By Ralph (209.240.222.130 - 209.240.222.130) on Saturday, June 29, 2002 - 11:06 pm: |
Hmmmm.....my first try didn't seem to appear. Try this. As I had mentioned on the non-appearing thread change, I'm sure this will be an on-going thread with these great musicians.
By Allan Slutsky (205.188.200.42 - 205.188.200.42) on Sunday, June 30, 2002 - 02:17 pm: |
I tried to talk Mike Terry (on numerous occasions) into getting his saxophone chops back. We had hoped to use him in the movie as well as in whatever followed in it's wake but he really didn't have much interest in pursuing it. He said it had been too long for him to get his chops back. The offer is still there Mike. You're welcome anytime.
CLÑI want to address what you said regarding who is a Funk Brother. Technically, you're correct. The name was originally given to the small unit that Earl had playing the clubs. That was Jamerson, Robert White, Earl, and Uriel Jones. It originally had nothing to do with Motown. It was about the club ensemble.
Benny actually came up with the name but he wasn't one of them. He was referring to the four guys I just mentioned. They rarely used Benny in the clubs because he was too undependable due to his various addictions.
Eventually the name filtered into the studio and began to refer to the inner core of Rhythm section players who were also movers and shakers on the same level. While Earl Van Dyke seems to be the central focus, he was actually preceeded (by as much as three years in some cases) by Joe Messina, Joe Hunter, Eddie Willis, Johnny Griffith. He didn't come into Motown until '62.
As Motown's first bandleader (even though he was gone by the end of '63), Joe Hunter brought in many of the key members of the Funk Brothers. Messina, Griffith, and some of the early guys absolutely played on as much as the more celebrated, "hard core" four guys. Earl, Jamerson, Robert, and Uriel. Those four just got more attention because they were in the studio and the clubs whereas Eddie Willis, Griffith, Messina, and the other guys were off doing different club work.
The beauty of the Motown sound�and what differntiates it from the rest of the other soul label's house bands was the sheer size of the ensemble. On most records, there were two and sometimes three guys on every chair. For instance in Memphis, for the most part, you basically had one guitar, one drummer, one bass, one keyboard. At Motown there was always 2 to 3 guitars, 2 keyboards, often two percussionists, and sometimes even two bassists and two drummers.
Ironically, one of the reasons we were still able to capture the Motown Sound when we did the film was that one guy died from each chair. We still have two of the three guitarists, two of the three drummers, two of the three keyboardists, etc.
By Gabriele (212.171.164.231 - 212.171.164.231) on Sunday, June 30, 2002 - 02:37 pm: |
I read on the movie's website in the Funk Brothers page that Earl Van Dyke used to say"Joe Messina never blew a backbeat".What does it means?
By soulboy (213.105.242.198 - 213.105.242.198) on Sunday, June 30, 2002 - 03:06 pm: |
ALLAN
I agree with the point you made about the sheer size of the band, i think this diversity was ONE of the reasons that were succesful long term in a way that other similar oufits could not match.
There were people in the 'snakepit' who for whatever reason, left in the early day's of Motown's success, and on the other hand you had Dennis Coffey,Bob Babbit and Andrew Smith who joined later on. The whole band was an ongoing concern,so i don't believe any one who can say it was just Benny,Earl and James Jamerson who deserve the credit.
By soulboy (213.105.242.198 - 213.105.242.198) on Sunday, June 30, 2002 - 03:14 pm: |
Gabrielle
I think never 'Blew' meant he never failed a backbeat, through bad timing or not sounding 'clean'.
By john lester (213.1.131.179 - 213.1.131.179) on Sunday, June 30, 2002 - 03:28 pm: |
I think I have to admit that when I refer to the Funk Brothers, I don't mean the core group of 4 musicians that you stated above.
I mean ALL of them, they are all part of the music I love and cherish and I would do anything to hear more of them...
In my books, whether its EVD, James, Robert, Uriel or Joe Hunter, Hank, Dennis, Bob, Pistol, Joe Messina, Eddie, Wah Wah....those are the guys I am referring to. Funk Bros is just a reference that is simply to write than for me mention all those names. Each one, and more, lays the foundation for my passion in life
By SisDetroit (67.25.211.198 - 67.25.211.198) on Sunday, June 30, 2002 - 04:29 pm: |
JL - Absolutely!! Well said.
Sis
By Bob Olhsson (68.32.101.228 - 68.32.101.228) on Sunday, June 30, 2002 - 09:23 pm: |
Motown was a very different situation than Stax.
Large rhythm sections of jazz players making pop music recordings had been a fixture in New York, Chicago, Nashville and Los Angeles beginning in the early 1950s. Having recorded in both New York and Chicago, Berry Gordy knew that the Detroit jazz community could provide a comparable level of session players. While there were groups signed to Motown from almost the very beginning, BG still hired the finest players available in Detroit for his recording sessions.
Stax, on the other hand, was originally built around a couple small combos who were also artists signed to the label. As the original groups moved on with their careers, Stax also began using the Detroit session musicians.
By cl (204.38.7.35 - 204.38.7.35) on Monday, July 01, 2002 - 02:39 pm: |
Hey all, I was wrong!! Categorically! I am sorry and hope you will forgive me.
I acquiece(sp) to those more knowledgeable than I. Because as someone in a previous post said technically I am correct.......but technically be damned!! Pistol, Uriel , Mr. Ashford, et,al are most definitely and thoroughly funk bros!!!
Lastly thanks for the tactful way you all handled my arrogance!!........cl
By Ralph Terrana (Ralph) (209.240.222.130 - 209.240.222.130) on Monday, July 01, 2002 - 02:44 pm: |
CL,
No problem. The people on this forum are sharp. They've caught me on a couple of thngs in the past and I was IN the Detroit music crowd.