By Patrick (68.21.41.233) on Wednesday, March 12, 2003 - 08:09 pm:

Is there anybody here besides me that is tired of the White Stripes? I did like them, but they are becoming so "last year." What is so special about them? They can hardly play their instruments, yet the "hipsters" of the area seem to love them. That whole "garage" thing is being burned and sold at such a fast rate. All these bands keep popping up with that "garage" sound, yet they sound like shit.

"Has Elvis left the parking lot?"

By Eli (151.197.37.150) on Wednesday, March 12, 2003 - 10:02 pm:

Forgive my ignorance, but who are the White Stripes???

By LQNN (64.12.97.7) on Wednesday, March 12, 2003 - 10:47 pm:

thank you La QUan!!
I thought that too, but I know I don't know as much as many do here...so I figured someone would ask that..

By encog (206.148.225.174) on Wednesday, March 12, 2003 - 10:56 pm:

Here's a pretty decent glance at this Detroit-born/based duo:

http://www.drownedinsound.com/bands/1159.html

And the band's site:

http://www.whitestripes.com/

With a distinctively gritty �garage-rock� sound, the White Stripes� gimmicks, if you will, include a red/white peppermint color scheme, as well as an ongoing "controversy" over whether they are bro/sis or ex-husband/wife. I recall a website that went so far as to produce what was apparently their marriage license. �Dead Leaves and the Dirty Ground� was their first big song to hit the airwaves, and �Seven Nation Army� is currently receiving 89X airtime.

By Eli (151.197.37.150) on Wednesday, March 12, 2003 - 11:08 pm:

who cares!!!
It has no connection to what our forum is about...r&b and soul music.

By Curious (64.12.97.7) on Wednesday, March 12, 2003 - 11:11 pm:

Or Fat Singers!!

By encog (206.148.225.174) on Wednesday, March 12, 2003 - 11:14 pm:

This is very true, and I considered it myself. My apologies, just answering a question.

By RD (63.188.33.141) on Wednesday, March 12, 2003 - 11:23 pm:

I've never heard of any White Stripes.

By Ritchie (62.254.0.9) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 04:50 am:

Whoever they are, they just received a load of (unwarranted?) publicity through this forum. From the description, they sound exactly like the kind of outfit that I studiously AVOID - so no sales generated in this quarter.

By john dixon (63.101.17.207) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 06:33 am:

I don't mind admitting that I'm a fan of the White Stripes. In a world where, as a rock and roll fan, there's not much on the contemporary scene to be excited about, Jack and Meg White are a breath of fresh air.
Granted, their music is not something I can listen to all the time; the limitations of their sound, just guitar, voice, and drums, makes for such a raw ruckus. But sometimes I'm in the mood for just that; hey, it beats kenny g or smooth jazz! I'm glad that I still like it loud and raw sometimes; I'm not quite ready for the old rockin' chair just yet!

Personally I'm glad that the media perpetuated 'garage revival' hasn't resulted in mega sales. Minimalism too often just means incompetent. Jack White, on the other hand, is the real deal, I think. Any guy that young who cares about old blues enought to record a version of Son House's "Death Letter" is ok in my book.

I fully understand,however,that garage rock and roll might not be considered valid music by the majority on a soul/r&b forum. That's fine, I never would have brought them up. But they are from Detroit and they are one of the most exciting and charismatic live acts that I've ever seen, so I have no reservation about defending them here or anywhere else. Peace y'all.

By Livonia Ken (136.1.1.154) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 09:20 am:

Actually, their media profile has dropped about 99% in the last few months, even in the Detroit area, so I never really reached the saturation level to want to join a backlash.

On another note, Bobby is essentially right, but I wish there were a few more modern Detroit acts that did have a connection to our forum.

Regards,
Ken

By Sue (64.12.97.7) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 09:21 am:

John --

Agreed. The White Stripes describe themselves as playing "blues" -- this may not fit your description or mine, but they are very influenced by blues. Jack White just told the NY Times that he bemoans the "death of the sweetheart" -- by that he means the fact that so many young people think they have to act like thugs, instead of romantics.

That's something any fan of soul can identify with -- we all remember when music expressed more love, and less hate and macho posturing.

Jack is also intensely committed to "old school" type recording, he wants that warm old-fashioned sound (do I hear Mike stirring?). That's an interesting discussion as well.

In fact, talking about the blues roots of a new, wildly popular Detroit band is actually fun and intellectually stimulating. It's a little deeper than talking about fat singers and um, excrement.

By mc5rules (148.61.97.30) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 09:29 am:

And by the way, the Stripes' new album "Elephant" is awesome. They've stretched out a little bit, although it's still gritty and raw. I think Jack White is a great songwriter -- he's got a very inventive way with lyrics. His guitar playing is solid, despite its lo-fi nature, and his singing is nothing if not emotional. Meg's drumming I'm not so hot on, but she's gorgeous, so that's got to count for something...in fact, that's part of the reason why they've gotten so much notice. It's a very attractive package.

By Sue (64.12.97.7) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 09:37 am:

p.s. The Elevations, who're playing the Pure Detroit free party tonight at the Fisher Building, are a current Detroit soul band with horn section.

Worth checking out. More interesting than "hairdos." Bring back ERRRGH!, then we have all the silliness concentrated in one thread.

By mc5rules (148.61.97.30) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 09:53 am:

I just re-read my post, and it comes off way more sexist than I meant it to. I don't mean to refer to Meg as "an attractive package." I meant to call the whole operation an attractive package. My wife and some of her lady friends think Jack White is just as hot as I think Meg is. They're good looking kids, and the whole red-and-white thing is pretty good shtick. It looks way cooler than tie-dye, that's for sure!

By encog (206.148.224.158) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 09:57 am:

The point that the White Stripes� sound carries marks of blues/soul influence has been well made, and is a fact that I admittedly neglected to mention earlier. My initial review of the Stripes focused more on their image than their music, and although this too is an arguably large portion of their reputation, I certainly see how it seemed �unwarranted� in regards to the R&B/blues/jazz-related content of this forum.

As John Dixon mentioned, the Stripes� gritty cover of Son House�s �Death Letter� stands out as a testament to their blues influence. A Music.com article from back in April 2001 noted that Son House�s �Father of the Delta Blues: The Complete 1965 Sessions� was the divine inspiration for Jack White, who said, �There was nothing glamorous about it - just pure sound, pure emotion. It didn't need anything else attached to it. It didn't need five other guys playing the exact same thing behind it. Just a guy and a guitar.� I am a newcomer to the Detroit jazz/blues scene, but one of the first images that popped into my mind at this comment was country/urban blues legend John Lee Hooker. There�s certainly something about that raw, bare-boned, scratchy-quality sound that the Stripes have been able to capture, both in their own songs and other covers including Robert Johnson�s �Stop Breaking Down� and even Bob Dylan�s �One More Cup of Coffee.�

I know that others� knowledge of this band and its influences is far greater than my own, so I will leave the rest of the explaining to them. However, in regards to other recent blues acts, I have to vouch for a one-man band that goes by the name �Jawbone.� Equipped with his harmonica, guitar, drum and growling vocals, this young guy�s country/blues style is an amazing throwback to earlier urban grit. I�d definitely be interested in hearing more about him and any other Detroit-area blues-bands that have been emerging as of late.

By Fury13 (12.2.196.17) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 11:25 am:

I don't really "get" the White Stripes. To me, their sound is thin (they have no bass), their proficiency on their instruments seems amateurish (and, unfortunately, their energy/attitude doesn't seem to offset that for me), and I don't like Jack White's voice much. Oh yeah, and I think Meg is just average looking, too.

Some make the argument that the White Stripes are fun. I don't know, I think they're a little contrived. The Ramones WERE fun, and they did the whole back-to-the-basics-high-energy-with-simple-songs gig 25 years ago.

I think other bands in the same vein (say, the Strokes or the Vines) do the neo-garage-rock thing better than the White Stripes. With only two instruments and average talent, maybe the Stripes are better described as amped-up folkies.

By Lynn Bruce (65.60.202.214) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 11:31 am:

Did you ever hear that bit about"I wonder why they never hit it big time,they're better than so and so". With talent being a given,then it's being in the right place at the right time and just plain luck!!!

By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 11:34 am:

I agree Fury, I'm a little too spoiled by Funk Brothers competence to have much patience for groups who can barely play their instruments. Meg's drum technique is ridiculous.

But I still enjoy discussing those who are influenced by great music ...

By Conrad72 (63.97.240.1) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 12:06 pm:

No bass = bad bad bad...

I played a show (in Atlanta last summer) with a cool band called Detroit Cobras who do garage-y versions of obscure (well, to us 30 & unders) R&B/Soul tunes. The singer Rachael is a great performer and former Black Crowes keyboardist Ed plays bass. I wish they could get some of that garage-band hype.

By mhc (172.137.68.40) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 12:18 pm:

NO.

By Conrad72 (63.97.240.1) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 12:45 pm:

MHC, are you not tired of the White Stripes, or are you saying NO to my post? Just curious...and oops I lied about my age. I'm 31.

By jim, liking the white stripes (198.109.32.13) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 01:03 pm:

The Cobras are fantastic and put on great live shows.

Not seeing how being bass less is bad-to each their own.

encog if you are lurking, check your email.

By mc5rules (148.61.97.30) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 01:13 pm:

Don't be confused by the fact that jack likes to play cheap Airline guitars. I find his playing anything but amateurish -- his solos are bold and exciting. The whole thing really is about Jack. I'm excited to watch him grow as an artist, and I hope someday he'll let go of the shtick.

By Sue (63.85.105.20) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 01:22 pm:

The Detroit Cobras have done some cool old soul covers; they did "Village of Love" and others. Just gave the CD (just issued in Britain) a spin and liked it a lot. They've been on tour in the U.K. for the last month ...

By Fury13 (12.2.196.17) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 01:57 pm:

Jim... bass-less is bad, in my opinion, because, as I said, the Stripes' sound is thin.

I like what I've heard from the Detroit Cobras.

By jim (198.109.32.13) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 02:42 pm:

Fury13, if you haven't listened to the Cobras "Life, Love, and Leaving" or "Mink, Rat, or Rabbit". Do so, both are excellent. "I'll Keep Holding On" and "Midnight Blues" are by far my favorite off the first album. Excellent versions of "Oh My Lover" and "Shout Bama Lama" on the second.

I don't find the White Stripes sound thin, certainly not a "wall of sound" from a Phil Spector recording, and there are two songs with bass. An upright on, I might have the track mixed up, "I'm Bound to Pack It Up" off De Stijl and on "Seven Nation Army" the bass comes from an octave guitar.

The White Stripes have excellent covers of "Jolene", "Lovesick", and "Just Don't Know What To Do With Myself", among others.

As long as we are on topic of current Detroit bands. The Gore Gore Girls are playing in the Fisher Building at 10:00 PM. Very fun band.

By Horse (68.61.77.137) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 04:15 pm:

agree with Marchall.....NO...!
I my humble opinion thier not happening.

And MC5Rule, If the drummer's not so hot, then that means they ain't shit. If you don't have a strong foundation, you don't have anything.

Remember...A band is only as good as their weakest member. I think the band has received more than enough promo here. And I think they're just another example of why the music is in the shape it is. Regardless if they're from Detroit or not. I won't even mention the Bass player issue. And yes...all this has been in my humble opinion.

Eli,

The reason you don't know of them is because they're not happening..! Don't sweat it your not missing a thing.

By Horse (68.61.77.137) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 04:16 pm:

Sorry for the mispell MARSHALL

By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 05:09 pm:

Horse, I gotta say pal. you're talking like a true musician.

By Eli (151.197.38.28) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 05:13 pm:

As I have stated previously, this forum is dedicated to r&b music of the Northern variety, Dertoit R&B variety and Philly R&B variety and all music that is SOUL!!That does not include these.. these..White Sripe fellas!!

By Horse (68.61.77.137) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 05:37 pm:

Thanks Ralph,

It's the only way we're gonna bring it back around to great music. DEVIDE (the garbage from the goods) AND CONNQUER. Our young will never know if we don't teach & guide them.

By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 05:43 pm:

You're preaching to the choir here Horse.

By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 05:44 pm:

Easy Bobby or you'll get the attention of Paulie 3 Shoes.

By Horse (68.61.77.137) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 05:56 pm:

Ralph,

Yeah I Know, but I'll preach to anyone who'll listen..! Maybe Someone will ask why or how, and the conquer will begin..!

By mc5rules (148.61.97.30) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 05:56 pm:

yawn

By Horse (68.61.77.137) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 06:29 pm:

mc5rules,

try a nap..!

By john dixon (205.188.209.38) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 06:53 pm:

horse, as far as I'm concerned, your defense today of Michael Bolton on another thread just rendered your criticism of the White Stripes here NULL and VOID.

By Millie (68.40.209.129) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 07:37 pm:

I think the White Stripes are brilliant! Not only do they do "self promotion" better than anyone (other than Madonna), WITHOUT THE BENEFIT OF RADIO AIRPLAY, they've been mentioned in Time Magazine, they've been on late night television, they are HUGE in Europe. Let's give credit where credit's due...they've come a long way from the Gold Dollar.

By mhc (172.138.171.34) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 08:00 pm:

Horse, I should've been more clear; I meant "No, I'm not sick of the White Stripes". I think they're great. But I agree that the person who started this thread is on the wrong forum.

By encog (65.29.118.180) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 08:07 pm:

Oh, I think I smell a rat.

By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 08:09 pm:

Judging by the length of this thread, I think Stripes is on the RIGHT forum. I've always maintained that there are more music smarts around here than only things realting to R&B. And I will always maintain that if it has anything to do with music, this is the place to come.

By Horse (68.61.77.137) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 11:13 pm:

John Dixon,

You have graduated to last place on my list of valid authorities of this forum. Maybe you can fill in as a guest judge on American Idol with the rest of those clowns..! (excluding Lamont). Expect a Michael Bolton Best Of Christmas CD this year..!

By Sue (205.188.209.38) on Thursday, March 13, 2003 - 11:22 pm:

Horse,
I'd feel better about it if you'd listen to the White Stripes ...THEN dismiss them if you must.

By john dixon (63.101.17.207) on Friday, March 14, 2003 - 06:41 am:

horse, I was going to keep my remarkably identical assessment of your critical faculties to myself but you had to stoop to name calling so....if you seriously believe Michael'ass-hat'Bolton makes good music and the White Stripes are "the reason music is in the shape it's in" today, there's nothing I can say to dent your skewed perspective except that, if you somehow feel it's your mission to "DEVIDE and CONNQUER" ( ! ) the good from the bad for the benefit of future generations, I suggest you start in your own backyard. :o)

By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Friday, March 14, 2003 - 09:23 am:

Michael " ass hat " Bolton John? That's very funny!

By john dixon (152.163.188.68) on Friday, March 14, 2003 - 09:29 am:

Ralph, that's a direct cop from the movie "Office Space". Hilarious movie; you should rent it.

By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Friday, March 14, 2003 - 09:36 am:

John. I was about to add that I didn't have a clue what ass hat meant but it did hit me funny. I'll have to check out the movie.

By john dixon (152.163.188.68) on Friday, March 14, 2003 - 09:49 am:

same here, Ralph, it doesn't really make sense; it just sounds funny. Anyway, there's a character in "Office Space" named Michael Bolton who goes into fits of apoplexy whenever he is introduced to someone and they invariably go "Hey! Michael Bolton. Are you related to the singer?"

It's a Mike Judge movie, of "King Of The Hill/Beavis And Butthead" fame.

of course, horse might not see the humor....

By SisDetroit (68.42.209.170) on Sunday, March 16, 2003 - 04:58 pm:

White Stripes - On Sale Friday, March 14 at 5:00 p.m. Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - Masonic Temple

Prior to this thread, I had never heard of the White Stripes.

By Way off Topic Livonia Ken (165.121.212.207) on Sunday, March 16, 2003 - 09:23 pm:

My favorite line from Office Space is when the efficiency experts say to the main character "We notice you've been missing a lot of work lately" and he responds with "Well, I wouldn't exactly say 'missing'".

We now return you to your regular discussion.

Regards,
Ken

By matt (208.130.56.167) on Monday, March 17, 2003 - 04:33 pm:

other great current detroit bands who do DETROIT SOUL covers and are thus appropriate for discussion on this forum:

the come ons. they do blistering versions of belita woods's "grounded" and alvin cash's "twine time," as well as a heap of great originals.

the dirtbombs. their most recent album was all covers, including marvin gaye ("got to give it up"), smokey robinson ("if you can want"), j.j barnes ("chains of love"), and stevie wonder ("living for the city").

check them out.

matt

By radiogoon (206.148.224.54) on Friday, April 04, 2003 - 02:58 am:

Stripes rawk.
Jack and Meg used to be married, not siblings, that's part of the promoing.
Meg was a bartender at Memphis Smoke (thats when I met her....nice woman)
I apologize, but I support ANYTHING coming out of Detroit that hits.

Lord I do so love this town.

Dr. Z

By Ralph (209.240.198.62) on Friday, April 04, 2003 - 09:41 am:

I see where this month's Rolling Stone gave them rave reviews.

By Livonia Ken (136.1.1.33) on Friday, April 04, 2003 - 03:39 pm:

Here's an interesting article that talks a little bit about how they recorded their latest album with vintage gear:

http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1470909/20030401/white_stripes.jhtml

There are a few liberties taken with the dates. The "Toe Rag" studio is certainly a throw-back, but there is no way that their 8-track machine was made prior to 1963.

They sent review copies out on vinyl, ostensibly to try to reduce piracy, although mp3s of vinyl transfers hit the web pretty darn fast anyway.

Regards,
Ken

By stephanie (64.63.221.137) on Friday, April 04, 2003 - 05:00 pm:

I have never heard of the White Stripes but I guess they are doing something right....LOL
Stephanie

By Millie (68.40.209.129) on Friday, April 04, 2003 - 05:13 pm:

Their new LP, "Elephant" is fabulous! The White Stripes will be larger than life...wait and see.

By Eric/C. Bell (67.25.212.81) on Friday, April 04, 2003 - 06:15 pm:

Millie had a good point when she said that The White Stripes have came a long way since The Gold Dollar. I can remember seeing The White Stripes when there were about 5 people in the whole joint. I'm very happy about all their success and the doors that they have opened up for a lot of other bands.

I made a tape for Jason from The Von Bondies and he mentioned that The Detroit Cobras used to cover the song by Dusty Wilson "Can't Do Without You".

The Hentchmen are still my favorite local band!!!

By TD (68.70.126.246) on Saturday, April 05, 2003 - 01:33 am:

Interesting thread, I had bought Elephant- based on the Rolling Stone article, and I have to agree it is excellent. Well done.
If were talking about different music on this thread. I would highly reccommend that you all purchase the Flaming Lips- Yoshima Battles the Pink Robots. By far the best CD of 2002. It a cross of Pink Floyd and ELO.
Outstanding. They also won a Grammy for best instrumental.

TD

TD