By ErikT.O. (64.228.108.188 - 64.228.108.188) on Monday, April 08, 2002 - 06:42 am:

I was at a record show Saturday & got a few neato items. One was a Temptations lp 'Gettin Ready'on the 'Large World' label from some Asian country, I know Japan is the most obvious guess but there's no mention (in English) of any country of origin. It's on orange vinyl. I was wandering where this album's from, and I noticed on the back cover there were some interesting looking Motown lp's I've never seen anywhere being advertised- 'Jazz Soul' by Stevie Wonder and more intriguingly, 'Earl Van Dyke & The Soul Brothers' lp 'That Motown Sound'- is this on cd?? Since I've never seen this, I can only assume it wasn't a big seller & is probably rare- is it instrumental? What year?
Now my Jackson 5 question- a while ago I was in a record store and the guy threw on a truely pounding version of 'ABC' which sounded live. Unfortunately some records in his shop cost many hundreds of dollars so I didn't even bother asking about the album- then yesterday I got 'Stand' which I'd never seen before either. It sounds sort of live, but maybe from a t.v. show? One song, 'The Day Basketball Was Saved' sure doesn't sound live, but there's some heavy playing including live sounding versions of 'Stand/ Higher', 'Feelin Alright', a sloppily cut 'medley' of 'Walk On By' (called 'Walk On', but it sure sounds like the Isaac Hayes arrangement to me!) and 'The Love You Save'. Is this lp live? From a concert or a tv show? I've read about many 'live' albums having not been recorded live at all, this one sounds live save for the basketball number. Who's playing on here? Does anyone know the big fat live sounding version of 'ABC' I referred to and is this easy enough to find? Thanks for any help... and... I'm going back to Detroit next week end! Any live venue recommendations? Rekkid stores? There's one I plan to visit but if anyone has any advice... /Erik

By john lester (213.122.203.225 - 213.122.203.225) on Monday, April 08, 2002 - 08:10 am:

Erik

That album is
Original TV soundtrack "Goin' Back To Indiana!

Motown 742

It was not issued in the UK.

The DAy That Basketball was saved is a brilliant song with Bill Cosby in it as Scoop Newsworthy. I used to laugh at that.

By Ritchie (62.254.0.6 - 62.254.0.6) on Monday, April 08, 2002 - 08:46 am:

Hi Erik

Surprised JL didn't answer on the Earl Van Dyke question, so I will...

The album is indeed an instrumental set, with the Earl of Funk's keys overdubbed on a set of Hitsville rhythm tracks. According to an interview I have read, he wasn't too happy with it. I don't believe the album has been reissued on a legitimate CD, though there was a Marginal (notorious Belgian bootleg label) which coupled it with the Choker Campbell album. Yes, I do have that CD, and was pleasantly surprised to find that Earl's album is in full stereo. ALL FOR YOU in stereo - fantastic!

By david, glasgow, scotland (213.122.8.89 - 213.122.8.89) on Monday, April 08, 2002 - 09:01 am:

i have the album.

By Rich (162.33.234.188 - 162.33.234.188) on Monday, April 08, 2002 - 05:12 pm:

Then you have a Classic Gatefold jacket. I remember watching the TV special as a kid. The J5 was hoopin' it up against Bill Russell & Rosie Greer (who actually played football) and some others while the Cos was runnin 'around as "Scoop Newsworthy" trying to get the poop on the Jacksons. No matching dinner jax & ties for the bruhs, those outfits were Funkadelic for sure. I'll have to go back and play the live side. Say whay you will about the group, they made some great music throughout their entire time at Motown. The music that was included on Skywriter, Get it Together, Dancin Machine & Moving Violation was absolutely great in both songs & performance. The sound is more like late 60's early 70's Temptations or even Undisputed Truth albums than ABC. Again a heavy Detroit Funkadelic influence. When P-Funk went into the Hall-of-fame Michael Jackson was in the wings just bursting to come on stage but GC wouldn't have it. Billy Bass was the only one from P-Funk who even bothered to go over to the Motown table and say hello at the dinner. Which might be just as well, GC's body odor is nothing short of legendary having caused problems on flights and in other places not accustomed to such heavy funk, such as the H-O-F.

By john lester (213.1.135.44 - 213.1.135.44) on Monday, April 08, 2002 - 06:53 pm:

Sorry I missed that Ritchie...

Must be old age

By harryweinger (12.110.192.128 - 12.110.192.128) on Monday, April 08, 2002 - 08:17 pm:

Goin' Back To Indiana was a soundtrack to an ABC-TV special. The side with 'Basketball' is from the TV show. The rest of the music from that side was live-in-the-studio, as they are playing in what is presented as a J-5 rehearsal. Side two is from an actual live homecoming concert, in Gary, Indiana. Great stuff. The recent CD reissue (a two-fer with Lookin' Through The Windows) has an extra track from the show as a bonus.

By Ian W (213.122.31.80 - 213.122.31.80) on Monday, April 08, 2002 - 10:24 pm:

Earl Van Dyke had a second album in 1970 called 'The Earl Of Funk'. I don't know if he was any more satisfied with that album than the earlier one. it contains (unfortunately) such gems as 'Wichita Lineman' and 'Na Na Hey Hey Kiss Him Goodbye'. I think George Benson had a few solos on the album.

Where did all the stuff like 'I Can't Help Myself' and 'Runaway Child Running Wild' go?

By ErikT.O. (64.228.114.140 - 64.228.114.140) on Tuesday, April 09, 2002 - 05:20 pm:

Thanks everybody! I should have mentioned perhaps that the J5 lp I got was a Pickwick reissue and as such made Motown releases look as detailed as CTI releases with respect to who's playing what... who was in the Jackson 5's touring band? Any of Soulful Detroit's esteemed regulars? Anyone know which live sounding version of ABC I might have heard which isn't on here but sounds like it could have been?

By brianday@cwcom.net (212.137.226.110 - 212.137.226.110) on Tuesday, April 09, 2002 - 07:47 pm:

hi all back from my hols ,i have never heard a chocker cambell lp or cd ,if he was on cd ,whats its matrix number ,country of origin etc also
what instrument does he play ? sorry for being such a ignorant ,but you learn something all the time

By brianday@cwcom.net (212.137.226.110 - 212.137.226.110) on Tuesday, April 09, 2002 - 07:47 pm:

hi all back from my hols ,i have never heard a chocker cambell lp or cd ,if he was on cd ,whats its matrix number ,country of origin etc also
what instrument does he play ? sorry for being such a ignorant ,but you learn something all the time

By Ritchie (62.254.0.6 - 62.254.0.6) on Tuesday, April 09, 2002 - 08:14 pm:

Hi Brian

Choker Campbell was a tenor sax player, who I believe led one of Motown's on-the-road bands. His album "Hits Of The Sixties" Motown #620 featured Big Band arrangements of Motown tunes. His best known track is probably his cut of Come See About Me. (There's an alternate take of this on one of the Marginal CDs, complete with bum notes!)

By brianday@cwcom.net (212.137.220.180 - 212.137.220.180) on Tuesday, April 09, 2002 - 08:50 pm:

what is a marginal cd?

By Ritchie (62.254.0.6 - 62.254.0.6) on Tuesday, April 09, 2002 - 09:00 pm:

These were unauthorised bootlegs which originated in Belgium. Check out these pages for some background info:

http://www.ritchie-hardin.com/soul/bootlegs.html
http://www.ritchie-hardin.com/oddcats/barcd00.html
http://www.ritchie-hardin.com/soul/marcd0.html

By brianday@cwcom.net (212.137.220.180 - 212.137.220.180) on Tuesday, April 09, 2002 - 09:01 pm:

hi rich
thanks for that

By brianday@cwcom.net (212.137.220.180 - 212.137.220.180) on Tuesday, April 09, 2002 - 09:23 pm:

rich just been to your site ,like it a lot ,i spotted in a dj box simmilar cds but they were white and contained tracks like funk brother outtakes ,alternative versions ,all quite illigal
of course ,but will never be realeased as some were just snippets ,only of interest to us soulites ,i tryed to get him to swop with me but he wanted my japanese sam dees cd ,NO WAY as iam
a big sam dees fan ,i hope they release the rca masters on him ,now they have released the wilson pickett masters also the other artist
iam waiting to see on cd is charles drain ,there is a invictus connection there as i believe the album was produced by micheal lovesmith

By Ritchie (62.254.0.6 - 62.254.0.6) on Tuesday, April 09, 2002 - 09:40 pm:

Brian - thanks. There are a lot of doubtful recordings about - well, recordings of doubtful origin, as as the use of CR-burners increases, no doubt more will circulate.

Serious soul-heads listening to bootlegs? Perish the idea! ;o)

By Ritchie (62.254.0.6 - 62.254.0.6) on Tuesday, April 09, 2002 - 09:57 pm:

Guys - would you believe it..?!
I've just had two emails (from Forum "lurkers"?) trying to order Marginal CDs from me!

By Ian W (62.6.90.147 - 62.6.90.147) on Tuesday, April 09, 2002 - 10:12 pm:

Ritchie & John

One of those dubious cds had a track 'Mother You Smother You' by Christine Schumacher singing with the Supremes. I know Christine won a local competition with a first prize of singing with those delightful ladies but did the record get released, maybe as a demo or something? If so, (it must exist in some format to get issued on the cd), how much do they go for? I'd love to have a copy!

By Ritchie (62.254.0.6 - 62.254.0.6) on Tuesday, April 09, 2002 - 10:15 pm:

Ian - just wondering... have you actually heard it?

By bobby lewis (68.41.176.6 - 68.41.176.6) on Wednesday, April 10, 2002 - 01:35 am:

hi all
i just looked into this page and had to add my
two cents worth. my good friend frank fisher,
was their sound man on the road in the 70s.he
took me to the jackson 5s house and gave me the tour.
they had an in house studio to play around with.
and a cool dance studio where they worked out
their routines. also choker campbell was a
bandleader who conducted the 18 piece band
called the choker campbell band featuring
earl van dyke on organ. that band backed the motown christmas shows at the fox theatre
in detroit during the 60s. the band i was in,
the headliners, did the show in 64 and 65.one incident i remember in particular,as the show was finishing, the orchestra was being lowered into
the pit. some idiot threw a cherry bomb into
the pit and the band just fell apart. not exactly
what berry was hoping for. well thats my little
tidbit. thanks for listening.

By John Lester (213.122.199.77 - 213.122.199.77) on Wednesday, April 10, 2002 - 06:16 am:

Thank you Bobby for that. I am not sure what a "cherry bomb" is exactly but I get the drift of what you are saying.

Christine Schumacher.....now what follows originated from Scott Regen. There was a competition on the radio...the winner got to sing a song with the Supremes....the radio listeners had to choose...it was whittled down to three girls who did their stuff and Christine Schumacher was chosen as the winner. She was cut with what appears to be the band track with backing vocals for "Mother You Somether You". (Incidentally - it is THIS song that is in that Teen Town video where you see Gil Askey leading the count in with the Funk Bros and the Supremes).

The track was pressed up in limited quantities on the Motown label..same song both sides.

However, may I slide off on a tangent here please - there was another song that Detroit radio apparently used although the song was never issued (and still isn't). La Brenda Ben did a song called "In Twenty Words Or Less" and I meant to ask Scott about this song but forgot (I was just bowled over meeting the guy, to be honest). The word seems to be that listeners had to make up some slogan in less than twenty words and La Brenda Ben was singing that song in the background. It's a great song from 1964, i'ts a pity that it stayed in the can alongside some of her other recordings.

By Ian W (194.75.128.2 - 194.75.128.2) on Wednesday, April 10, 2002 - 06:55 am:

Ritchie

Hell no! ME listen to a bootleg cd? Is the recording not too good then? It's a pretty good song by the Supremes though!

By Ian W (194.75.128.2 - 194.75.128.2) on Wednesday, April 10, 2002 - 06:56 am:

John, does 'limited' mean 'rare as hens teeth' like 'Play It Cool, Stay In School'?

By Ritchie (62.254.0.6 - 62.254.0.6) on Wednesday, April 10, 2002 - 09:31 am:

Ian

(I should be careful with my comments... who knows...? Christine could be our next honoured guest here!)

With all due respect to Ms Schumacher (sp?), it sounds just like a vocal overdub - ie it sits on top of the rhythm track and bvos instead of being blended with them. She's in tune, has a sultry, breathy kinda voice - but to me it sounds like the calibre of performance that would get a genuine round of applause at a karaoke night, but not one that makes me say "wow! Sign her up!" (Sorry, Christine. JMHO)

By Ralph (209.240.222.130 - 209.240.222.130) on Wednesday, April 10, 2002 - 12:38 pm:

John Lester,
A cherry bomb is a powerful firecracker. Round and red with a green fuse...hence the name.

By Ritchie (62.254.0.6 - 62.254.0.6) on Wednesday, April 10, 2002 - 01:03 pm:

Thanks Ralph

I always assumed "Cherry Bomb" meant something like that... It's one of those "well-known" Americanisms we Brits hear, but have no experience of.

Like, for example... I remember wondering for years what "Dr Pepper" was. Now, I've actually tasted it, I prefer the days of blissful ignorance and anticipation!

By john lester (213.1.137.121 - 213.1.137.121) on Wednesday, April 10, 2002 - 07:26 pm:

Ralph.........thanks for that explanation......

Ian...not as rare as Brenda's "Play It Cool"

Ritchie.......yeah..definitely YEAH...once bitten twice shy...although I doubt Christine will find you here!!

By Ian W (213.122.76.209 - 213.122.76.209) on Wednesday, April 10, 2002 - 09:30 pm:

Gents

I thought a cherry bomb was an exhaust you saw fitted to Minis (car, not skirt ... oh I don't know though!).

Anyway 'I Care About Detroit' and 'Detroit Is Happening'!

By david, glasgow, scotland (62.252.128.5 - 62.252.128.5) on Wednesday, April 10, 2002 - 09:35 pm:

ian
have you ever heard the track 'i care about detroit'?

i often wonder what it's like.

is it early seventies?

By Ian W (213.122.189.134 - 213.122.189.134) on Wednesday, April 10, 2002 - 09:55 pm:

David

It's a great record, typical Smokey, definitely 60's - a midtempo item. I have it on a cassette somewhere that Rod Shard sold on his old record stall in Manchester. Looking at the old database, it was recorded 1967. I think it was made when there were riots in Detroit. There was the odd riot recently in Burnley, but no-one cared to tinkle the ivories - or play the piano either.

By john lester (213.122.197.22 - 213.122.197.22) on Wednesday, April 10, 2002 - 10:13 pm:

Ian!!!

LOLOLOL

you and Ritchie would make a great double act!!

By Ian W (194.75.128.2 - 194.75.128.2) on Thursday, April 11, 2002 - 06:53 am:

John, Hey I'm only the dummy to Ritchie's ventriloquistic act!