the Macarena, has anyone seen that annoying TV commercial for Michelina's frozen entrees that uses the Macarena melody for the jingle?
I tell you, if I were in the gym and some annoying woman was dancing and singing and bothering me and everyone else, there would be no guarantee that she might get ACCIDENTALLY clocked with a hand weight! ;)
Best,
Mark
| By Jim G (205.188.209.38) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 08:56 am: |
Sue, I'd like to state for the record that I am not now, nor have I ever been, a member of the Columnist Party.
| By john dixon (205.188.209.38) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 09:58 am: |
Unless you come from a coastal region in the southern climes you may not have this guy's music in your face every spring and summer but I'm telling you, down here people will give you the skunk eye and act as if you're mentally deficient if you don't just love Jimmy Buffet. I don't find his patented brand of flip-flop rock terrible, certainly not full-out errggh: just glib and inconsequential. I feel clueless when I read or hear about the Parrot-head army. Buffet's tours are still among the most profitable of all artists from the boomer era. I just have never understood this man's massive appeal.
| By Sue (64.12.97.7) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 10:03 am: |
David Gates wrote "Popsicles, Icicles"??? Good grief, talk about a conspiracy theory ...
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 10:06 am: |
SteveS makes a good point. Although I may have said this before, a lot of the stuff that was savaged in the earlier Errggh would be a welcome releif to the stuff that's played on oldies radio now, if only for the novelty of it.
"There, I've Said It Again"--Bobby Vinton
Sue...
....did you ever see Diane Renee? It's been a l-o-n-g time, but my memory says she looked about like you described. Short, blond (?), stacked, incredably high heals, syncing her record wearing a navy style outfit that looked like it came from the Shirley Temple collection. Was she Detroit based?
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 10:26 am: |
I'll answer my own question. She's from Philly, and Bob Crewe wrote and produced "Navy Blue". She's still out there. Try this...
www.dianerenay.com
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 10:41 am: |
Bob Crewe - isn't he the guy that singlehandedly took Mitch Ryder's career down the toilet, with a brief stop in Las Vegas? And then there was the very disturbing "Music to Watch Girls By" (Percy Faith-type orchestration that somehow got tossed into the top 40 bin by accident), an errggworthy instrumental if ever there was one. Glad you mentioned him Douglas.
| By larry (12.141.160.25) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 11:43 am: |
SteveS,
Equally disturbing is the Tijuana Brass' version (almost by rote) of the Bob Crewe 'classic'. What a sephardic disappointment that was. It changed me forever.
I could no longer use the moniker:
The Genius of Herb Alpert.
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 01:00 pm: |
Larry,
That whole Tijuana Brass episode is a hard one to explain. As I recall it, they were happening for about 4 minutes in the mid-Tang era (approx post-JFK, pre-LSD). They would be of little consequence except that their success made Alpert and Moss a couple of very powerful back room music industry guys, able to spew their demonstrably bad taste on the public for many years beyond the life span of the TB (remember Rise?). Perhaps Alpert's greatest contribution to western civilization was the development of the sexy album on a shitty album concept, later embraced and refined by the Ohio Players.
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 01:11 pm: |
...and his worst was Julius Wickner (sp?!) and the Baja Marimba Band....followed closely by The Sandpipers.
| By 65 memories (198.109.0.231) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 01:26 pm: |
Reminds me of Sergio Mendez and Brazil '66 (or '77 or '82 or whatever they call themselves these days.) But I had their initial album...and played it and played it and played it.
But one song I got tired of before I heard it through the first time was Mike Douglas' "The Man In My Little Girl's Life" (sung by the talk show host, not Kirk's son, the actor).
| By 1Wicked (24.126.64.120) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 01:29 pm: |
Douglasm...that's Julius Wechter...and you guys are so cruel. Is there no love for "Baby Elephant Walk" and (not knowing the real title) "The Dating Game Theme" " (LOL...LOL)
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 01:44 pm: |
'65...
....Mike Douglas was at one time a big band singer, wasn't he? Merv Griffin falls into the same catagory.
I hate to bring her up, but what was the name of the Mrs. Miller LP that knocked off "Whipped Cream and Other Delights"?
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 02:40 pm: |
1Wicked - Cruel? Why yes, we're cold as ice, willing to sacrifice...
Douglas - Mrs. Miller was a goof - intentionally crappy - and as such, not errggworthy (IMHO). However, at about the same time she was warbling away, Georgie Girl (by the Seekers?) was an absolutely inescapable blight on the land. I believe the were only a one-hit wonder, yet they left a stain on pop music that just won't go away.
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 02:51 pm: |
There's A New World Somewhere They Call The Promised Land....
Actually, they had a couple. "There Will Never Be Another You" made it into the top 10 in, I believe '64.
How bout The New Seekers, who seemed to specialise in Melene Safka (sp) songs like "Look What They've Done To My Song".
I was listening to an internet oldies station that was doing pretty good (Reflections/Johnny Taylor/Wilson Pickett) until it popped up with
"Dizzy"--Tommy Roe
| By Larry (216.23.183.2) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 02:54 pm: |
Now Why did you have to go and rag on Georgie Girl. "Swingin down the street so fancy free."
what's next? To Sir With Love? I Know A Place? Downtown?
SteveS, you're treading at the gates of sacred ground.
| By john dixon (63.101.17.207) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 03:45 pm: |
go ahead and knock Herb Alpert and the Tijuana Brass all you want but I have fond memories of considerable pre-pubescent hours spent gazing at the "Whipped Cream And Other Delights" album cover.
Plus, their version of Burt Bacharach's "Casino Royale" theme is one of my favorite late 60's instrumentals.
What say you folks regarding Jimmy Buffet?
| By LTLFTC (12.210.76.205) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 04:08 pm: |
John
I concur on the 'just don't get it' assessment of Buffett. Unlike a lot of people in that category, it's not that he's talentless....maybe he represents something that I can't put my finger on- some kind of bland yuppiesque escapism or something that kind of repulses me. Even with people I kind of like - Springsteen live comes to mind - the way their audience laps up every little thing they do, that kind of empty-headed adoration brings out the curmudgeon in me ; Like 'wait a minute; this ain't THAT great'. In cases like those it's almost like I hold the audience AGAINST the artiste .
SteveK
| By Davie Gordon (193.122.21.42) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 04:38 pm: |
Dear Ghod ! I never expected to see the Baja
Marimba Band mentioned on this hallowed forum but
since they have been - if you ever see their
albums while you're out hunting for the Spellbinders album pay attention to their covers
- there's always one band member with his back to
the camera apparently taking a leak. Just buy the album then throw the record away.
A&M - subtly subvervise (or something)
Lay off knocking Bob Crewe - OK he ruined a
perfectly good band when he got Mitch Ryder to go solo - but - they didn't have a career before he
signed them up and don't forget that Crewe produced "Jenny Take A Ride", "Devil With The
Blue Dress On" and on and on and on ..
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 04:43 pm: |
Larry - No argument on Petula and LuLu, they were definitely happening at the time, but Georgie Girl was a bit late to the party (a remnant of the Great Folk Music Scare of the 1960's) yet got overplayed something fierce.
Douglas - nice drive-by on Dizzy. Tommy Roe was sort of an unsung (I wish) dreckmeister - a poor man's Tommy James, if such a thing is possible. Didn't he also do Sweet Pea? I don't think I wanna know what the B side was.
John - I'm baffled by Buffet too. He's like the underachiever's underachiever, who actually managed to rake it in in spite of himself. I only know about him from people who are fans, and as far as I can tell it's not really about music, it's sorta a vicarious stoner nostalgia trip he's peddling. Errggwise, Margaritaville ain't the worst thing I've ever heard (did he ever do anything else?), and it pales in comparison to the nefarious droppings of Rupert Holmes, who not only cut the Pina Colada song, but wrote some stuff for Babs Streisand.
| By john dixon (63.101.17.207) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 04:58 pm: |
since we're owning up to dreckage we like, I admit that I love Tommy Roe's "Everybody" and "Sheila", the latter of which was a good Buddy Holly knockoff. In fact, I was at the age (too young for 50's stuff firsthand) that I heard "Sheila" before I ever heard Buddy, much the same way that I heard Johnny Rivers' versions of Chuck Berry before I ever heard Chuck himself.
Davie, I got a good chuckle when you reminded me of the Baja Marimba Band LP covers, always one Pedro had his back to the camera taking a leak. I wonder if that's where the Who got the idea for their "Who's Next cover? heh heh
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 05:41 pm: |
John,
I too heard Tommy Roe's "Sheila" before I heard Buddy Holly, so I too had no idea it was a tribute/ripoff as a kid. And I was undoubtedly the right age and sex, that his "Sweet Pea" didn't strike me as dreckage until at least 10 or 11 plays.
What say all of you Tijuana Brass-bashers to Sergio Mendes? I admit I had that first Brasil 66 album too, I still have it, and I played it to death.
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 05:51 pm: |
Fellow errrgonauts,
If we are going to continue this scholarly journey through the depths of pop music, I would like to suggest that we define some language that is specifically designed to allow us to communicate complex ERRGGH concepts more succinctly, and in a manner that takes full advantage of electronic communication possibilities on the web. As a start, perhaps the use of acronyms might help us save time that would be better spent on research. Here are a few that might come in handy:
ALINC - At least it's not Cher.
HCIC - Holy crap, it's Cher.
CFP - Courtesy flush, please!
TNWSTTP - The notes wouldn't stick to the tape.
HMB - Havin My Baby
SOBB - Standing Over the Bowl Barfing
SPON - Stinking Pile o'Notes
PANDHC - Paul Anka, Neil Diamond, Harry Chapin
OTDS - Off the dreckometer scale (see previous entry)
KMNP - Kill Me Now, Please
TRWBUS - The radio waves broke under the strain
PTMIHT - Please Tell Me I Hallucinated That
IKBILI - I know, but I like it!
JHIMMS - Just hearing it made me stupider
Thus, a typical exchange might go like this:
ERRGG1: I just flipped to a radio station that played PANDHC back to back. I think TRWBUS. JHIMMS.
ERRGG2: Oh, that's terrible. Did they even play that SPON HMB?
ERRGG1: Yes. I called the request line and asked for a CFP. They wouldn't, so now I'm SOBB.
ERRGG2: That's a lot to handle - really OTDS.
ERRGG1: The only saving grace is ALINC.
ERRGG2: Uh, listen, whatever you do, don't turn on the TV.
ERRGG1: HCIC!!! KMNP.
| By john dixon (64.12.97.7) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 07:23 pm: |
SteveS, you continue to crack me up, but I hope your acronym layout was in jest because it's much too difficult to actually commit to memory!
Sue, I love "Mas Que Nada" by S.M. & Brasil '66. I freaked when I saw the first Austin Powers movie and they used it prominently during the Las Vegas sequence.
| By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 07:29 pm: |
John,
Wasn't it cool when you heard that song in Austin Powers?
For some reason, although I believe Sergio and the gang were on A&M thanks to Herb Alpert, for me they didn't veer into schlock as the Tijuana Brass happily did. Bossa nova was a good blend with pop ...and how many groups can cover the Beatles? "Fool on the Hill" was good. Although I didn't like Lani Hall when they spun her off as a solo.
| By Aljaydu/Creole (68.18.115.216) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 07:44 pm: |
SteveS, I don't know who you are but you've got LMAO !!!!!
You wouldn't happen to do any comedy writing, do you? It not, consider a career change LMAO !!!!
That's a compliment, ok?
| By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 07:55 pm: |
p.s. I could be wrong about the Brasil 66 label -- I have the vinyl somewhere in my garage, and must run out and get it ...
| By larry (12.141.160.25) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 10:07 pm: |
Sue,
Bet you don't have the Japanese import in Mono! 
| By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Tuesday, April 08, 2003 - 10:12 pm: |
Larry --
So it is A&M! Wow ...where on earth did you get a Japanese copy?? And in fabulous mono?
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 12:22 am: |
Actually, there is a Soulful Detroit connection to Brazil 66; they did a tune called The Real Thing that was written by Stevie Wonder. Not one of their best, or his, but life goes on. However, this leads to the errrgggh connection ... when bad songs happen to great artists. Of course Stevie is as good as it gets, but "I Just Called to Say I Love You"??? If you told me that Paul Anka or Bobby Goldsboro wrote that POS, it would make perfect sense. But Stevie? Say it ain't so! What was he thinking? Every time I hear it I have to ask AHAAF*?
(Anybody Have Any Air Freshener?).
| By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 09:30 am: |
Paul McCartney ...whom I otherwise defend -- "Silly Love Songs," and a twofer, "Ebony and Ivory" with Stevie.
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 09:58 am: |
Sue - What was the precise chronology of "Ebony and Ivory", "I Just Called To Say I Love You" and "The Girl is Mine" (McCartney and Michael Jackson)? These are three tunes best described by the acronym GTIDSII (Good Thing I Didn't Step In It). However, there is a pattern there that suggests a musically communicable disease, transmitted by lame duet singing, with perhaps McCartney being the carrier. Who knows how many others were infected at the recording sessions for "We Are The World" and all those other superstar extravaganzas. This could be even worse than SARS, cause you'd have to wear a face mask and ear muffs too.
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 10:39 am: |
SteveS brings up a question I'm afraid to ask.
What's the worst popular (emphisis) Motown song? He nominates a couple, i'll throw in "The Happening", which, except for the key change, tends to make me cringe.
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 11:07 am: |
Douglas,
I think you have touched on one of Motown's rarely discussed production secrets - the superfluous key change. There are definitely cases where it works really well - Ain't No Mountain, My Girl and For Once In My Life come to mind. However, there are several instances where it appears that there wasn't time to finish writing the tune, or in some cases (e.g. I Just Called to Say I Love You, The Happening) the tune was so bad the notes just wouldn't stick to the page. In such instances, it seems that they would go into the studio and just start randomly changing keys. I'm not sure if they wrote this out or just told the funk bros to watch the clock on the wall and move up a half step every time the big hand came around. You can hear this quite clearly on Cellarful of Motown, where there are a couple of tunes that start out OK and then run out of steam, yet there's an obvious (but unsuccessful) attempt to rescussitate with modulation therapy.
With tunes like The Happening, you have to wonder if there was some wise guy at the legendary QC meetings who answered Berry Gordy's famous dollar / sandwich question with "I'll pay TEN dollars AND buy you a sandwich if you'll turn this POS off!".
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 11:19 am: |
That makes me wonder as well, was BG as hard on material featuring Diana and the Supremes? Was a second-rate Supremes song like "The Happening" given more of a push than say, a first-class Spinners song?
| By larry (12.141.160.25) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 11:31 am: |
Modulation Therapy? "...the funk bros told to watch the clock on the wall and move up a half step every time the big hand came around"!!!????
LMAO! You're killing me SteveS.
Sue,
I confess, I got the .jpg of Brasil '66 from Amazon.com. But, I am old enough to remember the group and confuse them as the group that did
"Up, up and Away" (in my beautiful, my beautiful buhroom)
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 11:48 am: |
Larry -- Oh nooooo. I admit to an infantile attraction to the Fifth Dimension, OK, and I'll defend it. It was good pop, which doesn't really exist now...but Brasil 66 were way cooler, more sophisticated.
| By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 01:27 pm: |
Hey Folks:
Could it be the reason why "The Happening" was an okay record because Frank DeVol (who wrote far too many cheesy TV sitcom themes for my taste) had a hand in composing the tune with H-D-H? Everytime I hear the song I think of 1960s TV sitcoms.
As for Brasil '66, their stuff definitely was more sophisticated than most of A&M releases at that time (for the possible exception of Wes Montgomery's output on A&M/CTI). I still play my Australian pressing of the "Herb Alpert Presents...." from time to time as well as their "Greatest Hits" CD.
Kevin Goins - KevGo
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 01:44 pm: |
Sir,
Frank DeVol is none other than Happy Kyne, of Happy Kyne and the Mirth Makers, perhaps the greatest band to ever grace the airwaves (featuring the incomparable Tommy Tedesco on guitar), and I believe he is also the composer of the I Love Lucy theme song. But it will take some 'splainin for me to understand how we got to the part where The Happening is an OK record, cause dollar or not, that tune spoils my lunch.
| By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 01:51 pm: |
Steve:
When I said "The Happening" was an "okay" record it was merely an understatement. I place it in the same category as Smokey & the Miracles' "Come Spy With Me" - a tune that was more "campy Hollywood music" than classic Motown music.
Kevin Goins - KevGo
| By STUBASS (205.188.209.38) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 02:05 pm: |
HERB ALPERT...WAS IN MY OPINION A BUSINESSMAN FIRST...AND MUSICIAN SECOND!!!...HE HAD A KEEN EYE ON THE RECORD BUYING PUBLIC...AND THUS...CAPITALIZED ON THE TIJUANA BRASS CONCEPT!!!...HIS TRUE GENIUS CAME LATER WITH THE SUCCESS OF A&M RECORDS...AND IS A HIGHLY RESPECTED PLAYER IN THE MUSIC INDUSTRY!!!STU
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 02:13 pm: |
Michael Bolton is extremely successful, n'est-ce pas?
| By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 02:21 pm: |
Stu:
Also keep in mind that the "M" in A&M - Jerry Moss - had a big hand in the label's success (he was the one who helped bring A&M into the rock music era in the late 1960s) as did the late Julius Whechter (sp?), who was responsible to some degree for the Mexican marimba sound that permiated both the TJB and Baja Marimba recordings.
Kevin Goins - KevGo
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 02:27 pm: |
The Tijuana Brass' output just hasn't aged well, musically ...frame the album covers and toss the vinyl or risk terminal cutesy Mexican horn fever ...
| By STUBASS (205.188.209.38) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 02:28 pm: |
VERY TRUE KEV!!!...I DIDN'T MEAN ANY SLIGHT TO JERRY MOSS...BUT I WAS COMMENTING ON HERB ALPERTS MUSICAL ABILITY VERSUS HIS BUSINESS ACCUMEN!!!...THANKS FOR REMINDING US ABOUT MR. MOSS'S CONTRIBUTIONS!!!STU
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 02:45 pm: |
Sue,
I really like the way you tossed in that little bit of Spanish when they were talking about the Tijuana Brass. Just goes to show - you've really got to be quick on this thread!
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 02:53 pm: |
(previous message incomplete)
Sue,
I really like the way you tossed in that little bit of Spanish when they were talking about the Tijuana Brass. Just goes to show - you've really got to be quick on this thread! ALINC. KMNP!
| By Larry in tears (216.23.183.2) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 03:01 pm: |
Sue, you kill me. Terminal cutesy? ROFL.
| By Larry (216.23.183.2) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 03:03 pm: |
Totally off topic:
Anyone ever compare a Nutrageous with a Snickers?
Stu! Start a versus thread!!!!
| By STUBASS (152.163.188.68) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 03:06 pm: |
NO THREAD HERE LARRY!!!...SNICKERS HAS IT ALL OVER NUTRAGEOUS...IT'S A FACT...NOTHING TO DEBATE !!!...STU
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 03:08 pm: |
Steve,
I WISH I knew any Spanish beyond Oye Como Va, but that was French I was dispensing, my only foreign language ...So when the French invade, I'm there for you to translate.
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 03:18 pm: |
Boy Sue, is my face red! French...imagine that. But actually, it's not the French invasion I'm worried about, it's the Canadians. I'm concerned this whole Iraq thing may just be a diversionary tactic, and Canada has teamed up with Mexico to surprise us with a classic pincer maneuver from the north and south (with aircraft instead of tanks, I believe the tactic is called the "Flying Scissors"). They're probably getting the invasion force together as we speak.
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 03:21 pm: |
HELP!! I hadn't thought about "Popsicles, Icicles" in years until Sue brought it up. Don't have it, or the music. Picked up the guitar and WAAM, there it was. G,Bm,F,C. Is there a cure for this resessive memory problem skimmering around my cerebelum? Or do we want one.
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 03:32 pm: |
Douglas,
Yet again, you've identified a serious problem - stray chord changes. If I could just jettison stuff like C Dm F C Dm (Till the end of the Day) or A D G C G (Hey Little Girl by the Syndicate of Sound) I might be able to free up enough brain cells to find my car in a parking lot without a search party. Unfortunately, the only solution I can come up with is electroschlock therapy (massive doses of PANDHC*), and that's just too frightening to contemplate.
*see previous post regarding acronyms
| By Vickie (64.236.243.31) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 03:44 pm: |
OMG LOL!!
I am having a stressful day here are Warner..
I put aol radio on to help and the first song was "Having My Baby"
I got a great laugh out of that here today
LOL hahahahahahahah
Vickie
| By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 03:53 pm: |
Vickie:
To think, Richard Parsons wants to sell the music division...
I think he's better off selling whoever the hell was playing Paul Anka
Kevin Goins - KevGo
| By Vickie (64.236.243.31) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 04:03 pm: |
Kevin,
I had to laugh...cuz the only people that mention that song in my life have been you all..
The next song that came on was "I Will Survive" which was more appropriate for the day I am having
Vickie
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 04:58 pm: |
Wait a minute ... "Leaping Larry Chene"????
Did Lord Layton have anything to do with him?
| By STUBASS (152.163.188.68) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 05:01 pm: |
FLASH: I UNDERSTAND THAT PAUL ANKA HAS READ THIS THREAD...AS IS QUITE DISTRESSED...AND IN FACT WAS SEEN CRYING...ALL THE WAY TO THE BANK!!!...STU
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 05:06 pm: |
The dumbest line in "Having My Baby" -- dare I say it?
"...what a lovely way of saying
What you're thinking of me."
I mean, there are a lot of ways of expressing how someone feels about a guy -- a call, a letter, an email ... a pat on the back. Wow, what an ego ...
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 05:33 pm: |
Sue,
I'm having some difficulty processing the concept of "the dumbest line in HMB". Regardless of the degree to which I subdivide the tune, each individual sub-unit is equally stupid. This scale-invariant lameness raises the possibility of a heretofore unreported mathematical phenomenon, "fractal stupidity". I will investigate further and report any progress to the forum. KMNP*.
*official errggh acronym
| By john dixon (64.12.97.7) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 06:56 pm: |
okay, so this group isn't godawful, but I'm sick of the Mamas and the Papas and the amount of airplay they still get on oldies radio. Their creaky whitebread harmonies are woefully antiquated; they don't rock and they have no soul. I lunge for the radio button to switch it to anything else, even conservative talk radio(God help me), rather than endure the entirety of "California Dreamin'", "Monday Monday", "(Up Shit)Creeque Alley", etc. again.
Even though John Stewart (w/ Lou Adler) organized the Monterey Pop Festival, there was no act more past their end date performing there than the M's & P's. And you can toss in that song "San Francisco" that Stewart wrote for his buddy Scott McKenzie too. I wish I could permanently filter out any future spins of their hits, at least when I'm listening.
Hey, I still say H.A.& the T.B.'s hit, "Casino Royale" is a great tune but it's really more Bacharach than Herb Alpert, wouldn't you say? Maybe it's just personal; it reminds me of backyard summer cook-outs, puberty kicking in, moon landings, and so much carefree stuff...
| By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 07:01 pm: |
I wanted to see Cher's special. I missed it. :o)
| By Sue (64.12.97.7) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 07:15 pm: |
Oh John D -- you've invoked the Bacharach principal ...virtually anyone can cut a Bacharach song and come out of it unscathed, and his songs defy all categorization. Arthur Lee and Love did a great psychedelic soul version of "Little Red Book." Someone pointed out that Diana Krall's version of "The Look of Love" is almost note for note the same arrangement as Sergio Mendes', and she gets away with it. It's the best song on that particular album of hers, because it's a Bacharach ...
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 07:29 pm: |
Sis - You can't be serious! I saw about 9 seconds worth (through the cracks in the duct tape) and realized that Sonny had taken the easy way out. Consider yourself lucky, cause JHIMMS*.
* Official errggh acronym
| By Sue (64.12.97.7) on Wednesday, April 09, 2003 - 07:35 pm: |
In the seconds before I dove for the remote, I saw the opening bit in which Cher was in some elevator thing high above the stage as people screamed. I assumed they eventually lowered it.She was wearing some feathered headdress and it struck me ...what made this cutting edge in '74 was her near-nudity and perfect body.
Who listened to her voice, back then? Now, there are less distractions.
| By 1wicked (24.126.64.120) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 01:50 am: |
SteveS...thanks for mentioning "The Real Thing". I liked that one...but never owned it.
WRT Alpert & Moss...the best thing (or one of) was to give Lou Adler a deal (Ode Records)...cause he gave us David T. Walker and Cheech & Chong !!
| By john dixon (63.101.17.207) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 05:52 am: |
Sue, I'm glad you brought up the Bacharach principal. Two great examples of errggh-worthy artists elevated above their usual dreckish output by cutting Bacharach material are Jack Jones ("Wives And Lovers") and Trini Lopez ("Made In Paris").
Regarding "My Little Red Book", being the classy, gracious guy that he is, Burt rarely made disparaging remarks above any versions of his songs, but he never liked Love's version of that song. Personally, I loved it but thought Arthur Lee sounded more like Sean Bonniwell of Music Machine ("Talk Talk") than the Arthur Lee/Love of "Forever Changes". Manfred Mann did a great version of "..Book"; I always felt Paul Jones was one of the most soulful, underated singers from the UK during the 60's.
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 07:26 am: |
John, you've really touched on some subtle points here. I'm amazed at the mention of Sean Bonniwell - I always think of him as the unsung, overlooked father of heavy metal, based solely on "Talk Talk", a tune that was way ahead of it's time. Sad to say, though, I bought the album back then, and clearly Sean had taken his best shot with the single, cause the album was weapons grade dreck (and this in the days before air freshener was commercially available, so you had to listen with incense burning, which left you susceptible to a random raga-rock attack).
Jack Jones is a case study in errggh geneaology. His father was Alan Jones, the guy that was in a bunch of Marx Brothers movies who would be in the parallel (and unfunny) love story that would inevitably result in a couple of totally sappy songs that nearly ruined the movies. Usually, Chico would follow at the piano to gamely try and salvage the day, but the Jones bloodline demonstrates that there are definitely warm spots in the genetic pool.
You raised an interesting issue regarding the Mamas and Papas. I've also wondered how they got so popular, or how they even got signed as a rock group, and the best guess I can come up with is that Phillips was everybody's favorite dope dealer back when. Nevertheless, I feel that their output, although lame and insipid, is not (with the exception of Creque Alley) totally horrifying, it's just mislabled easy listening music. The real sin of the M&P is that they spawned imitators like Spanky and our Gang, which is unforgivable.
| By Davie Gordon (193.122.21.42) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 08:50 am: |
If we're gonna talk about A&M it should never be forgotten that they were the first label to sign
Captain Beefheart and The Magic Band.
| By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 09:35 am: |
Question: What did the Dead Head say when the drugs ran out?
Answer: Hey, they really aren't that good are they.
| By john dixon (205.188.209.38) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 09:39 am: |
I'm surprized that no one has tried to include Captain Beefheart on an errggh thread thus far. I love the Captain, although I must confess that I enjoyed his closer to mainstream work, like "Clear Spot", more than his more celebrated avant-guard output, such as "Trout Mask Replica". But the funny thing about Beefheart was that, in college, even "Clear Spot" would clear a room so quickly you would have thought that everyone simultaneously cut one. It got to be a joke, like, "watch this"--needle hits groove and just time the mass exodus sure to follow!
"Mister Zoot Horn Rollo, hit that long lunar note and let it float..."
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 01:27 pm: |
Congradulations...
.....we've gotten this far without mentioning either Ed Sanders or Wild Man Fisher. I'm impressed.
As to Spanky and Our Gang, I'm here to defend their honor. Although their singles output ("Sunday Will Never Be The Same" for example) was generally bland and incipid, I'm inclined to give them points for things like "Leopard Skin Phones", and the only version of "Trouble In River City" i've ever heard a "rockish" band perform. Saw them once live early in their career, and they were very enjoyable.
This, in turn brings up the question--the must incipid single by an otherwise good group. The nominations are open.
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 01:36 pm: |
Spanky had a pretty strong voice, and would there have been Ann Wilson, without Spanky?
Uh-oh, a double inverted ERGGGH!
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 01:38 pm: |
Douglas,
To paraphrase Groucho - go ahead and defend Spanky's honor, it's more than she ever did. And I'm sorry but "I'd Like to Get to Know You" was an ice cream headache on vinyl.
Difficult to talk about Ed Sanders without mentioning the unmentionable incident / hoax that can't be mentioned in such upstanding company as the forum. Difficult to talk about Wild Man Fischer under any circumstances. Must we?
Most insipid single by otherwise good group (aka When Bad Songs Happen to Good Artists) - I must refer to the point I raised in a previous post: "I Just Called to Say I Love You" - not only bad, but inexplicable, coming from the great Stevie Wonder.
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 01:44 pm: |
...wait a minute, I'm not through trashing "I Just Called to Say I Love You". I haven't had to hear it in a long time, but as far as random key changes go, it's "Modulations Gone Wild". And isn't there a cha cha cha ending that would embarass even the cheesiest of wedding bands? How did this happen?
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 01:49 pm: |
Oh man, did you have to remind me of that organ cha-cha-cha coda? Now it's going to be in my head all afternoon, displacing Spanky's voice ...and "Crazy On You" (WHAT DID THAT MEAN??)
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 01:50 pm: |
p.s. I need a "What Would Groucho Say" wristband ...
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 01:55 pm: |
... if he was talking to Ann Wilson singing "Crazy on You" I'm pretty sure he'd say "I never forget a song but in your case I'll make an exception".
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 02:01 pm: |
Before I open my mouth and have someone else put their foot in it, let me state for the record that generally, I like Johnny Rivers.
Having said that, why did he do a versions of "Slow Dancing" and "Drift Away"? The later was a decent song as done by Dobie Gray, but the former?
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 02:06 pm: |
Oh that kid on American Idol, the one sacked because he didn't tell them he was arrested for assaulting his sister -- he tried to do "Drift Away" a few weeks ago, on their "country" show. On what planet is "Drift Away" a country song??
And it's one of those tunes that is almost impossible to cover.
It strikes me, one artist who deserves a place in the ERRRGGH hall of shame for his solo output: Mick Jagger. Talk about some painful solo stuff, ouch! I couldn't GIVE "She's the Boss" away to a church rummage sale, they were hip to it ...
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 02:18 pm: |
Sue...
....same planet that has "Act Naturally" as a rock song.
Speaking of Heart, Ann and Nancy are going on tour, and will have a PBS concert in support of their "live" lp. Can and A&E Live By Request appearance be far behind? Seems to be the current way to plug a new CD. Have to admit I liked the Lovemongers "Papa Was A Rolling Stone".
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 02:25 pm: |
Heart should have totally morphed into the Lovemongers, then they'd be safe from ERRGGH ...
It's the law of Led Zeppelin -- no group has successfully been directly influenced by Zep and been any good (and I liked LZ at the time)...
| By Davie Gordon (193.122.21.42) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 02:27 pm: |
The Singing Nun - I'll say no more
| By john dixon (205.188.209.38) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 02:34 pm: |
Rolling Stone gave Mick Jagger's last solo flop 5 freakin' stars!? Being Jann Wenner's pal pays off apparently (except in sales).
On an earlier post I referred to Mama's & Papa's leader/songwriter as John STEWART when I meant John PHILLIPS. I didn't mean to disparage the writer of "Daydream Believer". Don't know how I got mixed up like that since I read Phillips' bio not too long ago (and got a contact high from the narrative).
But, go ahead, let the stoning begin, we're supposed to be 'fessing up to dreckage we like, right? Well, I loved Spanky & O.G.'s "I'd Like To Get To Know You". I used to think that psychedelic middle bit sounded great on my AM transistor radio.
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 02:51 pm: |
Hey I like Spanky & Our Gang's "Sunday Will Never Be the Same," I'm sorry. Leave room for me on the island of shame ...
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 02:58 pm: |
Hey that's a new thread direction -- bad (and good)psychedelic interludes ...
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 03:50 pm: |
The mention of a planned Heart PBS special reminds me of one of the most amazing performances I ever saw. It was also a PBS special - one of those pathetically crass attempts to extract shekels from boomer wallets. The featured group was the Moody Blues, performing live at some natural ampitheatre (perhaps Red Rocks, I walked in on this and didn't get the full incident report). The problems were as follows:
a. The years had not been kind to the fellas. They looked like a bunch of linebackers gone to seed.
b. The were all wearing the Seinfeld "Puffy Shirt".
c. They added choreography to the act by walking, in unison, forward (toward the audience) and then backward (away from the audience), creating the unintended effect of a wave of guitar-holding blubber advancing and then receeding to and from the audience.
d. Additional choreography was provided through creative use of strumming. All of them strummed their guitars in unison (while advancing and receding per c). Unfortunately, this included the bass player, who was strumming his bass like a buzzsaw, and to much the same sonic effect.
e. If you can handle the picture of this large, puffy-shirted, strumming, advancing and receding mass of middle age filling the TV screen to the breaking point, then prepare yourself for the big number (I shall not speak its name) where it all stops and the poet solemnly intones the whole "breathe deep" shtick.
f. Since there wasn't a whole lot of vocal harmony in their tunes, they sang everything in unison, making them sound like the Highwaymen or something.
g. Without the shroud of 60's hippie mysticsim, their songs were clearly utter dreck.
My wife walked in and found me on the floor laughing so hard I was crying, trying to point to the TV set. It took me weeks to recover.
| By john dixon (63.101.17.207) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 04:49 pm: |
great psychedelic interludes--"Shapes Of Things" and "Happenings Ten Years Time Ago" by the Yardbirds
bad psychedelic interlude--"Susan" by the Buckinghams
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 05:00 pm: |
Psychotic Reaction - KMNP*
*Official errggh acronym
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 05:35 pm: |
Has anyone ever assessed the impact of the Yardbirds on nugget style rock? The sitiar (sp) like sound in "Over Under Sideways Down", for example, seemed to show up almost everywhere (right down to "Band Of Gold"), with the Electric Prunes "I Had Too Much To Dream" being a shining (?) example.
The obligitory harmonica break seemed to be a feature of this style of rock, also. Who do we blame? Dylan?
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 05:52 pm: |
Definitely Dylan, Doug ..
Oh, John ...you named a couple of my favorite Yardbirds jams. Any idea what exactly this Yardbirds that's now touring consists of? I admit I've gotten press emails from their rep but I'm afraid to read 'em.
Re the sitar: I know we went over this on another thread, but it annoyed me that the guy on the most recent PBS soul special blew Dennis Coffey's sitar line ...close, but no cigar. Dennis was playing rhythm guitar ...
And oh yes, the psychedelic interlude on "Susan" ...guys in crewcuts should never attempt psychedelic interludes ...
| By john dixon (205.188.209.38) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 06:32 pm: |
Sue, the Yardbirds reunion is one official Yardbird less (Paul Samwell-Smith) than the guys that put out the "Box Of Frogs" Lp around '83
(Chris Dreja and Jim McCarthy); so, although I haven't heard any of it, I'm bettin' that it's nothing to crow..err.. caw about.
| By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 07:10 pm: |
I have a Buckinghams collection on Sundazed that was released years ago. According to the group members who were interviewed for the liner notes, when they recorded "Susan" their producer James William Guercio (who later brought us the band Chicago) instructed them to leave a short window open in the song. When they asked why he said not to worry. WELL... when they received the acetate the band wasn't too thrilled with it (and neither was radio or Columbia Records, who released to broadcasters an edited version of the song which - thank God - I played when I was DJ'ing at Adult Contemporary radio in the 1980s).
Kevin Goins - KevGo
| By Sue (205.188.209.38) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 09:44 pm: |
Was there still a truncated psychedelic interlude in the edited version though? Because I remember hearing psychedelia in all the versions I heard on AM radio in Detroit ...
| By Sue (205.188.209.38) on Thursday, April 10, 2003 - 10:59 pm: |
John,
No wonder I was too bored to even open the Yardbirds' flack's email ...I want to retain my childish enthusiasm for "Over Under Sideways Down" ...and that tres cool rave-up in "Blow-Up"...
| By StingBeeLee (68.43.129.202) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 12:26 am: |
Honey Radio, which was on in Detroit during the late seventies, eighties and up to mid nineties, would play the worst early sixties pop dreak imaginable. They would play Neil Sedaka, Frankie Avalon, Paul and Paula, Diane Renay and others until the sun set. Day after day. I believe the record companies and their evil scientists were creating these people in their secret labs and then give them their marching orders to destroy the rock and roll music from the fifties. Before Honey radio, I never heard this brain cell destroying music played on the radio. You would have to wait patiently for your Motown, Chuck Berry or Little Richard song to come along. I kinda liked pop music from the mid sixties on. I never really liked anyones whole output, but I would pick and choose the songs I liked.
| By R&B (138.238.41.128) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 08:29 am: |
THIS THREAD HAS GOT MORE LIVES THAN FELIX THE CAT,HEHEHEHEHEHEHEHE!!!
| By Sue (64.12.97.7) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 09:03 am: |
Stingbee,
Evil scientists -- ha ...
Although here's an IKBILI* (official ERRGGGh acronym for IKnowButILikeIt) ...Neil Sedaka. Good Brill Building songwriter, corny in retrospect but really was "of" his time in that respect.
I'll defend his "Breaking Up Is Hard To Do" anytime; nobody'd sung about that before, great lyric and melody, everybody's been there ...
| By R&B (138.238.41.128) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 09:50 am: |
HEY SUE,SPEAKING OF NEIL SEDAKA,HIS CLASSIC[CALENDER GIRL]IS ONE OF MY ALL TIME FAVORITES.
| By john dixon (64.12.97.7) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 10:00 am: |
Sue, I have a hard time getting past the "down doobie doo down down comma comma.." bit but I applaud your willingness to 'fess up.
from the bubblegum genre I've got a couple of IKBILI's--"Quick Joey Small" by Kasenetz-Katz Orchestra and "Gimme Gimme Good Lovin'" by Crazy Elephant. Good dumb fun, if you ax me.
Here's one I've not seen on an errggh thread yet but I've never liked it--"Signs" by Five Man Electrical Band. "And the sign said long haired freaky people will be shot on sight"--for openers, please feel free to fire away at the band! I did some work for a Clear Channel Classic Rock station(with the total exclusion of the Ramones and only token airplay for Talking Heads, Elvis Costello, Clash, and even Bowie in favor of errggh perrenials from Styx,Journey, and Pink Floyd, this format has mutated into Mullet Rock) a couple of years ago and even though they played just one David Bowie song ("Fame")and wouldn't even play "Rebel Rebel", "Suffragette City", or "Jean Genie", which should be standard and required, they DID play a freakin' COVER of "Signs" by Tesla. This is a perfect example of the kind of programming you get on a classic rock station when you hire a PD who's not even old enough to have experienced the format's era firsthand simply because he'll work cheaper.
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 10:08 am: |
OMG John, how could we have missed Signs? Whenever I heard that, I was actually embarassed for the band that recorded it. Per the Fungi Eats Vinyl thread that showed up this morning, that's one where the poor fungii bastards never even had a chance.
| By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 10:29 am: |
Many years ago I was at the Lightgaurd Armory to see a show. Neil Sedaka was the headliner but the opening act was Ronnie Hawkins and the Hawks years before they would become The Band. They were great. Then Neil did his act which I must admit I don't remember one bit of. When he finished he was escorted across an empty floor surrounded by about 6 cops.I thought it looked so odd to see this group crossing the floor like that with no one nearby. In later years I would come to realize that Neil is really a very talented guy. I agree with Sue about " Breaking Up " and have heard him do this song in a slow bluesy style also which was great. Sedaka is a very fine classically trained pianist that ha written some pretty damn good pop songs.
| By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 10:32 am: |
Sue:
The edited version of "Susan" I played on the radio had this "crash"-type sound that was the last note of the psychedelic interlude. So it did have a remnant (which to some is better than hearing the whole darn segment).
Kevin Goins - KevGo
| By StingBeeLee (155.139.68.10) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 10:44 am: |
Neil Sedaka was a good songwriter, and you had to be, to compete with the other Brill Building popsters. I liked his '70's version of "Breaking Up is Hard to do" as I guess life had taught him a few lessons. His 60's version is way too cheerful. I liked Spanky and Our Gang, the Fifth Dimension, Petula Clark, Sergio Mendes and Brazil 66. Who I don't like: Sade, Freddie Jackson, Maze. All three of their voices grates my ears. Sade actually thought she was the second coming of Billie Holiday. There are other artists that I will acknowledge as great, but I don't care for, and the above mentioned Holiday comes to mind. She is one of the greatest artists of the 20th century. Frank Sinatra, Sarah Vaughn, Tony Bennett, and other greats studied her closely. But I heard Billie sing "On the Sunny Side of the Street" and she made it sound like the sunny side was the depressing side. Bob Dylan was one I never understood. He sang at the Grammys? a couple of years ago, and I could hardly understand him, he sounded like a drunk incoherant fool and yet the papers were raving about his performance the next morning.
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 10:50 am: |
Stingbee,
I saw that Dylan performance, I was laughing myself silly over that. He can be either really good or totally incomprehensible live, I don't know if it was a beer issue or what.
But you're right, the critics don't really call him out when they should.
John, it's exactly "down do bee do down down" that's um, cool. Maybe because I first heard it with infant ears, I don't know...
| By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 11:03 am: |
StingBee:
I saw Bob Dylan on the Grammy awards a couple of years back performing some pretty dark tune that looked so damned spooky it would give Dracula the fits.
As for Sergio/Petula/5th D, what were your favorite records by these artists. I do have many of Sergio's A&M LPs (including his last, "Primal Roots" - which was more World-beat driven than his bossa nova pop works) and all the Fifth Dimension's albums).
Kevin Goins - KevGo
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 11:19 am: |
John D. - You made my day with your post on the "Can't We All Get Along?" thread. You should consider a career as a diplomat. You must be biting your tongue over "I Love My Music". Nah - it's too easy.
| By Lynn Bruce (65.60.202.214) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 11:23 am: |
My wife received two tickets to see Neil Sadaka at Pine Knob outside of Detroit about 15 years ago.I said give them away.She won and we went.
I couldn't have been more wrong about him. The man was really "cookin".He had the whole place going.Neil Sadaka can play and sing his ass off.His young daughter(at the time)came out and also blew me away!She sang as if she just came from the Aretha Franklin school of singing.
I've often wondered if she kept up with it as a haven't heard of her since.
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 11:26 am: |
Neil Sedaka IKBILI* - Laughter in the Rain. I always though the song had a tremendous hook. I thought Earl Klugh did a decent instrumental job on it too.
* Official errggh acronym
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 11:31 am: |
The previous discussion of Bob Dylan deomsntrates the need for a new Official Errggh Acronym that applies to certain artists who are universally acclaimed as having made an invaluable contribution to music:
IKBIDLI - I Know, But I Don't Like It
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 11:42 am: |
Captain Beefheart -- IKBIDLI
Grateful Dead -- IKBIDLI
Ornette Coleman -- IKBIDLI
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 11:44 am: |
Handy, isn't it Sue?
| By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 11:52 am: |
I'm starting to think that years from now some sort of Rosetta Stone will have to be found to decipher this forum.
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 04:23 pm: |
In re Niel Sedaka...
...the nice things about "Breaking Up Is Hard To Do" are not only did it hit for the same artist twice--and what, 12 or 13 years apart?--but in two variations. It works as a late '50's/early '60's piece of pop, and as the lounge type song it was re-recorded as.
Question--is "down do be do down down, comma comma" really any worse--or better--than "she-bop she-bop my baby ooh she-bop she-bop my baby..."
| By LTLFTC (12.210.76.205) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 05:35 pm: |
Speaking of nonsense syllables , kind of , does anyone remember Sly's "Loose Booty" (not the Funkadelic one) ? I'm admitting my religious ignorance here but I had no idea , when he sang "Shadrach Meshach Abednago (sp?) that he was referring to biblical characters. I thought it was just "Sly-talk". I'm still not sure who they are , though.
SteveK
| By john dixon (152.163.188.68) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 07:43 pm: |
I'm with StingBeeLee re: "Breaking Up.."; it was just too cheerful, like the guy was skipping blithely toward heartbreak. I liked the bluesier remake.
doug, how silly background vocal syllables are really depends on the song they are in service to. The background syllables sung on "Hello Stranger" are in service to one of the sexiest songs ever recorded. The backgrounds on The Flamingo's "I Only Have Eyes...", one of the most haunting songs of the pop era. As for Comma Comma Down Do Be Do Down Down, see my first paragraph.
Sue, your not liking Captain Beefheart is no surprize; I have never, ever known a female that liked the Captain. In fact, as I stated in an earlier thread, in college I learned firsthand that his records were an industrial strength chick repellent. I was rather surprized when I started reading Mojo to learn how revered he is in the UK.
In the IKBIDLI category for me, besides the Grateful Dead, is (pardon the blasphemy) Bob Dylan. I've always felt that it was a failure on my part somehow to not quite "get it" when came to Mr. Zimmerman. I dutifully bought "Blonde On Blonde" and several other Bob LPs and tried my best but he never clicked with me.
Everyone has been so polite on this thread so far; there's been no good natured scorn or derision hurled at anyone for their IKBILI's.
Feel free at this point to condescend toward me because I'm about to 'fess up to a big'un: I like Lou Christie. Yep, "Two Faces Have I", "Lightnin' Strikes", and "I'm Gonna Make You Mine"; I bought each of those 45's growing up. Only one of his songs gives me a headache...Rhapsody in the RAAY-HANE! I'm being masochistically honest here, so BRING IT ON!
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Friday, April 11, 2003 - 09:32 pm: |
A couple of catch up notes....
LTLFTC..Sly did better than Harry Nillson, who wandered towards it when he couldn't pronounce Pandemonium Shadow Show correctly on his first LP.
SteveS.....
The Kinks song sounds better G Am C G Am. Made it all the way through--including the C D F E change at the end (C on the word from "Morning...").
John....
Your point is well taken. I accept your explination, but I DO like "Rapsody in the Rain". "The Gypsy Cried" is another story all together.
I am going to admit to liking The Doors. I don't hear them often enough to have them wear out on me, and songs like "Riders On The Storm" bring a great deal of pleasure to me.
Let the stoning begin.
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 09:02 am: |
I'm afraid I have to bring something up that's gonna get me trashed by the folks on the Ray Parker thread. No, this isn't about the Ghostbusters ripoff, which I never understood cause he took a great tune (I Wanna New Drug) and managed to simultaneously rip it off note for note, yet turn it into a total POS. It's about the importance of background vocals in pop music. Have you ever heard his tune Jack and Jill? The basic tune is just mediocre and trite, but otherwise forgettable. However the backup singers have this shrill one note part that they use as a reply to every line in the tune, and it's mixed very prominently, as somebody thought it was good (they NEEDED a new drug, if they thought that). So the tune went something like this (backup parts in ALL CAPS):
Jack.....JAACK
Went up to the hill....HILL
Then he met a girl named Jill....JILL
Do you have a cyanide pill etc. etc.
When I first heard it and started to get the drift, after every line, in the few milliseconds before the response I'd think to myself "please tell me this is a joke" (and afterwards I said PTMIHT*).
Just as a number of folks do a background vocals only version of Midnight Train to Georgia as a tribute to how great R&B backups could be, the Jack and Jill backup would make a great bit for a standup.
* Official Errggh Acronym
| By LTLFTC (12.210.76.205) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 09:10 am: |
Steve S;
Your post reminded me of my wife's comment upon hearing that tune many years ago. When they sing the line 'why do you think Jack ran down the hill' (or whatever), she said 'probably to get away from this shitty song'.
Steve K
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 10:28 am: |
Steve K,
Alternate theory: She went off looking for "some sort of Rosetta Stone" to decipher the upside of Jack's head with.
SteveS
| By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 10:35 am: |
Steve,
I knew that stone would come in handy for something.
| By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 10:38 am: |
John,
Well now I can rest easy knowing that my dislike of Captain Beefheart is out of my control, no doubt caused by some secret messages embedded in his lyrics meant to attract males and repel females.
But I can't go after you on Lou Christie ...while there were bizarre moments listening to his falsetto, and those lyrics! "Nature's taken over my one-track mind" ...something about it rang true, and the hook's compelling.
Now the Doors ...ay. Doesn't age well, for me. Pompous hippie poetizing, not as bad as the Moody Blues' "Breathe deep ..." which I was impressed with the first time I heard it -- ding -- but Morrison deserves errrgggh fame for inspiring so much bad poetry, bad acid trips, men wearing leather pants who really shouldn't, blah blah ...
JHIMMS* ...
(Just Hearing It Made Me Stupider).
Hey Steve, don't make me keep referring to the original code to de-code your anagrams ..
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 10:39 am: |
Yeah Ralph, I saw it lying there and realized it was your way of asking "How hot was it?". I couldn't let it go to waste.
| By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 10:41 am: |
"Jack and Jill" might get me started on the '80s, which for me had more dreck songs than any decade previous ...
Although we're by no means done with earlier times.
"Rhapsody in the Rain" -- that makes you question EVER liking Lou Christie.
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 10:54 am: |
Aw gee. I can't be the only tasteless gorp out there.
Actually I kinda grudgingly admire singers of the Lou Christie/Del Shannon school, who esentially took one song and re-recorded it a number of times with great sucuess. "Hats Off To Larry", "Follow The Sun (Keep Searching ?)", "Runaway", and "Stranger In Town" I swear were recorded at one time, in one long continous loop.
And the drek just keeps on coming....Gary Puckett ("Woman Woman") just showed up on my radio, key change and all.
| By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 10:54 am: |
One name mentioned in Steve's treatise at the top, Neil Diamond, has long intrigued me as someone who can't be totally written off as schlock because of his early stuff and his Brill Building songwriting abilities.
I admit to liking "Cherry, Cherry" even "Thank the Lord for the Nighttime" (was that the name of the song??), "Sweet Caroline," -- he wrote "I'm a Believer" and indeed, if we took away the sideburns and vocals, most of us would agree the guy can write songs --"Red, Red Wine," "Cracklin' Rosie" -- jeez is there a wine and a red theme goin' on here?
OK have at me, but not before I confess that yes, I was a Monkees fan. Front row, Olympia Stadium, and I thought Mickey Dolenz' James Brown routine was fabulous (ducking now) ...
| By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 10:56 am: |
Oh Doug,
I LOVE Del Shannon ... come on now, don't be putting Del Shannon on an ERRRGGH thread ...
The Rolling Stones keep rerecording the same few songs after all. The only question should be, is it a GOOD song?
| By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 11:02 am: |
Monkees -- no takers? Too easy?
"Last Train to Clarksville" -- good. "Daydream Believer" -- brilliant, but how could you lose with that song? I even liked "Valerie" ...
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 11:10 am: |
Sue....
....I like Del too, but listen to those four songs back to back.
I will defend your honor when it comes to the Monkees and Neil Diamond. I don't know if the credit should go to the band, Screen Gems, Neil Bogart (am I right here?) or who, but The Monkees cranked out some really good formula rock. And Diamond's early output was excellent until he began to take himself seriously.
| By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 11:22 am: |
Well ERRGGGH scientists should pinpoint the exact moment when Diamond started to go south ...was it the cloying "Girl, You'll Be A Woman Soon"? The self-conscious, "I Am, I Said"?
Was it sideburn poisoning?
| By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 11:29 am: |
Sue,
I think it happened when he thought the lines...Songs she sang to me...Songs she BRANG to me....were acceptable.
| By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 11:32 am: |
Ralph --ooh ooh! That's right ...what a cheesy way to rhyme something ...
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 11:39 am: |
OK, I've mummified myself with duct tape, cause what I'm about to do here isn't for the squeamish. We were discussing Tommy Roe / Sweet Pea, and it took a while but that started a dreck avalanche that is truly horrifying:
Sheila (blatant Buddy Holly / Bo Diddley ripoff)
Sweet Pea
Dizzy
Jam Up and Jelly Tight
Hooray for Hazel
Wait, it gets worse:
KMNP
| By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 11:44 am: |
Scary -- the photos were apparently so vile that the server wouldn't post them ...
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 12:02 pm: |
OK, I've mummified myself with duct tape, cause what I'm about to do here isn't for the squeamish. We were discussing Tommy Roe / Sweet Pea, and it took a while but that started a dreck avalanche that is truly horrifying:
Sheila (blatant Buddy Holly / Bo Diddley ripoff)
Sweet Pea
Dizzy
Jam Up and Jelly Tight
Hooray for Hazel
Wait, it gets worse:
KMNP
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 12:17 pm: |
AAAAAaaaaarrrrruuuuugggghhhhhhhhhh.........
| By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 12:25 pm: |
Wow Tommy went from a crewcut and mohair suit to a hippie schlockmeister ...
AAAAAAaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrrrgh is right!
| By LTLFTC (12.210.76.205) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 12:26 pm: |
That second picture was taken as Tommy listened to the "Jam Up.." playback under the influence of psylosibin. "Oh the humanity... What have I unleashed upon an unsuspecting world?"
Actually , he looks like Malcolm McDowell in "CLockwork Orange" when he's being 'cured' of his anti-social behavior.
SteveK
| By john dixon (205.188.209.38) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 12:35 pm: |
That Tommy Roe cover looks like an LP but the same pic was used for the "Everybody" 45 picture sleeve which I bought many years ago. I won't stop defending that song; it rocks, not reeks!
I love Del Shannon, the Monkees, and early Neil Diamond. Some other cool early Neil: "The Boat That I Row", "You Got To Me", "Kentucky Woman", "Solitary Man". It all started going horribly wrong for me around the time of "Sweet Caroline", not a heinous song in itself but an accurate portent of errggh to come.
I was once a huge fan of both the Moody Blues("red is grey and yellow, white, but we decide which is right") AND the Doors("Mute Nostril Agony!") but that crap is so cheesy now. I'll admit there's a few tunes by each that are salvagable today, like "The Story In Your Eyes" and "Roadhouse Blues", to name a couple, but they're surrounded by so much dreck that it's hardly worth the effort.
| By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 12:44 pm: |
psylosibin -- whassat??
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 12:49 pm: |
Sorry guys, those scans really weren't a fair shot, although I did try and use the terror alert color code. However, I believe a new acronym is called for:
SUWI - Stunk Up the Whole Internet
As far as making fine distinctions between good and bad Neil Diamond, and trying to pinpoint the microsecond when he crossed over to the dark side, I've got to side with John - if it takes that much dreckscavation to find a decent tune, haven't things already spun way out of control?
| By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 12:49 pm: |
OK, just to creep everybody out and send you off on Saturday errands with the same pain I'm feeling ...how about Anne Murray! There's a huge billboard of her in downtown Detroit because she'd performing at Casino Windsor, so these horrific things keep percolating through my mind:
"...even though we ain't got money, I'm so in love with you honey, Everything bring a chain of love..."
Everything bring a chain of love??? We can thank schlock king Kenny Loggins for that little slice of country croonin' heaven ...
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 12:58 pm: |
This is gonna hurt, but Kenny Loggins: IKBILI
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 01:35 pm: |
What's the backround of Kenny Loggins. I know Jim Messina came out of Buffalo Springfield through Poco--a band I enjoy kinda like The Ozark Mountain Daredevils--but Kenny's backround dowsn't come to mind.
And speaking of bad songs by generally good singers--female division--I nominate "You're So Vain" by Carly Simon.
| By Sue (64.12.97.7) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 03:41 pm: |
I could take Loggins & Messina and I'll even admit Loggins wrote some songs that are among my favorites -- notably "What a Fool Believes" -- love the Michael McDonald/Doobies version, don't like Kenny's. So I think it's his voice I most object to, and the moist, sensitive bearded guy image ...
One word Steve: "Footloose" ...
| By Sue (64.12.97.7) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 03:43 pm: |
Doug,
You bring up an interesting case -- Carly Simon. I'm not so sure her '70s babe looks didn't cause many to overlook some major flaws. Seems like she'd be a fun person to live next door to, but her voice has always gotten on my nerves ...
Bonus (minus) ERRRRGGH points: She married James Taylor
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 04:35 pm: |
Douglas
Sorry, I missed the part where Carly Simon was any kind of singer. Wasn't she just sort of an everbite with a guitar? She had a particularly odious tune that I'm trying hard not to recall, but the hook is seeping through the duct tape - something like "...and I think it's time we moved in together". She was also guilty of one of those Carly Sings Standards deals (standards - the last refuge of pop scoundrels?). Geez, what did George Gershwin ever do to her to deserve that?
| By Sue (64.12.97.7) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 05:46 pm: |
Oh yeah, that was her first hit..."That's The Way I Always Heard It Should Be" whiney, depressing -- she made moving in together sound like the end of the world ...
| By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 06:09 pm: |
Psilosibin..(sp ) It's the ingredient that does the trick in Magic Mushrooms Sue.
| By MEL&THEN SOME (195.219.7.70) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 06:23 pm: |
Ralph,
psilocy'bin
Hallucinogen found in Mushrooms.
at one time,only to be found in the Mexican Mushroom.
But for years now in the uk they can be found growing alongside the Fly Agaric Mushroom and can be easily mistaken for a natural mushroom.
So watch out if your ever
on a mushroom raid.
Mel(lost in a fantasy of dreams)
| By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 06:28 pm: |
Nothing like a good steak smothered in mushrooms Mel.
| By MEL&THEN SOME (195.219.7.70) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 06:36 pm: |
Ralph,
your the man(andthensome).
magically,mystified Mel.
| By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 06:42 pm: |
You're a good friend Mel.
| By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 06:51 pm: |
I admit, when I first heard people talking about how in Ann Arbor, you could find people selling mushrooms on every corner, I thought they meant the kind you put on a steak. I couldn't figure out why it was such a big deal to be able to score a common vegetable ...and why all my brother's hippie friends were so geeked about it.
Even having an older brother, I didn't get clued into some stuff until later ...
| By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 07:17 pm: |
You're just an innocent babe Sue.
| By larry (12.141.160.25) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 09:04 pm: |
Bear with me folks, I'm trying to follow this thread.
How did we go from Carly Simon to Psilocybin?
| By LTLFTC (12.210.76.205) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 09:31 pm: |
Speaking of ' errggh ' lyrics , how about ' no one knows what it's like to be the bad man behind blue eyes ' --- what does it MEAN ? And why is it rendered as if it means something profound ? And who are "Shadrac , Meshac , Abednago " ? And do they have any psilocybin ?
SteveK
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 10:19 pm: |
Steve K,
I'm sure there will be some diasgreement on this, but you've opened the gates on the issue of how the Who went from being one of the very coolest British invasion bands to purveyors of embarrasingly lame dreck like Behind Blue Eyes (or whatever it was called). Stuff like Can't Explain, Substitute and My Generation pretty much set the standard for pop music. Keith Moon was amazing to hear and see, and Entwhistle was possibly the only guy in the early rock scene who actually understood what a bass player was supposed to do in a rhythm section. Then something happened - I dunno what (maybe they shared a stage with Neil Diamond and got airborne sideburn poisoning). It started with Tommy, which wasn't totally terrible, but from then on they (mostly Townsend) took themselves way too seriously. Townsend went from being a geeky guy who could really get a lot out of 3 chords to being a geeky guy who was supposed to be some kind of big time composer. So now, instead of playing a D chord on the guitar and waving his pinky around like he did on a thousand songs, he plays (or has an orchestra play) one note over and over on the organ and THEN plays the same 3 chords, and it's Won't Get Fooled Again, or one of those other stupid tunes. Puhleeze. If these guys had cut and run in 1969 they'd get my vote for one of the best pop bands ever. However, IMHO the crushing burden of the dreck that they created so abundantly since then heavily outweighs and cancels the early good stuff. So bad. So sad.
| By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 10:33 pm: |
They were a cool Mod band at the beginning, they weren't pretentious.
I think "Tommy" was the beginning of the end. The whole concept of a rock opera was/is ludicrous ...
I am glad I saw them with Moon, in '76 I think, at the Pontiac Silverdome. I wouldn't have the heart to see them now.
| By LTLFTC (12.210.76.205) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 10:35 pm: |
Steve;
We are in 100% agreement on this. "If these guys had cut and run in 1969...." - I mean, "The Who Sells Out" - what a great album ; and FUNNY. Now when I think of the Who , it's always about what a pretentious sobersides Townshend is. Maybe he always was....the guitar smashing theatrics was pretty goofy , but the guy was 21-23 years old when he was doing that so thats a little easier to take. There are maybe 3 or 4 post-'69 tracks I can take....maybe another acronym is needed. How about STSR - ( Sh*t To Shinola Ratio ). The Who's STSR is pretty bad. Elvis has GOT to be the King of the STSR world , though - album after album after album of one-cool-song-plus-filler.
SteveK
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 10:38 pm: |
I saw them at Southfield High in 67 or so (Amboy Dukes and Seger were also on the bill). They were tremendous. Hard to imagine that they got so lame so fast. Ironically, I think Moon kept them grounded, and without him they quickly floated off to drecksville.
| By LTLFTC (12.210.76.205) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 10:39 pm: |
Another thought - the whole 'pretentious' era coincides with cocaine becoming the recreational drug of choice. Hmmmm.....coincidence ?
SteveK
| By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 10:41 pm: |
I remember Jaan Uhelszki (from Creem) telling me about that Southfield High Who gig.
Seger played my high school, Seaholm, but then -- he played every school in Metro Detroit.
One of my favorite local Who stories -- Keith Moon's infamous driving of the car into the swimming pool at the Holiday Inn in Flint. That's what got the Who banned from all Holiday Inns ...
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 10:53 pm: |
Steve K - That STSR business is a very astute observation. From here on in, it gets the Official Errggh Acronym stamp!
| By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 10:55 pm: |
SteveK,
Absolutely, I think cocaine was a big reason everybody suddenly thought they were geniuses ...
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 11:03 pm: |
It amazed me that they would ever show their faces in public after Spinal Tap. Drummer fatalities due to spontaneous combustion? The Incredible Originals?
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 11:06 pm: |
Actually, Hendrix had a very high STSR*, and it got progressively higher as his career went on. However, the quality of the shinola carried the day.
| By Sue (64.12.97.7) on Saturday, April 12, 2003 - 11:19 pm: |
Shinola ... is good???
| By john dixon (152.163.188.68) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 10:41 am: |
Some songs I love despite their pretentious lyrics. When those power chords kick in on "Behind Blue Eyes", Roger Daltrey could be singing "Shadrac, Meshack, and Abednago rolled into Detroit in a Winnebago".." for all I care. I think "The Who Sell Out" is my favorite by this band; the CD version has about 45 minutes of fine unreleased extra material. But "Who's Next" is a sturdy rock warhorse that has withstood non-stop rotation on classic rock radio for so long that I'm amazed that it still holds up as well as it does. If it sounded that dated, you wouldn't be hearing it all over tv adverts today; doesn't that CSI: Miami spinoff use something from "Who's Next" for it's theme song? I remember first buying it on 8 track tape. For me, "Who's Next" was just the best rock and roll album of its time; it played such an integral role in that segment of my life, I can't just dismiss it outright now.
With music that powerful, I couldn't turn my back on it now because of pretentious lyrics. I mean, this was at the same time period that "Stairway To Heaven" and "Roundabout" were released, for chrissakes, EVERYBODY was trying to be profound and most often succeeding only in being silly and/or pretentious. My interest in the Who was never that intense, from "Quadraphenia" onward, but "Who's Next" holds up just fine IMHO. A good rule of thumb should be: don't go listening to early 70's rock and roll, especially of the UK variety, for lyrical profundity.
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 10:56 am: |
I would like, if I may...
....to change the term a bit in relation to the rock audience at the time who couldn't tell "S**t FROM Shinola" (SFSa), which accounts for the sucuess of the later Who, Led Zep, Jethro Tull, countless hair metal bands, and purchases (still?) the endless Hendrix repackagings. I'm not sure if one blaimes $10 dope (my case), magic mushrooms (which grow wild out here) or cocaine, but the amount of sales seem to be in direct preportion to the quality of the music.
Here's an example. A band produces an LP. It's good but doesn't sell. Another one is also good, but sells better. A third good one is a blockbuster. 4 and 5 are really crudy but sell gobs based solely on reputation. One might want to call it the Led Zepplin effect.
Sue...
...Shinola is good, if you're a shoe.
As to Carly Simon, what's the first thing that comes to your mind when you hear "Antisipation"?
| By john dixon (152.163.188.68) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 11:06 am: |
doug, re: Carly Simon question--ketchup slowly coming out of the bottle?
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 11:08 am: |
Give That Man An R. G. Dunn.
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 11:26 am: |
Unconstipation?
| By Sue (205.188.209.38) on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 10:57 pm: |
I once had an editor who was driving me crazy -- briefly, blessedly, she moved on to edit Working Woman magazine or something else -- as I passed her car one morning on the way into the newsroom, I couldn't help but see a CD on the console of her car ...Carly Simon.
I laughed. It confirmed all my thoughts about her ...funny how music will do that. I admit it's now a game with me to see what music people have in their cars, and have fun passing judgment ...
| By Mark Speck (65.56.63.157) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 12:32 am: |
This thread cracks me up! Where else could you read about Tommy Roe, the Buckinghams, Wild Man Fischer, the Who and Neil Diamond (among others) all at once??
I always refer to that part in "Susan" as the 'orchestral nightmare'. The song is pretty good without that crap.
Tommy Roe--if you like "Sheila" and "Everybody", there was another hit in the same vein: "Come On" from 1964. There's a really good AM oldies station that plays obscure oldies and I heard it there.
As I mentioned in the past, I'm a BIG Wild Man Fischer fan. I also dig Ed Sanders and the Fugs and Captain Beefheart. I'm just two steps away from getting into bands like the Shaggs...LOL!
Nilsson's mispronunciation of "Pandemonium Shadow Show" was done as a JOKE...who couldn't get that?
"Anticipation"--this one girl used to sing it a lot at some of the karaoke shows I go to. I'd order a plate of French fries or something, sit up real close while she sang it, and hold up the bottle of Heinz ketchup. Cracked her up every time!!
Best,
Mark
| By Sue (205.188.209.38) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 12:41 am: |
Good grief, I just reread a John Dixon posting and I admit this got by me -- TESLA covered that pitiful song "Signs" ??? I shudder to think ...isn't the original band Canadian??
I agree that "Who's Next" is good Who...all good ERRRGHH scholars have to resist disliking stuff in retrospect just because bands went on to record sludge. You can hear in "Who's Next" the seeds of their downfall -- the pretentiousness, etc. -- but at that point it wasn't a negative, yet.
| By Larry (12.141.160.25) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 12:46 am: |
Nice post Mark. LMAO.
As I'm reading some of your ref's I'm thinkin OMG I wonder if he.... then wham! you mentioned the Shags!!! Sir Foot Foot if I remember???
Sue, you are bad. That gal went on to Woman's Wear Daily? Lol.
| By Sue (205.188.209.38) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 12:58 am: |
The Shags ...weren't they that awful Maryland group who couldn't play??
Nah that editor wouldn't make it at WWD. More like Window Washing Daily ...
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 09:12 am: |
I propose that we begin the week with a discussion of wretched excess that will probably get me trashed, - "more is better" thinking that led to totally overdoing some aspect of a tune. The Beatles come to mind in several instances, as they were prone to rideouts that were longer than the actual tune (Strawberry Fields, Hey Jude, All You Need is Love). I never knew what to make of the "freak out" section in A Day in the Life, except that it was so boring and unpleasant that it made the next section ("woke up, got out of bed") sound OK, which it wasn't.
Before you start throwing stuff, understand that I'm not saying that the Beatles are Errggworthy. However, in their case, the STSR test should be applied to each song individually , as some contain far less shinola than others.
| By Eli (151.197.182.214) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 09:23 am: |
Robert Goulet...I do concur with Elvis on that one!!
Ashanti
Amerie
Britney Spears
Ja Rule
The Electric Slide
Biz Markie
Contemporary Whitney
Contemporary, post Walter A. Mariah
Elvis movie music
Glitter
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 10:25 am: |
SteveS....
....may I nominate for your excess subcatagory
"The Boxer"
By Simon and Garfunkel, which had an ending so long you could go out for a cup of coffee and still have time to read a 30 psa over it.
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 11:00 am: |
Douglas - So you're saying that in your days as a disk jockey, you preferred The Boxer - short version?
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 11:07 am: |
CCR's version of "Suzie-Q," definitely not ERRGH material but it has quite the excessively lengthy middle ...
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 11:42 am: |
Sue - I have this vague memory that in the very early WABX days the record companies would buy 15 minute blocks of time ("the next 15 minutes are brought to you by Elektra records") to showcase an "underground" group, such as the errgghworthy Bunky and Jake ("Taxicab, Taxicab" - it belonged underground - way underground). Aside from that classic dreckfest (which hopefully no one except me has the misfortune to remember), I recall Susie-Q droning on for the entire 15 minutes. However, CCR wasn't the worst offender.
The Chambers Brothers and Iron Butterfly tunes (I won't name them for fear of spoiling the rest of the day) were damn close to eternal and to make matters worse, got tons of airplay, although one could make the argument that they were "of the time". However, one could not make such an argument for Eric Burdon's "Sky Pilot", which even in those pungent times, carried the distinct aroma of dreck.
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 11:51 am: |
Hey, you can't ruin my day by naming "Inna Gadda Da Vida," I learned the bass line for that song -- the only thing I ever played on a bass guitar -- so it's part of my memory bank forever.
I see a great future in a Hippie Dreck subthread ...
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 11:55 am: |
Yeah, like I said, IGDV was "of the time", which is another way of saying:
WWIT* - What Was I Thinking?
* Official Errggh Acronym
| By LTLFTC (12.210.76.205) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 11:55 am: |
There was a huge article on The Shaggs in the New Yorker magazine a couple years back. Later , i heard that Tom Cruise (future star of "The Sam Cooke Story") optioned the article for movie rights or whatever. I gave their first album (yeah, there's two) a listen based on my respect for Terry Adams of NRBQ who re-issued The Shaggs lp. It's pretty bad , but I dunno - it's really one of those head-scratcher situations. In a way, punk was supposed to be about 'inspired amateurism' and this has that in abundance (well, amateurism anyway). And there is a certain charm to the songs too, especially "My Pal Footfoot" - but this is one of those uncomfortable situations where I can't tell if I'm laughing AT them or WITH them. It's the same feeling I have with those ' song-poem ' albums. (The ones where people would send their poems or lyrics in with a fee and would receive copies of finished recordings featuring their lyrics). It's like they are being laughed AT yet some of the songs are SOOOO funny, you can't help it.
Beyond ERRggh
SteveK
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 12:14 pm: |
I'm sorry, but I can't let Sky Pilot off that easily. I don't know if it was the cheeseball phaser effect on the vocals, the just plain stoopid lyrics or what, but I suspect that a big factor was the vocal harmony, stacked up 3 Stooges style:
jjjjjjjjj(hello....hello....hello)
"he'll never...never...never... reach the sky"
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 12:29 pm: |
SteveS.....
.....there was a short form of "The Boxer"? What was it--"The Briefs"
In regards to "Sky Pilot", was Burton suffering from terminal hippness in that era? I destinctly remember two other songs that suffered from a similar syndrome, "Montery" and "San Francisco Nights", that both had a) insufferable openings, followed by b) insufferable content.
As to drawn out endings, I'm gonna throw in (up?) Grand Funk's "I'm Your Captain/Closer To Home" which drones on and on and on.....
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 12:57 pm: |
Douglas,
I am truly honored to be in the presence of observant scholars such as yourself. It had never dawned on me until you mentioned it that San Francisco Nights and Sky Pilot were essentially the same bad song (if at first you don't succeed, you just suck?). I'm hard pressed to say which was worse, but jockey or brief, either one is a certified POS.
And Monterey...gawd man, how do you get through a day with stuff like that clogging up your neural paths? Apparently, that was an early Burden experiment in randomly dropping names (Creque Alley style) of groups that managed to squeeze out more than one successful album (and it's sad, cause his first one was great), thinking maybe their success would rub off. I've seen James Brown use a similar technique in concert - he starts naming cities randomly until he gets a lot of applause, at which point, he more or less knows where he is.
| By LTLFTC (12.210.76.205) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 01:20 pm: |
So that's why JB listed cities !! LO extremely L . I also enjoyed his grocery list at the end of "Make IT Funky".
SteveK
| By Eli (151.197.184.19) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 01:33 pm: |
I know that I will get "hate mail" for this
but what is all the fuss about Led Zep's Stairway to heaven as being one of the greatest rock songs ever???
And also the supposed wizardry of Clapton???
C'mon!!! gimme a break.The Detroit guitarists run rings around Clapton!!
Also where would Hendrix be without his "effects" and his image??
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 01:48 pm: |
Bobby,
Welcome to errggh!
No argument on Stairway, other than the possible argument that it was an early, yet classic example of the "wall o'sh*t" technique. And if you're gonna take potshots at guitar players, Jimmy Page couldn't take a dump without an echo unit and compressor.
Agree on Clapton too. There were about a half dozen guys, mostly named King (Albert, BB, Freddie ...) who did that stuff first; Eric just did it louder and longer. Too his credit though, he's the first to admit that.
I have to disagree with your take on Hendrix though. He paid his dues backing up guys like the Isleys. Take away the effects and all the trappings, and the guy still was a monster that totally changed the way folks approached the guitar. Had plenty of bad days, and a high STSR, but I don't think anybody played with that kind of intensity before he came along. In fact, the Claptons and Pages knew it, and by all accounts, felt pretty silly next to the guy.
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 01:49 pm: |
Agreed, Eli, sort of....
Although it could be argued that Neil Young's extended solos could qualify as thread worthy material, I've always admired him as a guitar player. Not technically brilliant like Hendrix, but a guy who could do more with a simple note progression (the solo in "Down By The River" for example) than anyone else out there. Clapton, when he's playing the stuff he aparently likes, has the same quality, although he suffered greatly in his Cream + days, when brilliance and speed were confused.
I will not discuss Hendrix at length. He is a god out here, and slaming him would be akin to trashing Bob Seger. Can't do it man, I like to live.
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 01:53 pm: |
Yeah the Hendrix stuff, though it's been overplayed, I can still listen to, but the Clapton was clearly overrated, even the Cream stuff ...
No "hate mail" on the Stairway comment Bobby, I agree...if I was going to hold up any Zep track as still viable that would be last on the list.
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 01:54 pm: |
Doug,
I was going to make the speed/Cream analogy too. It probably had to do with whatever they were ingesting ...
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 01:59 pm: |
Down by the River / Cinnamon Girl - IKBILI* (I really have no idea why).
* Official Errggh Acronym
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 02:04 pm: |
Couldn't at least 50% of Neil's output be IKBILI? Which just proves how the unthinkable/unknowable also factors into great pop music ...
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 02:16 pm: |
Douglas,
I heard Melanie singing the roller skate song this weekend, so unlike you, I have no desire to continue living. Besides, I've already trashed the beatles, clapton and page today, so why stop now?
Although I thought Ramblin Gamblin Man was a terriffic pop tune, I somehow missed the Bob Seger thing. Once he hit his stride, he became the king of the long, banal rideout (Night Moves, Against the Wind, and the appropriately titled Still the Same and Like a Rock are among the many, interchangeable tunes that come to mind), with the backup singers droning a three or 4 word mantra while Bob yammers on for a few hours (time flies when you're in terrible pain). You could definitely have built a seger-o-matic to churn those puppies out, but mercifully, some genius was too busy inventing the singing bass to do that.
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 02:17 pm: |
...and the other 50% just plain stinks!
| By Eli (151.197.184.19) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 02:20 pm: |
Ok guys, I will allow Hendrix to slip through!!
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 02:27 pm: |
Uh oh SteveS ...better hie thee to the outskirts of town ...
What about Seger's other early songs? Surely there's no denying "2+2," and "East Side Story," and his "Sock it to Me Santa" works for me.
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 02:29 pm: |
I think Seger got caught up in the singer/songwriter traffic accident of the '70s, hung out with his Detroit homie Glenn Frey a lot, and went off in that direction instead of expanding on his R&B/rocking roots.
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 02:32 pm: |
Sue - Those were OK back in the Hideout days, long before the Seeger-o-Matic era. First danger sign: Heavy Music.
| By LTLFTC (12.210.76.205) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 03:04 pm: |
Seger, Clapton , Neil Young - maybe the STSR is just a natural byproduct of trying to sustain a CAREER as a musician. Just think of all the artists that have done great stuff and yet just hearing their name brings out a groan because of the ol' STSR. Maybe that's another reason Hendrix still seems vital - he bought in to the "three-and-out" plan ; the golden handshake - early retirement thing. Just imagine if Young etc. had 3 or 4 REALLY solid lp's instead of 40 erratic ones. But that's against the nature of the biz , I guess.
Speaking of "when great ones go pretentious" , has anyone taken to fame much worse than Prince?
After the first 3 or 4 albums, I was hyping people about ' this guy's gonna be one of the greats". And then ,post- Purple Rain , his public persona gets so bizarre. I mean , there was still good work , but especially the videos - rubbing his chest and licking his lips and prancing around with those skyscraper heels (give it up , dude , you're short - so what)> People would say "this is the guy you said was so great?"
as Prince rubs the floor suggestively and shoots the camera a "come to me - my 900 number is... look. "Naw, this isn't the guy...."
Steve K
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 03:13 pm: |
Steve -- do you remember his first album cover??
Didn't he have a raincoat type thing on, and underneath was only wearing a bikini brief? I was shocked when we played it, at how good he was.. so I think all the weird image stuff was there from the beginning ...
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 03:26 pm: |
3 and out???
....Has anybody had the time and/or courage to count the number of Hendrix repackages, concert or studio outtake LPs that are out there? Someone at Warner Bros took advantage of that franchise and rode the horse until the reputation was crippled. One more "recently discovered" lp, and I'll....I'll....I'll start taking Southbound Freeway seriously.
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 03:34 pm: |
uuggggggh....Southbound Freeway.....I'm down with a serious shot to the gut. Everything is kind of hazy and all I can hear is a Muruga drum solo. Wait...I think I see a light at the end of a long tunnel...oh no, it's harry chapin's taxi! That changes everything...I want to live!
| By LTLFTC (12.210.76.205) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 03:38 pm: |
Sue; Yeah , he had the raincoat ( I looked all over for one of those). Actually that was "Dirty Mind" , his 3rd album but the first most folks heard. I shouldn't hold videos against people anyway (as by nature, music videos are the Spawn of Satan), but still photos are less creepy, to me anyway.
Hey Doug - I was just counting the ones during his lifetime. I can't believe he'd approve of 99% (and in this case I mean 99 out of 100) of the reissues. I'm surprised Warners hasn't recorded the physical scraping of the bottom of the Hendrix barrel, thrown a stereo mix on it and issued THAT.
SteveK
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 03:44 pm: |
Steve,
Yeah "Dirty Mind" was the first Prince album to make an impression at the Creem office, and there were whoops of all kinds going up when that particular package was opened ...a very disrespectful greeting to say the least ...
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Tuesday, April 15, 2003 - 12:35 pm: |
With nothing better to do, I re-read this thing top to bottom this morning. Took 3 cigarettes and a half a pot of coffee. But to do some clean up.....
....Early on, Sue mentioned pushing "The Happening" over a good Spinners song. Could it be even in the early stages, Barry recognized that no one in the Spinners was his ticket to Hollywood?
....Someone mentioned "Signs" by the 5 Man Electrical Band. I don't have a copy, but I believe it was on Lionel Records--the same folks that make tinplate trains, using their then current logo. That might explain something, but I'm not sure what.
Now onward (why?)...
...In long winded discussions about either radio or Detroit rock, Terry Knight's name seldom comes up. I nominate Terry Knight And The Pack" as Eerrghh worthy, with a golden something to Terry himself, as a group leader, solo artist, and producer. For group, taking an overwrought "I Who Have Nothing" and overwroughting is even more, as a solo artist (I saw him once at the Chessmate...not really all that bad) for ruining a perfectly good Flanders and Schwann song on record ("Mud" I think, but I know it was one from the beastiary) and as a producer/manager for the early Grand Funk promotion.
Can you name anyone else in the history of Detroit rock who has done so much harm?
Well maybe Alan Klein, for releasing a Terry Knight greatest hits package--on Lucky 11--and sitting on the rest of the Cameo-Parkway catalogue.
| By StingBeeLee (155.139.50.14) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 11:27 am: |
KevGo; sorry for taking so long to answer you, I can only get to the computer in spurts. I can't get to my records, but I believe the Brazil '66 songs I liked were something like "Que Sada Nada" or something like that, I thought they were singing about the state of Ohio at the time, as I would tell my parents I want to hear the Ohio song. I liked "Fool On the Hill" and "one note Samba". For Petula I liked "Downtown", "Don't sleep in the subway", "The other man's grass is always greener", and I liked practically anything by the Fifth Dimension. I was not an adult nor a teenager in the '60's, so I liked whatever I thought I liked, sometimes I would be able to understand the lyrics, sometimes not. By the time 1975 rolled around, I was practically through with contemporary music and pretty much only brought oldies.
| By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 11:44 am: |
StingBee:
You mean "Mas Que Nada" by Sergio & Brasil 66, which is also one of my favorites as well as Petula's "A Sign Of The Times" and all the 5th Dimension stuff.
Kevin Goins - KevGo
| By Larry (12.141.160.25) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 12:06 pm: |
Sue, SteveK, SteveS, John (who am I forgetting?),
I just re-read the posts of Saturday the 12th:
The Tommy Rowe, Anne Murray, Kenny Loggins massacre.
You folks are just rippin into my hero's.
Shame Shame.
| By LBJ (63.88.160.101) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 01:32 pm: |
FLOAT ON,one of the worst songs ever written or produced. Float on float. my name is bla bla i love all ec. ect. Boring chord changes pure crap
| By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 01:40 pm: |
Larry - I don't know about heros, but I purchased one of Anne Murray' 45s, and one of Kenny Loggin's.
Poor Floaters. I think "Float On" was their only hit. They still sing periodically in this area.
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 01:54 pm: |
It's not hard to figure out why the grass is always greener wherever sonic fertilizer like Float On is playing.
| By Larry (216.23.183.2) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 03:45 pm: |
Is "Float On" where one of the guys say's, "My name is Larry and I love All the Woman in the World"? I was an impressionable kid. Never forgot that advice. 3 decades of STD's and I wound up marrying an Argentine! I'm now divorced and celibate..... perfect candidate for a Stubass Angel.
Wait a minute... SteveS ??? Am I mistaken? Was it Larry, who was a Capricorn on the Ohio Players' "I Want To Be Free"? Or, was Larry a Taurus and Marlon a Capricorn?
Oh dear...the ritalin hasn't kicked in yet.
Think I'll lie down for a while.
I'd ask Melandthensome for help (I love you Mel), but, I'd just get some list of 20 rare cool soul gems all about Astrological Indifference.
| By SteveS (209.219.207.3) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 04:32 pm: |
Larry,
Yes, that's Float On. I can't remember the names of all the singers, but what I do I recall is that there was so much echo on the session that Zeppo's bit was still going while Gummo was doing his intro schtick, and the whole tune kept playing for about three days after they all left the building. It's actually an OK tune. Except for the lyrics. And the music. And the concept.
| By Larry (216.23.183.2) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 04:37 pm: |
SteveS.
I'm crying inside. You one funny mutha!
Zeppo and Gummo, two of the lost tribesman.
| By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 04:54 pm: |
Hey Gang:
Whatever you say or do regarding "Float On" please don't massacre our own Dennis Coffey over this tune - he arranged it.
Kevin Goins - KevGo
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 05:35 pm: |
KevGo - that's why I was holding back; I was trying to be diplomatic. But this is errgggh, and I would be shirking my duty if I failed to point out that that song left skid marks all over the studio. Truthfully, it's a steel cage death match of a tune. Just as you get through the first guy talking and then singing totally insipid lyrics that would have got him laughed out of a 70's singles bar, over a monotonous rhythm that pretty much flatlines out (I can't really call it a groove, maybe just a gr), and you're desperately hoping for traffic and weather on the 8's, or a test of the emergency broadcast system, or a freak tsunami, you get another guy doing the SAME DAMN THING. And then, unless you're lucky enough to find an embankment to drive into, it happens 3 MORE TIMES (maybe 4, I am prone to blackouts due to repeated self-inflicted blunt object impacts to the head).
Let's face it Kev, they can't all be hits.
| By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 05:55 pm: |
Hey Steve:
I hear ya'...Try playing the album version of "Float On" - ELEVEN MINTUES & FORTY-FIVE SECONDS (first half instrumental, second half vocals).
It was a great bathroom record when I was a radio DJ....
Kevin Goins - KevGo
| By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 05:55 pm: |
I liked "Float On." Where was it on the charts?
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 05:58 pm: |
Kev - It was a great bathroom record. Period!
| By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 06:05 pm: |
Sis:
"Float On" - Floaters
Billboard #1 R&B
Billboard #2 Pop
Certified Gold & Platinum Single, RIAA
FLOATERS - self-titled LP
Billboard #1 R&B Album Chart
Billboard #10 Pop Album Chart
Certified Gold & Platinum Album, RIAA
Kevin Goins - KevGo
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 06:12 pm: |
Kev,
Although I appreciate your good intentions, aren't there other places on the forum where you could post actual facts such as Billboard listings? On errgggh, we try to stick to innuendo, malicious character assasination and hallucinations, and the insertion of factual information of any sort only serves to taint the proceedings.
| By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 06:17 pm: |
SteveS - I'm sorry I asked. Geez. I just wanted to know how far it was on the charts since I liked it. I'll go and stand in the corner for a week.
| By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 06:27 pm: |
Steve:
First of all, Sis asked a question and I answered it.
Second of all, to tell me in essence to "get lost" I find absolutely offensive. As you can tell by my prior posting(s) I've gone along with the errgh! "criteria" and even gave my spin on things regarding "Float On". To now tell me that my input is not appreciated because I simply answered a fellow Forum member's question is simply asinine.
I was simply trying to have a good time with this like every one else and right now I'm really trying to refrain from saying something I may regret later.
I'm sorry I even tried to help, if that
satisfies you.
Kevin Goins - KevGo
| By john dixon (64.12.97.7) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 06:46 pm: |
To Sis and Kevin,
I think if you look at SteveS's hilarious posts throughout this entire thread, you'll see a consistent irreverence that bares no malice to forum posters, just offensive records. I thought he was being jocular with both of you. Without question you both are two of the most respected and valued forum regulars and I'm sure he feels the same way. It's just that the preferred tone of this thread is admittedly wonky. We love you; SteveS does too, he's just a sick freak, that's all.
| By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 07:04 pm: |
Hello John Dixon - Thank you! I thought SteveS was upset because the Floaters were number one on the charts. (LOL) Now that was back at him, I got my revenge. :o)
| By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 07:06 pm: |
(((((STEVES))))) OK, OK, OK. For the time being, I won't go to the corner. I'll wait until after Friday when I post my review of the concert.
| By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 07:27 pm: |
Thanks John,
You took the words right out of my mouth. Abandon seriousness, all who enter errrrggh ...chill out and laugh.
The clues that Steve was being funny: "malicious character assassination" and "hallucinations" ...
"Float On" I think is an example of a song that was so of its time that it hasn't aged well -- witness, it was No. 1 R&B, so a lot of people liked it at the time ...
p.s. Dennis only arranged it ...
| By Larry (12.141.160.25) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 07:30 pm: |
Kevin,
I agree 100% with John Dixon. SteveS was just playing around. Listen to what's saying to you.
"Kevin! keep your facts out of this thread! This thread is about BS, Maliciousness, Lies and Innuendo!!!" You my friend, were making too much sense for this tasteless druel thread!
But, heck, now that you're here, you might as well pull up a chair. Just make sure to duck when the dreck fly's by!
Maybe they should change the name of this thread to
"Lot's of Songs and a few artists suck and we are'nt ashamed to say so in public, alienating some and befriending others as we decimate whatever and whomever we feel we're in the mood to at the moment".
That what this is all about SteveS???
| By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 07:31 pm: |
John:
That may be the case but I didn't read it that way.
To say "aren't there other places on the forum where you could post actual facts such as Billboard listings?"(his quote not mine)can be seen as a way of saying "your input is not welcomed." Therefore, that's why I found it offensive.
He could've found another way of saying what he wrote or - to paraphrase an old cliche - don't say anything at all. Just let my response to Sis stand as just that and move on.
Like I said before - I'm sorry I even responded. If I knew this particular thread's "rules" were hard-fast I would've just responded to Sis' question "off the Forum".
Regards,
Kevin Goins - KevGo
(PS - and if Steve had any so-called "respect" for me & Sis, he wouldn't have responded in such a manner).
| By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 07:35 pm: |
Larry - Now I understand, let me be sure and repeat: this thread is about "BS, Maliciousness, Lies and Innuendo!" ROFLMAO
Actually some of the "Now That's Class" artist should be named over on this thread.
| By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 07:38 pm: |
Sis gets it.
| By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 08:49 pm: |
John & Larry:
I've gone along with the humor of this thread and like I said before I found it amusing and at times funny as hell. I was innocently answering Sis' question when Steve hit me with his post, which hit me the wrong way.
I appreciate you folks for clarifying what this is all about. I just wished that Steve himself had responded to my posts and not have his friends stick up for him. Oh well.....
Kevin Goins - KevGo
| By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 09:10 pm: |
Kev,
Go back and re-read Steve's post until you start to laugh.I did the first time I read it. Believe me, I'm sure it was all tongue and cheek. Between Steve and StuBass we have two of the funniest guys on the forum. I'm not entirely certain either of them can truly post something of a serious nature. I'm sure Steve doesn't have a malicious bone in his body.
| By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 09:19 pm: |
Before I catch any heat from either of these guys, let me clarify. I didn't mean to imply that they were not capable of anything that might be considered somewhat serious. Quite the contrary I'm sure. I just get the feeling that they're more comfortable in the realm of the absurd. Think about it. StuBass is collecting Angels and Steve is putting together a code for the forum that will soon need the World War Two Enigma Machine to decipher.You can't make stuff up THIS good.
| By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 09:21 pm: |
Ralph - I wish I had gotten it the first time. It is so funny. But I'm slow, with this old age and all. You know about that, right? LOL
| By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 09:26 pm: |
Sis..You're not slow. You just think a little more deeply than I do. When you get to be my age you tend not to over-ponder thngs. Age has it's advantages.
| By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 10:28 pm: |
p.s. "Sick Freak" -- Steve will be honored by that I'm sure ...he's tied up this evening but I'm sure will be back errgggghing in the wee hours ...
| By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 10:30 pm: |
p.s. I have it on good authority he's wearing a Puffy Shirt and strumming his guitar while striding back and forth ...
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 10:49 pm: |
KevGo and Sis,
I sincerely apologize if I have offended you with my prior post. My intent was entirely facetious, and was directed toward maintaining the perverse lack of integrity that is unique to this thread. Perhaps my judgement in posting the remark to you was clouded by recent situations that have developed at my job. I work in a very pressure packed environment, and the errggh thread is sometimes the only outlet I have for my frustration. Although I generally am reluctant to discuss personal matters on the forum, the gravity of this situation merits an explanation.
For many years, I have been disillusioned by the deteriorationg state of circus entertainment, and circus clowns in particular. Recently, I decided to rectify the dismal situation by starting my own circus. Although I have functioned as a Master of Ceremonies, sidehow barker and a Circus Executive, I am currently employed as the Personal Assistant to Pencils, the Intelligent Clown. This is a rather time consuming job with quite a bit of responsibility, as my duties include handling all of Pencils' correspondence and daily scheduling, as well as filling and maintaining pressure in the seltzer bottles, inspecting the clown shoes and ironing them to prevent curling, and performing scheduled maintenance and repairs on the clown taxi. Nevertheless, I am proceeding to build my circus, act by act, seeking out the best in "old school" circus entertainment. Fortunately, my parents (circus legends Georgina, the Bearded Lady, and Frou Frou, the Hermaphrodite) raised me to believe in myself, and to follow my dreams.
Today was particularly stressful, as Pencils got into and argument with one of the strongmen over a review of a Bordeaux in the latest issue of Wine Spectator magazine, and I had to break up the fight that ensued.
I hope you will understand. Again, I sincerely apologize if I have offended anyone with my comments on this, or any other thread.
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 11:15 pm: |
Ralph,
Thank you for your kind words, and your attempts to defuse the unfortunate situation that occured earlier this evening. I am not familiar with the Enema machine you refer to, but I will keep it in mind should matters become congested in the southern hemisphere.
I am sincerely flattered by your comparison of my postings with those of stubass. However, I am not worthy, as stu is possessed of a wit and insight that is truly inspiring. I am a mere Solieri to his Mozart. In fact, in the small amount of spare time that I have, I have dedicated myself to compiling a 2 volume biography of stu, composed entirely of information that he has posted about himself on Soulful Detroit. I expect to finish the first volume in early 2004. It is tenatively titled Stuart Miller - The Early Years: Pasteur Elementary through *THE STRIDES*.
Thanks again Ralph for the fine job you have done in moderating this forum.
| By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 11:24 pm: |
SteveS - Will you be hiring at your circus? I can sell the tickets and collect the twenty-five cents at the door. Do you want me to allow Ralph into the circus without paying? :o)
| By STUBASS (64.12.97.7) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 11:26 pm: |
STEVE: SOUNDS LIKE TWO FULL VOLUMES OF ERRGGH TO ME!!!...STU(IT WASN'T ALL *THAT* EXCITING)BASS
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 11:30 pm: |
Sis - Thanks for the offer. And just for the record, you were right - I was upset to discover that Float On was #1 (I was quite certain it was #2). This is a perfect example of how factual information can serve to confuse a situation, and why I believe that errggh should remain 99% Fact Free.
| By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 11:32 pm: |
LOL - A good one SteveS, but I got cha back. :o)
| By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 11:41 pm: |
Like I was saying.....Or to paraphrase....curiouser and curioser. Thanks for the kind words though Steve.
| By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 12:10 am: |
Someone said this guy posted the same thing on one of the Temptations' Forum.
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 12:34 am: |
John, Larry and Sue - Thanks for your support and understanding. Since he's not around this evening to defend himself, could we simply agree to blame this entire affair on Douglasm?
| By ROTFLMAO (152.163.188.68) on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 07:23 am: |
KEVGO: CHECK TO SEE IF YOU HAVE A Y CHROMOSONE.
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 08:04 am: |
Maybe someone listened to "Chick-A-Boom" one too many times?
| By StingBeeLee (155.139.68.10) on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 08:50 am: |
Did someone mention Pasteur Elementary School? Pasteur Rules!!! Float On-I wish I can hear the 11 minute version, as each of the Floaters do a monologue of something like "Hello, my name is Larry, I like everybody and everything, and everybody and everything likes me, including myself, who is likable. Now if you like me, and I like you, come into my world of likeableness" and then would sing "Take my hand...etc. etc."
What was interesting was that Charles and Larry took their monologue seriously, and Ralph and Paul seemed to be not that serious. It's a funny song.
| By StingBeeLee (155.139.50.14) on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 08:56 am: |
I liked Anne Murray's "Snowbird". I was listening to CKLW some of the time, and I believe they had to play some Canadian artists at that time. So they played Anne Murray, Poppy Family, Beverly Bremers, 5 man electrical band and others. I think that if they did not have to play these Canadian artists, they wouldn't, as most of the pop out of Canada was a little behind the times. I am a channel changer, so I heard on the FM stations "Breathe Deep..." and "Stairway to Heaven" although I couldn't understand either.
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 09:31 am: |
Reflecting on recent events, I have come to the realization that errggh has become too insular, and too cynical and harsh in its criticism of questionable pop music and musicians. For example, the following dialogue, replete with sarcasm and negativity, and devoid of factual information, is quite typical of an errggh exchange:
old errggh1: What the hell ever happened to Neil Diamond? It's like he walked out of the Brill Building and took the last train to drecksville.
old errggh2: Yeah, his old stuff was cool, but after Kentucky Woman or so, he stinks on ice.
old errggh1: I heard that the open A, D and E chords on his guitar got fed up and walked off.
old errggh2: The only good thing I can say is ALINC.
old errggh1: KMNP.
=======================
I believe it is now time for a kindler, gentler errggh, in which we acknowledge and celebrate the good in every song. In the new errggh, the above exchange might go something like this:
new errggh1: I�m not certain that Neil Diamond is working up to his full potential.
new errggh2: Perhaps not, but consider his many accomplishments: According to Billboard, Sweet Caroline, Holly Holy, Cracklin� Rosie, Song Sung Blue, and You Don�t Bring Me Flowers all went gold and platinum, except for Song Sung Blue, which went gold on July 27, 1972, but oddly, did not go platinum. And don�t get me started on his many fine, fine albums.
new errggh1: Well, now that you�ve reminded me of those interesting facts, I guess I realize that every song can�t be an �I Am I Said�.
new errggh2: And he is such an energetic performer.
new errggh1: Now that I've considered all the facts, I�m looking forward to his next release. I�m sure it will be better.
========================
Although I do believe that we need to adjust our attitudes, I still believe that efficiency and clarity in communications is important. Thus, I propose that we discard the mean-spirited acronyms we have accumulated, and replace them with the following acronyms, which reflect a more positive disposition:
YBHWC � Yes, but he works clean.
PINTLMC � Perhaps I need to listen more closely.
CALOEWIT � Clearly, a lot of effort went into that.
AWALOP � Artist with a lot of personality
BBBLOHF � Big-boned but light on his/her feet
IPJADS � It's probably just a dry spell.
ALINC - (well, it's sorta positive, isn't it? C'mon, ya gotta leave me something to cling to.)
I hope you will all consider this suggestion and act accordingly.
Have a nice day. J
| By Sue (64.12.97.7) on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 09:50 am: |
Why do cranks always post from AOL??? That's "chromosome," dude. And so being female is bad?
| By Sue (64.12.97.7) on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 09:53 am: |
I don't know if this fits in errrgggh-worthy, but there's a guy on Dick Purtan's show in the mornings (WOMC-Detroit) who "does" Gordon Lightfoot, playing and singing -- the other morning he did a tribute to Cher as Gordo ...you haven't lived, until you've heard "Gypsies, Tramps & Thieves" done Lightfoot style. I laughed myself silly ..
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 09:56 am: |
CALOEWIT*
Kinder, Gentler Errggh Acronym
| By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 12:48 pm: |
Steve, Ralph, Sue & Sis:
Thanks for the kind words. Like many of you I turn to this Forum as a "stress-reliever" and find it quite amusing and funny. I was so caught up with the BS I deal with on the job that Steve's initial post caught me at the wrong time. All is forgiven and all is good.
ERRGGH on my friends...
Kevin Goins - KevGo
| By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 02:36 pm: |
Stingbeelee,
At last, someone took up my Anne Murray challenge -- "Snowbird" falls into I Know, But I Like It territory for me. It's on her subsequent releases that I think something went awry, the execrable "Danny's Song," among others ...
We definitely have more Murray exposure in Detroit because of the Canadian content laws...it was preferable to me when it was the Guess Who we were hearing twice an hour.
| By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 02:53 pm: |
No problem KevGo - I don't have to tell you all what has me stressed out for the past few weeks. I think I'm doing real good though due to the understanding of all of you cyber-soul-buddies. And especially my buddies overseas. Hey guys, come on over on the 23rd. SteveS will be there handing out a listing of Errgg Aacronyms. SteveS be sure and show up. I'll meet you at the Cass Cafe. No excuses. (Bring Horse with you so I can give him a hug.)
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 03:18 pm: |
Sue,
Anne Murray is definitely an AWALOP*. And that 30 year dry spell is bound to clear up any day now.
Have a nice day!
* Kinder, gentler errggh acronym
| By SteveS (68.41.246.95) on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 03:41 pm: |
Sue,
I'm sorry, I got interrupted (Pencils took a nasty shot in the chops in the fight yesterday, and he's been a bitch on wheels all day today).
If this were the old errggh, I would be compelled to point out that Burton Cummings of the Guess Who was once suspected of being the love child of Robert Goulet and Wayne Newton, and the instrument of their diabolical (although unsuccessful) plot to infiltrate rock music. I know, it sounds crazy now, but they all do look remarkably like the evil lawyer that was always trying to swindle the 3 stooges out of their inheritance.
But this is the new, kindler, gentler errggh, so I'm not gonna say that. Instead, I'd like to say that I saw some footage of a Guess Who revival a few years ago, and for big men, they were very light on their feet.
| By john dixon (152.163.188.68) on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 06:47 pm: |
Here's a group that I love--The Rolling Stones. I've been a fan since I first heard their cover of Buddy Holly's "Not Fade Away" nearly 40 years ago. The last 20 years they've only been relevant as a monolithic touring entity but for quite a stretch, their singles and LPs really did matter to me.
But here's a record of theirs that has always been pure torture for me to listen to--AYYYNNNGGEY! Yep, "Angie" seemed to sum up every thing that was going wrong with the Stones during their mid-70's slump, post "Exile On Main Street" up until they got their mojo back in '78 on "Some Girls. I would rather hear the most sacharine Neil Diamond song than sit through "Angie", and that, fellow errggh scholars if I may quote The Velvellettes, is really saying something.
| By Larry (216.23.183.2) on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 07:00 pm: |
John,
Pop music needed an antidote for the sweet-n-low hits you mentioned + disco. Exit "Angie", enter The Clash, Sex Pistols and The Ramones and thank g-d for them. And I wasn't a punk fan.
p.s. SteveS: your newfound PC ergh posts are funnnyyy!!
| By Sue (152.163.188.68) on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 07:30 pm: |
John -- I think the problem with "Angie" is this fixation Mick and Keith had with country music. I'm sure Gram Parsons was a cool guy to hang around with, but I don't think the Stones should have tried messing with any of that.
It's also partly the "Mick" factor -- any Stones song that I suspect is 80 or 90% Mick, and therefore only 20 or 10% Keith, lacks the magic Stones Formula (at least 60% Keith) and therefore teeters on the edge of dreckosity ...
| By Larry (216.23.183.2) on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 07:51 pm: |
Well said Sue.
Speaking of rock goin' country, a more successful union occurred when Elvis Costello broke from his band the Attractions for his first solo album "King Of America". He used Elvis Presley's band. Great record.
I'm sure Neil Diamond hated it.
http://www.inkblotmagazine.com/rev-archive/Elvis_Costello_King.htm
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 08:23 pm: |
"Angie" was in late '73, wasn't it? If what's left of my memory is intact, that was near the beginning of the so-called "country rock" boon that launched such groups as Poco, The Ozark Mountain Daredevils, Commander Cody and the Lost Planet Airmen and the like, wasn't it? Except for extending the Grateful Dead's career (a dubious destinction) and creating an appreciation of Merle Haggard, did ANY good come out of that movement? I mean besides providing a new outlet for Donnie and Marie.
Burton Cummings does look a bit like Wayne Newton....
| By Mark Speck (65.56.60.217) on Friday, April 18, 2003 - 01:22 am: |
Anyone else remember Cheech and Chong's parody of "Float On", entitled "Bloat On"?
Speaking of people imitating Gordon Lightfoot, Burton Cummings did just that on his live CD a few years ago. He does a great imitation of old Gordo singing "Maggie May".
Best,
Mark
| By brianday@cwcom.net (212.137.226.92) on Friday, April 18, 2003 - 06:40 am: |
i thought i would add something to this little subject , if it wasnot for some of these dreadful hits as you call them, some record labels would have closed, the money from them enabled other artistes to record , a point in question is "frederick knights "ive been lonely for so long" leased to stax from a local label,most of the major lance singles on volt "leased.
those one hit wonders opened up the northern soul scene chances of finding rarities ,with new recordings unlike today ,its all very safe and packaged products with very little variaty in the finished products, take bobby womack, one of usa biggest artistes ,never had any real success in the uk ,he had a greatest hits in the usa ,but was put out in the uk just as bobby womack.
i bet he woudnt have minded justin haveing some old dirgy pop hit establish him in the uk , just to open the uk market at the time.
| By StingBeeLee (155.139.68.10) on Friday, April 18, 2003 - 09:19 am: |
Yes, Sue, I also like WOMC's version of Gordon Lightfoot, who took himself way too seriously. Anne Murray, I agree her career took a detour after "Snowbird" but I thought she sang "Daydream Believer" with some conviction. The Grateful Dead is one band I never could get into. They were sometimes called "soulful", but I could never see it. Along with Creedance Clearwater Revival, who were called "New Orleans swamp soulsters". I can understand the swamp part, but they also did not seem to have that elusive quality called soul. Don't ask me what soul is, I know it when I hear it (at least I think I do).
| By john dixon (205.188.209.16) on Friday, April 18, 2003 - 11:42 am: |
Hey brianday, no one here has ever slammed great songs like Frederick Knight's "I've Been Lonely For So Long", one of the best Southern Soul ballads ever, or any of the wonderful Major Lance songs, especially the ones written for him by Curtis Mayfield. So I'm not sure what your beef is with this thread or even if you have a beef with this thread; it was hard to discern by the serious tone of your post. One thing is certain, this thread is anti-serious. In fact, the one hard fast rule is: Abandon ye all seriousness before entering the halls of errggh.
This song may be an easy target in its terribleness, but there should be a special errggh award for pond scum-level dreck that somehow gets elevated to national anthem status. Yes, I am referring to Lee Greenwood's "God Bless The U.S.A." How did this schmaltzy emotionally manipulative schlock-fest atttain this level of fame(or infamy)? I was dazed and confused when I read that recently in Houston a country audience turned on and beat up an audience member for not STANDING for this song! I was in country radio during the mid-80's when this record was a single and all of the jocks unanimously hated it even then because the song is a spewing fountain of dreck not because of any lack of love for our country. It's certainly been a boon for Lee Greenwood; he got a career bump (and was allowed to leave the city limits of Branson, Mo.) during the early 90's Gulf War conflict, once again after 9/11, and a third time now for the Iraqi conflict.
For me, there's two things that will never change: (1) I love my country and (2) I detest "God Bless The U.S.A."
| By KevGo (64.115.26.80) on Friday, April 18, 2003 - 12:00 pm: |
John Dixon:
Your brothers & sisters in AC radio hated "God Bless The USA" also. Fortunately, I found a way to drop the song from the rotation - the old "gotta make way for network news" trick worked all the time!
Kevin Goins - KevGo
| By douglasm (68.113.13.31) on Friday, April 18, 2003 - 04:15 pm: |
I believe I refered to the war in Iraq as "The Lee Greenwood Reemployment Act Of 2003" once.
Why was it a hit? It's country oriented, and (especially) old country artists tended to have things red white and blue other than necks, socks and beer. A couple of examples being Haggard's "Fightin' Side Of Me", and one whose artist I don't remember,"Where Have All The Heros Gone", sort of a serious "What Ever Happened To Randolph Scott". I think they're the conservative answer to "Give A Damn" or "Better Man Than I", both equally schlocky "liberal" songs.
| By Larry (216.23.183.2) on Friday, April 18, 2003 - 05:12 pm: |
You guys got me real curious about Greenwood. Like forcing yourself to look at the car accident. I can't wait to download that dreck.
| By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Friday, April 18, 2003 - 05:20 pm: |
OK...time to take the bull by the horns and begin new thread...ERRGH TO THE RESCUE PART 2....JIM YOU JUST BUILD THEM WAY TOO GOOD. THIS THREAD IS CLOSED..CLOSED...CLOSED...CLOSED...CLOSED...